Great British Locomotives

[PhilJ W]

Hi All,

Just a quick thought regarding the review of the Black Five.

Due to today's Bank Holiday its possible that distribution of the next GBL release might be a day late.

Should this be the case I won't of course be able to post the review until Thursday morning. 

I post an update once I know if the release goes ahead on Wednesday.

Regards All

Do they have bank holidays in China?  Seriously though by now the next edition should be in the shops storeroom now, if not the one or two after that.

['CHARD]

I popped down ASDA for a bag of sugar earlier and amazingly returned with 1lb of Silver Spoon AND D9002 in its soft-focus ttGSYP.  

 

What fantastic value for a great starting-point.  She sits so low my other Type 5s look like they're on tip-toes.  Great spot.

[Dave47549]

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Edited October 2, 2021 by Dave47549
Removed pointless guff

[Dave47549]

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Edited October 2, 2021 by Dave47549
Removed pointless guff

[darrel]

Just got my copy it's very nice the lion and wheel crest on the tender could do with replacing I have transfers already.fingers crossed they will be the exact size so I don't need to repaint the tender. The lettering on the plates on the rear of the tender are very well done.

Silver wheels and buffers again yuk! Will look much better once I repaint them. And some overscale lamps on the front above the bufferbeam again that will be getting removed.only other minor thing is a seam line along the top of the loco that will file down easily enough. These are only minor points and will take less than half an hour to put right. (I hope) 

One good thing is unlike the other locos so far the tender is not full of coal it's about half full which makes it easy to add real coal on top of it. 

As I have said before I am not an expert on steam so I look forward to weatheringmans review. Meanwhile I'm off to Asda to get a few more.

Edited May 28, 2014 by darrel

[69843]

Right, the Black 5 is now on the list.

 

Thank goodness I can see the reviews well in advance. And yet again, this is an excellent, comprehensive view TWM.  It really helps with the go/no go decision for us modellers.

[cctransuk]

On that aspect there are a lot of cheap tender drive Black 5's out there at toy fairs - these older models had a much poorer bodyshell and tender than the GBL model so i'd suggest a possible route is to get one and graft the GBL parts onto the old Hornby chassis and tender drive - not perfect perhaps but it would give you a rather nice Black 5

 

Don't forget that the loco chassis of the tender-drive Black Five has a cut-out to take an X04 motor - or a five-pole equivalent. As supplied, the front chassis  / weight casting locates in this cut-out, but a hacksaw will soon make room for a motor!

 

Ultrascale also do 40:1 gearsets that will marry the motor to the loco rear axle.

 

I predict strong sales of tender-drive Black Fives, Ultrascale gears and five-pole X04-style motors.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

[Horsetan]

..... I have refered to 'the smokebox front' rather than 'smokebox door'.

This is because the model has gone badly wrong here.

The smokebox is the correct length from the front of the boiler to the line of rivets at the front edge of the smokebox - these rivets secure the smokebox ring of the real loco and the door itself sits on that ring.

On the GBL model the front of the smokebox has been made as a separate moulding aprox 2.5 mm thick that is fitted onto the end of the smokebox thus extending the length well past the previously mentioned rivet line.

This has resulted in the smokebox being that amount too long - this can be seen in a side on view where it can be seen that the smokebox extends forward of the drop in the footplate by the thickness of that front moulding.

The poor fit of the moulding also gives the model a very odd look at the front

 

.....a few more points regarding the prototype might not go amiss...

 

The Black 5's had several different types of boilers during their lives - these being built as the various batches progressed.

The GBL model is based on a loco with the 'long' firebox, the top feed on the front ring of the boiler and the dome on the rear ring.

Therefore if you are particular about such things and are going to repaint and/or renumber your Black 5 you will need to check that the number you wish to apply is of a loco with this style of boiler at the time you are modelling it.

 

The matter of the front of the smokebox is such a shame.....

 

Strangely enough, the extra 2.5mm in the smokebox would appear to (over-)assist a model of the Ivatt-modified, long-wheelbase Black 5s (e.g. the Caprotti engines, the sole Stephenson valve-geared 44767, and up to 20 Walschaerts engines), as the smokebox was extended by 4 inches (mostly behind the chimney position), meaning that you have about 1.2mm of material to shave off...

 

....I predict strong sales of tender-drive Black Fives, Ultrascale gears and five-pole X04-style motors.

 

I predict a riot.

Edited May 28, 2014 by Horsetan

[cctransuk]

Don't forget that the loco chassis of the tender-drive Black Five has a cut-out to take an X04 motor - or a five-pole equivalent. As supplied, the front chassis  / weight casting locates in this cut-out, but a hacksaw will soon make room for a motor!

 

Ultrascale also do 40:1 gearsets that will marry the motor to the loco rear axle.

 

I predict strong sales of tender-drive Black Fives, Ultrascale gears and five-pole X04-style motors.

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

 

PS - there are four Airfix 1001 / five pole X04s ending on Ebay today ...................(not mine)!

 

Go for it!

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

[Peter Kazmierczak]

Went into Wimborne this morning and there were three in WHS when I entered. Only one left on the display when I departed.....

 

Well it looks like a Black Five to me.

 

Pictures taken straight out the box.

 

Despite the shedcode (that looks to be 68A), 44781 spent all it's BR career in the NW of England. For the great majority of the time (1948-63) it was an Agecroft engine.

Edited May 28, 2014 by Western Sunset

[Horsetan]

There are certainly usable bits on it. The extra length of the smokebox door plug could be carefully sawn out, and then grafted into the Brassmasters resin body to make a correct boiler for the Ivatt LWB "5".

 

Think I'll have a scout round for a sample.

[Il Grifone]

I wasn't going to get one (that idea has flown out of the window!). The smokebox shouldn't be too difficult to correct and it's nice to see the return crank in the right place (on the LHS at least). unfortunately the connecting rod is too short and the cross head is almost at the rear of the slide bars, though the wheel cranks are near the top position. Of no importance if the model is to be motorised and a coat of muck will make it much less obvious for a static model. A pity the wheels have solid backs though.

 

The lion is a little anaemic, but again weathering will disguise that. The boiler band lining will be a bit more difficult to sort out however.

 

EDIT the post above arrived while I was writing and shows the other side. Unfortuately the return crank is wrong again. and what's that "London North Eastern Railway" and "Doncaster" on the tender? (or do they know something I don't?)

 

In BR days, the plates were picked out in white, leaving the L and S in black (Likewise G, L and E) - it fooled nobody!

Edited May 28, 2014 by Il Grifone

[Il Grifone]

Hi,

A secret batch of Mr Stanier's locos built at Doncaster perhaps?. Could explain that attempt at 'streamlining' the front of the smokebox.

Seriously though, I was removing the loco and tender from the base ready to photograph them and I was impressed with the plates looking with a naked eye so I picked up my loupe and looked at them closer - it was quite a surprise to see the LNER plate - but I'm sure you will agree an understandable cost saving on the part of GBL - I wonder how many of the intended market would ever have spotted that one or indeed even known what we know if they had.

I dont think there can be any doubt that we as modellers have much to be grateful for with this one.

 

Although its a bit early to be sure of anything - but i'll offer my thoughts - wont it be nice if GBL do the same with the 'Castle' and copy the newer Hornby offering rather than the old ex Airfix version?!!.

 

Regards

 

Hi

 

Well they did build a few 8Fs!

 

GBL's effort is good enough to convince me I need one! (nit-picking aside) . I just hope C of T will be as good! (I don't need another example of the Kitmaster one) and likewise the Castle.

 

Regards

[darrel]

just done a bit of work on the black 5. new transfer on the tender typical the printed one is slightly smaller. lamps removed seam along the top removed, wheels painted black and a bit of weathering with the airbrush.

And before anyone says anything yes I know about the mistake with the lions tail I've since fixed it.

Edited May 28, 2014 by darrel

[darrel]

Hi Darrel,

 

Nice work - the wheels repainted really do make a big difference.

Looking at your photos the only thing is that your improvements, and improvements they certainly are, seem to make the oversized smokebox front even more prominent.

Are you going to have a go at correcting it - I'm sure we would all love to see the result of that done added to your other work.

Regretably due to work on some nameplate artwork for etching, preparation of paint colour samples to help fellow modellers in Australia/New Zealand and a forthcoming exhibition of two of my layouts I'm a bit too busy to try the modification myself at the moment.

Thankyou for sharing it with us.

Regards

I'm thinking about it not sure of the best way of doing it, apart from a lot of work with a file. I am open to suggestions.

The repainting of the wheels make a huge difference to the look of the model, those silver wheels look toy like a simple improvement that does not take a lot of time

[malcolmy]

2 black 5s remaining at Tamworth ASDA following my recent visit.

[Buhar]

Scampered round west London, no luck in two huge 24 hour Asdas, but then found 3 in a WHS when I'd actually gone in for something else!  I'm not good customer for a newsagent, I want 3 or 4 of some models and none of others so if availability gets worse I'm going to struggle.  Same issues of offset smokebox door as others describe, but set at different angles.  Also got a dollop of red lining gloop on the running plate of one. 

 

The booklet is really good (as have the others I've seen), any idea who's authoring them?

 

It looks like a Black 5 and the lining rather puts Railroad models to shame.  I really like it and although I have a few Hornby ones already I think I'll play with one and stick it on a chassis just to justify £30 spent.  The tender is a good test piece for Archer's rivets too.  The tender has the Hornby chunky valance and as expected the axleboxes are a bit under-nourished.

 

Brassmasters have been a bit slow in producing detailing kits for these, but no doubt something will be along soon.

 

I couldn't see what the next one is due to be, last time it was noted in the booklet.

[Horsetan]

There are at least four available in Hemel Hempstead - I checked.

 

...Brassmasters have been a bit slow in producing detailing kits for these, but no doubt something will be along soon.

I think you could be waiting for that until the Almighty summons you upstairs. Why not try the "ordinary" Black Five detail kit that they already produce for the Hornby China model?

 

I couldn't see what the next one is due to be, last time it was noted in the booklet.

City of Truro. Edited May 28, 2014 by Horsetan

[stewartingram]

For those in Chatteris, Cambridgeshire, there is a little newsagent in the High St, Aspinall's. A shop that really does need support, they stock most railway magazines (must be an awful lot of ferro-equinologists in Chatteris!). Popped in today, and found 4x Black 5's in stock. A chat with the owner discovered that he stocks every issue (a small quantity) and will do so whilst they are still offered as sale or return. Furthermore, given about 10 days prior notice after the sale or return finishes, he will get in any specific issue that I want! I'm going to give him a printed copy of the proposed list, so that he can see what is forecast for production, and perhaps secure orders from his customers.

No connection with the business, except for being a local in a small town who likes to support local business, and a satisfied customer of this shop.

 

Stewart

 

edit: just a thought, but this could be a way of getting specific issues in the future, if anyone is willing to pay onward postage cost?

 

another edit: If there is interest in carrying this forward, I'll have another word with the owner.

Edited May 28, 2014 by stewartingram

[andyram]

I saw one of the Black 5 models in my local ASDA this afternoon even before I read the review above. A gorgeous model and I will definitely get at least one. I fancy having a go at weathering so this may be a perfect practice ground. Hell, I may even get a couple!!

[Buhar]

Just to reinforce Ivan's comment further back, this is the stretched 1947 version, not the standard Stanier version (so far as such a thing existed.)

[Sir Hadyn]

The author of the magazines is Tony Streeter, ex Steam Railway editor and now freelance writer. He will know his stuff, and I've assisted with some of the details for the series.

[Wild Boar Fell]

Thanks for the review Weathering Man, 

Picked up a few of these today, and they are absolute crackers, the body's are superb for their price and will look good on a new chassis (I plan to make mine a rake of them being towed to the scrap yard with a rolling chassis but minus the motion). The tenders will also come in very useful I suspect. One thing that wasn't picked up on is even the bogie wheels rotate and can be easily freed from the bogie!

Regards,

Wild Boar Fell

[S.A.C Martin]

The author of the magazines is Tony Streeter, ex Steam Railway editor and now freelance writer. He will know his stuff, and I've assisted with some of the details for the series.

 

I've been very impressed with the series thus far and the modelling potential is great for all of them. My own Black Five tender has become a donor for a project I've had on the go a while. Anyone like to hazard a guess what it will become?

 

 

Incidentally, the locomotive part of my Black Five model is available for anyone who'd like it. Cost of P&P and it's yours - I won't be using mine so why hang on to it.

[Horsetan]

I've been very impressed with the series thus far and the modelling potential is great for all of them. My own Black Five tender has become a donor for a project I've had on the go a while. Anyone like to hazard a guess what it will become?...

34006 "Bude". Shouldn't you have the extra-long deflectors as well?

 

Incidentally, the locomotive part of my Black Five model is available for anyone who'd like it. Cost of P&P and it's yours - I won't be using mine so why hang on to it.

Put it in Smiffy2's Swapsie Shop.

 

For those aiming for a full-on motorising job, possibly with etched parts, the usable bits boil down to just these....