Hornby Announce Peckett W4 0-4-0ST

[NHY 581]

By not over cooking it in the first few years, I'm sure this is what Hornby are hoping you will do.

I fail to see the issue here. If anything the next edition of the Peckett will sell quicker than the initial. One reason being many would be purchasers procrastinated, missed the boat and have spent the rest of the time blaming Hornby for everything that has ensued, including threats to world peace and the price of salami in Corsica.

 

The Pecketts are 'bankers'for Hornby. Long may they continue to trickle out a variety of liveries. In hindsight, I should have bought two. I didn't. That was my fault not Hornbys.

 

Rob.

Edited June 24, 2017 by nhy581

[Steamport Southport]

They just need to start doing this with the rest of the range.

It feels like they did so with the Merchant Navy, but months on it's not universally sold out, despite its predictions and expectations.

I'm guessing price is the point too, though in my opinion the choice of some prototypes / variation was questionable in demand, on a first pass they make sense, but on a tightening market some buyers who "must have" may be constrained to wait until the "really must have" is released.

 

Colourful Tank engines at less than £100 have a larger playing field, being easier to afford and get past the Mrs (accounting, aesthetics and the "oh go on then", it's small so she thinks it's cheap factor).

 

But the manufacturers are still reluctant to play., I reckon there's room for at least 3 or 4 more industrial prototypes (things like a Hudswell Clarke, Manning Wardle, Andrew Barclay etc) before it narrows.

With no other announcements (known to be making progress, though the Dapol B4 could play), Hornby owns this space for at least 3 years, at which point they make a few tooling tweaks, and as the established one, will likely get a following beyond, like the terrier...

 

Where are all these Merchant Navys?

 

None available from any of the usual suspects, apart from a few premium priced items from some of the rip off merchants who are charging above RRP.

 

Genuine question as I wouldn't mind another one, but I'm not paying nearly £200 for one.

 

 

Jason

[SRman]

Where are all these Merchant Navys?

 

None available from any of the usual suspects, apart from a few premium priced items from some of the rip off merchants who are charging above RRP.

 

Genuine question as I wouldn't mind another one, but I'm not paying nearly £200 for one.

 

 

Jason

 

PM sent.

[adb968008]

Where are all these Merchant Navys?

 

None available from any of the usual suspects, apart from a few premium priced items from some of the rip off merchants who are charging above RRP.

 

Genuine question as I wouldn't mind another one, but I'm not paying nearly £200 for one.

 

 

Jason

7 new, at or below rrp, new on ebay tonight.

[Steamport Southport]

That's nearly £50 more than I paid for mine. It's not like they are all being discounted because they are slow sellers. I think I'll wait until there's a new issue or the sellers drop the prices.

 

Thanks anyway. 

 

 

 

Jason

[Buhar]

On a recent free BRM DVD Hornby's researcher talks about how the early W4 was chosen, how they estimated sales from experience with the Sentinel and their future plans.  He answered quite a few of the comments here and he also said that the production run was enlarged on the basis of pre-orders but still sold out.  Hornby are expecting a good few years out of the Peckett in different liveries and with minor changes to configurations, but not to the extent of producing the large W4 (eg the G&SWR version).

[Islesy]

On a recent free BRM DVD Hornby's researcher talks about how the early W4 was chosen, how they estimated sales from experience with the Sentinel and their future plans.  He answered quite a few of the comments here and he also said that the production run was enlarged on the basis of pre-orders but still sold out.  Hornby are expecting a good few years out of the Peckett in different liveries and with minor changes to configurations, but not to the extent of producing the large W4 (eg the G&SWR version).

 

Blimey, someone watched it? Well done that man :-)

[Buhar]

I'm sorry I couldn't remember your name and I'd binned the DVD. 

[Ruston]

On a recent free BRM DVD Hornby's researcher talks about how the early W4 was chosen, how they estimated sales from experience with the Sentinel and their future plans.  He answered quite a few of the comments here and he also said that the production run was enlarged on the basis of pre-orders but still sold out.  Hornby are expecting a good few years out of the Peckett in different liveries and with minor changes to configurations, but not to the extent of producing the large W4 (eg the G&SWR version).

Large W4? What does that mean? This is the G&SWR loco - https://photos.smugmug.com/RAILWAYS/LOCOMOTIVES-OF-THE-LMS-CONSTITUENT-COMPANIES/LOCOMOTIVES-OF-THE-GLASGOW-SOUTH-WESTERN-RAILWAY/i-tBK4bnH/1/74f47c82/M/IMG_20170608_0015-M.jpg - and it looks to be the same size as any other W4 to me. The only difference being that it has the later type of cab backplate/opening. Surely if it was larger then it would be a different class and not a W4?

[Caledonian]

Large W4? What does that mean? This is the G&SWR loco - https://photos.smugmug.com/RAILWAYS/LOCOMOTIVES-OF-THE-LMS-CONSTITUENT-COMPANIES/LOCOMOTIVES-OF-THE-GLASGOW-SOUTH-WESTERN-RAILWAY/i-tBK4bnH/1/74f47c82/M/IMG_20170608_0015-M.jpg - and it looks to be the same size as any other W4 to me. The only difference being that it has the later type of cab backplate/opening. Surely if it was larger then it would be a different class and not a W4?

 

The killer giveaway is the running plate which is flush with the top of the buffer beam, I seem to remember Ilsey mentioning some other dimensional issues, which means its impractical for Hornby to simply hang the later cab style on the back. Bit of a bummer but there we are

[tomparryharry]

Sometimes its all down to the size of the cylinders, in relation to the throw of the crankpins. As the smaller locomotive can sometimes come into contact with ground clearance when in bottom centre. Locomotive builders overcome this by moving the cylinders and motion up. This will sometimes result as the running plate moving from rebated between the buffers, to an almost level running plate from front to rear. It also stands to reason that a locomotive with even larger cylinders will result in a much deeper buffer beam. A good example of this is an 18" austerity (please, please, not a J94!), as an early Hudswell Clarke contractors locomotive.

 

Ian

[Ruston]

The killer giveaway is the running plate which is flush with the top of the buffer beam, I seem to remember Ilsey mentioning some other dimensional issues, which means its impractical for Hornby to simply hang the later cab style on the back. Bit of a bummer but there we are

I hadn't noticed that. I wonder if it's just the bufferbeams have been lowered, reducing their height from from rail top level, or the wheels are larger and the bufferbeams have been lowered on the frames to keep the buffer level the same.

[OOgaugeJaf]

Is there a delivery date for the latest Peckett?

[Caledonian]

Sometimes its all down to the size of the cylinders, in relation to the throw of the crankpins. As the smaller locomotive can sometimes come into contact with ground clearance when in bottom centre. Locomotive builders overcome this by moving the cylinders and motion up. This will sometimes result as the running plate moving from rebated between the buffers, to an almost level running plate from front to rear. It also stands to reason that a locomotive with even larger cylinders will result in a much deeper buffer beam. A good example of this is an 18" austerity (please, please, not a J94!), as an early Hudswell Clarke contractors locomotive.

 

Ian

 

Ah that reminds me. The W4 is "defined" by its 14" cylinders, whether its the early version or the later one.

 

The raising of the running plate on the late model was carried out for the reason you suggest, or rather to allow the cylinders to be placed at a slightly steeper angle. Consequently, as I understand it, Hornby aren't contemplating the later version because with the higher running plate and differently angled cylinders etc. it will require a completely new chassis assembly - a rather different league from alternative domes and handrails.

Edited June 28, 2017 by Caledonian

[tractionman]

Is there a delivery date for the latest Peckett?

Hatton's just have

 

'Due into stock September 2017'.

 

Plus sold out to pre-orders.

 

Cheers,

 

Keith

[Ian J.]

I think, if Hornby (perhaps wisely) feel that the later W4 isn't producible from the current tooling then I will have to settle for an inaccurate repaint of an existing model to represent 'George Jennings'. Better than no GJ at all, but sadly not quite the same as having the right version to represent the prototype.

 

Having said that, I wonder what interest in the model railway community there would be for what in effect would be a brand new model representing the later W4, bearing in mind that there are so many other industrials to choose from that would look different and be of interest to modellers?

[PaulRhB]

Commercially something noticeably different makes more sense than a total new tooling for a virtually identical, but fractionally bigger, model.

You're only going to appeal to a very small number wanting those specific models as the majority are just looking at it as a Peckett.

[Caledonian]

Yes, I agree with that. Hornby have given us a perfectly respectable Peckett, producing another W4 doesn't really make a lot of sense; where do you stop, do you launch into the R series as well, all chasing exactly the same market.

 

What I would hope for, now that the decision to produce a Peckett has been so triumphantly vindicated, is that Hornby will give us more of the same but different, eg; a wee Barclay, or a Hudswell or a...

[Buhar]

Large W4? What does that mean? This is the G&SWR loco - https://photos.smugmug.com/RAILWAYS/LOCOMOTIVES-OF-THE-LMS-CONSTITUENT-COMPANIES/LOCOMOTIVES-OF-THE-GLASGOW-SOUTH-WESTERN-RAILWAY/i-tBK4bnH/1/74f47c82/M/IMG_20170608_0015-M.jpg - and it looks to be the same size as any other W4 to me. The only difference being that it has the later type of cab backplate/opening. Surely if it was larger then it would be a different class and not a W4?

 

I picked up the term "large" in conversation with someone who I judge knows more about small industrials than me,  I can't for the life of me remember who, though.

 

As others have noted, the cab is extended to end flush with the rear buffer-beam and there are small rear side panels, the running plate is raised and the cylinders more inclined.  I don't know if the boiler was pitched higher or not as a result.  Unfortunately, the G&SWR Association doesn't have plans for that line's Peckett.

 

Many companies made variations to designs without creating a new class designation, some much more significant than the amendments Peckett made to the W4, for example the wheelbase and myriad boiler configurations on the LMS Class 5 or the fitting of Lentz gear on the Crab.  Mind you, the LNER created a new subdivision of a class if someone cleaned the spectacle glass!

[Ruston]

 

 

What I would hope for, now that the decision to produce a Peckett has been so triumphantly vindicated, is that Hornby will give us more of the same but different, eg; a wee Barclay, or a Hudswell

Agreed on the Barclay. If not Hornby then maybe Bachmann or someone else could get in on the small industrials market.

[Mad McCann]

What about a set of etches to convert the Hornby model to the larger cab version?

[Caledonian]

What about a set of etches to convert the Hornby model to the larger cab version?

 

Much more to it than the cab, as we've just been discussing, there's the higher running plate, different cyclinders and I'm sure Alan is right about the higher pitched boiler. That being said, if compromise is your middle name I'm sure it wouldn't be beyond the wit of man to devise a late cab to fit on the Hornby one, but is it worth it?

[Steamport Southport]

More than one way to skin a cat. 

 

http://cspmodels.com/abante/index.php?rt=product/product&path=69&product_id=197

 

 

 

Jason

[Budgie]

Can I get just the safety valves and the whistle (for sorting out those items on my Hornby model)?

[Steamport Southport]

I don't think the kit is available yet.

 

Maybe send them an email, but I would not expect much luck at the moment seeing as they have just taken over a range after the previous owner died and have been having a few problems getting back up and running.

 

 

They do have a forum presence though.

 

http://www.rmweb.co.uk/community/index.php?/topic/119575-csp-models/

 

 

 

 

Jason

Edited July 1, 2017 by Steamport Southport