Hornby announce SR 58' Maunsell Rebuilt Ex-LSWR Coaches

[NHY 581]

July has just gone belly up then.......

[rovex]

Would these have appeared in carmine and cream?

[phil-b259]

Would these have appeared in carmine and cream?

 

NO!

 

Please see my earlier post.

[trevor7598]

Why?

 

These coaches were used on rural branch line services and never carried such colours in real life - like most such vehicles they carried plain Carmine / Crimson if repainted by BR before scrapping. As such your hope is in the same category the same as asking for them in BR (S) green - namely asking Hornby to produce a totally fictitious livery.

A set in green in BR days would be good. The lav third on the Bluebell arrived on that line in green as S 320 S. And at least one of the 2 coach was green when withdrawn.

( there is a photo of it in green on Hornby's engine shed blog )

[phil-b259]

A set in green in BR days would be good. The lav third on the Bluebell arrived on that line in green as S 320 S. And at least one of the 2 coach was green when withdrawn.

( there is a photo of it in green on Hornby's engine shed blog )

 

The consensus established earlier on this thread (by those why have been heavily involved with advising Hornby on such matters) was the "BR green" seen in various photos was actually re-varnished malachite with BR lettering. Thats why Hornby dropped their initial plans to do the vehicles in BR (S) green and are releasing them in crimson instead.

 

It is a fact that the Southern regions policy of re-varnishing and touching up paintwork, rather than a complete repaint, means that stock still in Malachite can look very much like BR (S) green in photos dating from the early - mid 50s and modellers should be very careful in assuming that older stock such as these vehicles lived long enough to get a proper repaint in BR(S) green.

Edited June 10, 2016 by phil-b259

[Ian Hargrave]

I hope they do them on Carmine and cream

Let's be clear on this.BR suburban stock ....and these were such.....did not sport carmine & cream livery.Besides which the SR were always bent on returning to green.Maroon they were (some) and maroon they remained.Carmine & cream was applied to Maunsell and Bulleid corridor stock for a few years and then reverted to green,as did the SR's stock of Mark 1's

However...edit...before some eagle eyed member spots it....the WR ....as ever...was the exception to this with its carmine & cream autocoaches.

Edited June 10, 2016 by Ian Hargrave

[rovex]

NO!

 

Please see my earlier post.

I didn't think so thus my question following the previous post. But thanks for clarifying so emphatically

[No Decorum]

Let's be clear on this.BR suburban stock ....and these were such.....did not sport carmine & cream livery.Besides which the SR were always bent on returning to green.Maroon they were (some) and maroon they remained.Carmine & cream was applied to Maunsell and Bulleid corridor stock for a few years and then reverted to green,as did the SR's stock of Mark 1's

However...edit...before some eagle eyed member spots it....the WR ....as ever...was the exception to this with its carmine & cream autocoaches.

Although, as I’m sure you’re perfectly aware, WR was stepped on and told to repaint them in plain carmine.

[Garethp8873]

Why is it I'm thinking that Hornby are trying to give us a hint to a future release in the blog article? I'm not as knowledgeable on carriages as I'm on wagons but I thought that the ex-LSWR Rebuilds Hornby are working on were all non corridor stock yet the three carriages shown in one of the photos halfway down have corridors on them...

[Tim Dubya]

NO!

 

Please see my earlier post.

Chill out, they're only models...

 

Please share information nicely, it's what RMweb is all about, after all.

[olivegreen]

Why is it I'm thinking that Hornby are trying to give us a hint to a future release in the blog article? I'm not as knowledgeable on carriages as I'm on wagons but I thought that the ex-LSWR Rebuilds Hornby are working on were all non corridor stock yet the three carriages shown in one of the photos halfway down have corridors on them...

 

I very much doubt it… first, those photos are from an old press release (hence unlikely to be the hint you suggest) and second, one of the three in the picture has five compartments and a corridor that passes alongside the luggage section: if anyone can tell me of a Southern Railway or constituent carriage that had such an arrangement, I should be delighted.

[Garethp8873]

I very much doubt it… first, those photos are from an old press release (hence unlikely to be the hint you suggest) and second, one of the three in the picture has five compartments and a corridor that passes alongside the luggage section: if anyone can tell me of a Southern Railway or constituent carriage that had such an arrangement, I should be delighted.

 

No worries Olivegreen, as I said I'm not the best when it comes to knowledge on carriages unlike wagons so it's appreciated when someone who knows carriages can tell me so

[phil-b259]

Chill out, they're only models...

 

Please share information nicely, it's what RMweb is all about, after all.

 

True, but its not as if its exactly hard to read the previous couple of posts first is it?

I might be a bit more sympathetic if my initial response the first was buried several pages back - but it was on the same page and only around an hour elapsed between the two posts asking exactly the same thing.

Edited June 10, 2016 by phil-b259

[County of Yorkshire]

Do we think that Hornby will have intentions to do a run of these in carmine and cream, given time? 

 

Are the 'rogue' carriage interiors with corridors referred to up-thread not the GWR Collett interiors? They appear so to me?

 

Cheers, 

 

CoY

Edited June 10, 2016 by County of Yorkshire

[olivegreen]

Do we think that Hornby will have intentions to do a run of these in carmine and cream, given time? 

 

Are the 'rogue' carriage interiors with corridors referred to up-thread not the GWR Collett interiors? They appear so to me?

 

Cheers, 

 

CoY

 

Me too!

[olivegreen]

No worries Olivegreen, as I said I'm not the best when it comes to knowledge on carriages unlike wagons so it's appreciated when someone who knows carriages can tell me so

Thanks for your response, Gareth. On re-reading my words they could be taken as sarcastic, which they were not meant to be, I assure you!  I suspect the interiors are the GWR Collett stock (see a later note in the thread), forgive my going a bit off-topic, but for the SR and its constituents as a general rule brake coaches didn't have corridors alongside the brake or luggage portion - passengers had to negotiate their way through the piles of stuff in  there which, I suppose, was in the logic of putting these coaches at the end of a set, so there was less to-ing and fro-ing.  Also, in general, brake coaches had 4 or 6 compartments, though there were exceptions to this - for example, the eastern section 'Thanet' stock had 5 compartments, and the LSWR Ironclad pantry brake first had only 3 (I'm sure there are others). Once you get into it, coach design is fascinating!

Mike

[bertiedog]

Just hope they have them for sale over a period when people can save and still find stocks,, but on previous experience they sell out quick, and Hornby move on again. Still trying to find the 1938 Maunsell stock they sold till recently, nothing left in stock, despite several stockist listing it till you try to buy them. They sell Southern Locos for the period, but the people at Margate just do not follow up with a suitable steady supply of goods, no wonder they have serious problems when as a customer I have several hundred pounds in my hand to pay, and the stuff is not there to buy!!! Total lack of planning, and too much reliance on China.

Stephen

[phil-b259]

Thanks for your response, Gareth. On re-reading my words they could be taken as sarcastic, which they were not meant to be, I assure you!  I suspect the interiors are the GWR Collett stock (see a later note in the thread), forgive my going a bit off-topic, but for the SR and its constituents as a general rule brake coaches didn't have corridors alongside the brake or luggage portion - passengers had to negotiate their way through the piles of stuff in  there which, I suppose, was in the logic of putting these coaches at the end of a set, so there was less to-ing and fro-ing. 

 

 

Maunsell era stock didn't have any form of partition in the guards / luggage area so the end gangway could only really have been for staff use - as passengers would have easily been able to tamper with the handbrake or goods being carried in the luggage area. Bulleid designs by contrast and the later Mk1 stock had the luggage area - and more importantly the guards brake valve + handbrake wheel - behind a lockable partition / door thus allowing passengers to be able to pass by and through the end gangway to the rest if the train.

 

I am not sure what other companies did but it would be interesting to know if there was a similar split between say Collet and Hawksworth designs or Greasley and Thompson designed brake vehicles

[SRman]

Maunsell era stock didn't have any form of partition in the guards / luggage area so the end gangway could only really have been for staff use - as passengers would have easily been able to tamper with the handbrake or goods being carried in the luggage area. Bulleid designs by contrast and the later Mk1 stock had the luggage area - and more importantly the guards brake valve + handbrake wheel - behind a lockable partition / door thus allowing passengers to be able to pass by and through the end gangway to the rest if the train.

 

I am not sure what other companies did but it would be interesting to know if there was a similar split between say Collet and Hawksworth designs or Greasley and Thompson designed brake vehicles

 

As the Southern had most of their coaching stock in fixed sets, it would not have been practical to restrict passengers to just one set within a longer train: think Atlantic Coast Express (ACE), which probably had more brake coaches than non-brake ones. The restaurant set was marshalled somewhere in the middle, so passengers would have had to have been allowed through all those brake coaches.

[phil-b259]

As the Southern had most of their coaching stock in fixed sets, it would not have been practical to restrict passengers to just one set within a longer train: think Atlantic Coast Express (ACE), which probably had more brake coaches than non-brake ones. The restaurant set was marshalled somewhere in the middle, so passengers would have had to have been allowed through all those brake coaches.

 

Which does beg the question of how they prevented tampering with the guards controls or any luggage carried in the brake van by passengers.

[Tim Dubya]

Which does beg the question of how they prevented tampering with the guards controls or any luggage carried in the brake van by passengers.

 

we lived in more civilised times perhaps...

 

Possibly the contents were in locked cages and the controls locked?

 

Will have to have a gander through me King, Weddell  and Gould books, methinks.

[RFS]

Just had emails from Hatton's to say these coaches will be in stock from July 24th.  Presumably this means they're on the container ship now.

[Joseph_Pestell]

These will be perfect for a layout that I have had in mind for years now. Must order some while available.

 

I like them being in crimson. While in many ways I would prefer to model a later era (that of my childhood in the 60s), the worst aspect of modelling the Southern in countryside areas is green locomotives and carriages running through green countryside.

[Oldddudders]

Just had emails from Hatton's to say these coaches will be in stock from July 24th.  Presumably this means they're on the container ship now.

 

Quote from the Hornby website "The BR versions of the Ex-LSWRs are on the water and will be with us very soon, and the SR version will be with us later in the summer"

[olivegreen]

we lived in more civilised times perhaps...

 

Possibly the contents were in locked cages and the controls locked?

 

Will have to have a gander through me King, Weddell  and Gould books, methinks.

 

Have just done that (except for Weddell Vol 2, which I don't have… a book as rare as rocking horse droppings!)  - no clear answers, unless I have missed something, in which case any info would be gratefully received, Tim.

Mike

Edited June 11, 2016 by olivegreen