Hornby Princess Coronation Class (Duchess)

[Brocp]

Front end of the chassis looks low. Has the lug that holds the body on to the chassis broken off?

[Buhar]

Front end of the chassis looks low. Has the lug that holds the body on to the chassis broken off?

 

Look at the section of valve gear below the footplate too, it's pointing skywards rather than close to horizontal, I agree something looks amiss with the location of the front of the body.  I hope Hornby can do something with all these returns rather than landfill. Spares would be nice and I'm sure a firm in the north east would be happy to help. 

[drt7uk]

A friend of mine got one from his local shop with the top pair missing. The proprietor was going to send it back, but my friend was able to purchase it from him at a touch over trade price (he wouldn't have bought one otherwise) and is happy to repair it with some brass wire.

 

I appreciate that paying full price, this shouldn't be something one has to do, but yours is certainly not the only Duchess to arrive sans handrails.

 

Cheers

 

J

 

Thanks yes good point...you're right would be reasonably straightforward to make the handrails yourself but I'd be more worried about scratching the paintwork by accident when fitting! Will give Rails of Sheffield a call when they open again tomorrow.

 

Unfortunately I've tested and 2nd radius curves too tight for the larger front wheels...will have to keep them back til a future layout.

D

[mikesndbs]

Hi guys

 

Well I got drawn in and purchased one of the new Queen Elizabeth models.

I have always loved the blue streamlined version so despite what seems a high price tag for a very basic model (Body wise at least) I paid up locally and got one.

I had to take it back as it ran dreadful with clicks and squeaks, We got through three others before finally they tried their display case model which seemed to run ok.

 

There was a slight click, click as it ran but not too bad, it had a good run Xmas day when my dad was with us.

 

Its been resting since.

 

This morning I set it running gently along and sat back for some R&R bang!! it locked up totally.

 

Discovered that when the crosshead on the right side of the loco was fully in the cylinder, all was locked up.

I found by easing the slide bars slightly this was cured.

Added some gear lube and it quietened down a bit, however it still sticks and you can see the head jump at the end of its travel.

 

I have also noticed that the expansion link on this side moves far more than on the other side where there is no fault.

 

Best way for me to show you is in this short video.

 

 

 

Please tell me i have not got another Hornby dud?

 

 

Late edit, I thought I'd check her alongside Sir William Stanier FRS as they should have the same valve gear, they do but Sir William also has the one side moves one does not expansion link!!!!! Really depressed

Edited December 31, 2018 by mikesndbs

[Hilux5972]

The slide bars look to be too far apart. That would cause the jumping up at the end of travel

[mikesndbs]

The slide bars look to be too far apart. That would cause the jumping up at the end of travel

 

Many thanks, yes I agree, but when I close them down a little the whole thing locks up, but when the crosshead is nearest to the cylinders??

[robmcg]

.....

 

 

Please tell me i have not got another Hornby dud?

 

 

Late edit, I thought I'd check her alongside Sir William Stanier FRS as they should have the same valve gear, they do but Sir William also has the one side moves one does not expansion link!!!!! Really depressed

 

The slidebars on the 'loose' side need t be pinched together gently at their outer ends with the crossbar near the cylinders, until the crosshead is more snug throughout the length of its stroke. A bit tricky, don't twist them. You shouldn't really have to do this with new models.

 

It is important also that the connecting rod is not twisted, and that it clears the front coupling rod pin.

 

The forwards and backwards movement of the valve gear varies between models, it should be similar to the side which has movement but all Hornby models vary depending on luck with assembly. No real harm unless the movement is excessive.

 

There are many vagaries in all these models, assembly of valve gear and rods etc is a bit of a gamble in my experience.

 

Above all you have NOT got a dud, It is very common that these models need to be inspected carefully and maybe 'slightly' tweaked but if you are uncomfortable with that you are entitled to a refund. 

 

Best

[MikeParkin65]

Many thanks, yes I agree, but when I close them down a little the whole thing locks up, but when the crosshead is nearest to the cylinders??

In my experience with Hornby valve gear once it has bent itself it is almost impossible to get it to operate correctly. On older models I’ve replaced the gear with replacements from Peters spares. Not so easy with the new models where spares don’t seem to be generally available. I’m afraid I’d return your model for refund unless the vendor is willing or able to repair (if they are service dealers would Hornby authorise taking the valve gear from one of the other models you previously rejected?). Sorry, don’t like to put a dampener on the joy of a new loco but this one seems properly broken to me.

[Legend]

The slidebars on the 'loose' side need t be pinched together gently at their outer ends with the crossbar near the cylinders, until the crosshead is more snug throughout the length of its stroke. A bit tricky, don't twist them. You shouldn't really have to do this with new models.

 

It is important also that the connecting rod is not twisted, and that it clears the front coupling rod pin.

 

The forwards and backwards movement of the valve gear varies between models, it should be similar to the side which has movement but all Hornby models vary depending on luck with assembly. No real harm unless the movement is excessive.

 

There are many vagaries in all these models, assembly of valve gear and rods etc is a bit of a gamble in my experience.

 

Above all you have NOT got a dud, It is very common that these models need to be inspected carefully and maybe 'slightly' tweaked but if you are uncomfortable with that you are entitled to a refund.

 

Best

Sorry Rob, but if it doesn’t work as intended it is a DUD. And again shows variability in Hornbys manufacturing contractor . It shouldn’t be there . Really I’d take it back. In a model costing £170+ discounted and I think now over £200 at list , there is no excuse for this. I had thought about buying one , but this has stopped me , until we know the issue is dealt with. Edited December 31, 2018 by Legend

[robmcg]

Sorry Rob, but if it doesn’t work as intended it is a DUD. And again shows variability in Hornbys manufacturing contractor . It shouldn’t be there . Really I’d take it back. In a model costing £170+ discounted and I think now over £200 at list , there is no excuse for this. I had thought about buying one , but this has stopped me , until we know the issue is dealt with.

 

Far enough. I guess a high proportion of Hornby models are, by that measure, duds.

 

the issue is not going to be 'dealt with'.  It is normal that a proportion of delicate assembled models have faults, and tweaking the slidebars slightly is annoying, and as I say, you can have a refund.

 

Similar qc issues pervade the other Duchess models

Edited December 31, 2018 by robmcg

[mikesndbs]

The slidebars on the 'loose' side need t be pinched together gently at their outer ends with the crossbar near the cylinders, until the crosshead is more snug throughout the length of its stroke. A bit tricky, don't twist them. You shouldn't really have to do this with new models.

 

It is important also that the connecting rod is not twisted, and that it clears the front coupling rod pin.

 

The forwards and backwards movement of the valve gear varies between models, it should be similar to the side which has movement but all Hornby models vary depending on luck with assembly. No real harm unless the movement is excessive.

 

There are many vagaries in all these models, assembly of valve gear and rods etc is a bit of a gamble in my experience.

 

Above all you have NOT got a dud, It is very common that these models need to be inspected carefully and maybe 'slightly' tweaked but if you are uncomfortable with that you are entitled to a refund. 

 

Best

 

Very many thanks, I want to try and fix this.

 

I did try what you suggest and while it fixes the lifting cross head the whole thing locks solid when it slides into the piston, I honestly can't see why.

 

I'll keep at it

[Pete the Elaner]

Very many thanks, I want to try and fix this.

 

I did try what you suggest and while it fixes the lifting cross head the whole thing locks solid when it slides into the piston, I honestly can't see why.

 

I'll keep at it

They don't look parallel to me. The bottom one looks slightly bent. I am not sure it can be straightened very easily.

Higher speed running may cause the cross head to pop out. This happened with one of my older ones & I just popped it back in (which was not as easy as it sounds) without inspecting the motion. I suspect it will slop up & down like yours.

[Black 5 Bear]

I had three SWS Stanier Pacifics with valve gear defects from the 2017/18 releases.

All were returned to the supplier for a refund as I gave up when offered a fourth.

It now appears that the Streamlined version, which I believe shares the same components as the rebuilt version could be plagued by the same problems.

I think I'll keep my wallet firmly closed with regards to this particular model.

[robmcg]

Since my last reply, earlier today, I opened my just-received 6221 'Queen Elizabeth'

Haven't test-run it, the front top handrails are missing. Both sides.

 

Very disappointed, the cost and annoyance of returning it from NZ is considerable, customs declarations etc.  No it's too delicate for me to attempt making my own handrails.

 

 

I had a faulty 46256 too, so my current view of Hornby Q C is 'quite poor'!

Edited January 1, 2019 by robmcg

[mikesndbs]

I had three SWS Stanier Pacifics with valve gear defects from the 2017/18 releases.

All were returned to the supplier for a refund as I gave up when offered a fourth.

It now appears that the Streamlined version, which I believe shares the same components as the rebuilt version could be plagued by the same problems.

I think I'll keep my wallet firmly closed with regards to this particular model.

 

Yes I have sadly since discovered my Sir William Stanier has the same issue on one side with the hardly moving expansion link, seems to be a common fault, as it all looks and in fact measures the same I wonder if it is just a case of re-positioning the crank?

[ikks]

What the heck is going on here ..........lots of money being paid out for things that are not up to standard...........reminds me of the time I bought a Midland Compound a few years ago,(apparently split from a set, from Rails) got a slip saying run and tested before despatch, it could not have been, sand pipes wrapped around the drivers, brake gear snapped in a number places, broken buffers and lots more, I emailed them but never got a reply so I guess it was too hard(I am in Australia). Quality has been very hit or miss over the last few years, it would seem, either product or service.

 

Mike

[Steamport Southport]

What the heck is going on here ..........lots of money being paid out for things that are not up to standard...........reminds me of the time I bought a Midland Compound a few years ago,(apparently split from a set, from Rails) got a slip saying run and tested before despatch, it could not have been, sand pipes wrapped around the drivers, brake gear snapped in a number places, broken buffers and lots more, I emailed them but never got a reply so I guess it was too hard(I am in Australia). Quality has been very hit or miss over the last few years, it would seem, either product or service.

 

Mike

 

You can't exactly blame Hornby for that though. The Midland Compound in a set was Bachmann.

 

 

 

Jason

[vitalspark]

Lets not forget the majority of locos that do run fine from the word go.

 

My Duchess has been perfect from the beginning and still runs faultlesly although I would have been happy to forgive it any small cosmetic issues like missing handrails for such a superb model at a price that is impossible to match with a kit.

 

I sometimes think we are unrealistic in our expectations looking for finer and more accurate models at a price cheaper than the kits that were the only alternatives and thats before we factor in the time and skills required to build and paint the latter.

 

I would suggest that each and every loco could easily be checked and tested and after shipping rechecked but it would likely be double the price.

 

I agree that the valve gear issue is a concern and having had two Black 5s with the same problem Hornby do need to address this but small parts that are easily repaired or replaced..we are all supposed to be modellers aren't we?!..I suggest we accept this as the price you pay for a great value for money model that has been shipped half way round the world. 

 

Stanier going strong..one of Hornbys best.

 

And apologies if I upset anybody so the very best to all for 2019.

Edited January 1, 2019 by vitalspark

[robmcg]

Lets not forget the majority of locos that do run fine from the word go.

 

My Duchess has been perfect from the beginning and still runs faultlesly although I would have been happy to forgive it any small cosmetic issues like missing handrails for such a superb model at a price that is impossible to match with a kit.

 

....

 

 

I agree that the valve gear issue is a concern and having had two Black 5s with the same problem Hornby do need to address this but small parts that are easily repaired or replaced..we are all supposed to be modellers aren't we?!..I suggest we accept this as the price you pay for a great value for money model that has been shipped half way round the world. 

 

...

 

Sorry, people who buy £180 models are not 'all modellers'.

 

What is this 'we are all supposed to be modellers' coming from?

 

The skills required to make handrails for the front of a new Coronation model are not possessed by many.

 

Hornby may or may be receiving a lot of returns these days, who would know? The retailers are certainly returning a good number, if anecdotes from this forum are a guide.

[Silver Sidelines]

Sorry Vital Spark

 

I buy online so cannot examine and test.

 

Lets not forget the majority of locos that do run fine from the word go.

..

 

I have a very patient wife and I buy a quite a few new Hornby and Bachmann items from a range of outlets.

 

I cannot quote percentages but I would say a majority have faults, broken cab windshields, missing parts - and that is before I try and run the model.

 

Bottom line these toys are still really cheap - compared to having them individually commissioned.

 

Cheers  Ray

[vitalspark]

Sorry, people who buy £180 models are not 'all modellers'.

 

What is this 'we are all supposed to be modellers' coming from?

 

The skills required to make handrails for the front of a new Coronation model are not possessed by many.

 

Hornby may or may be receiving a lot of returns these days, who would know? The retailers are certainly returning a good number, if anecdotes from this forum are a guide.

 

Sorry Rob if this was taken the wrong way.

It was never my intention to offend but I think its pretty safe to say that most of the guys posting here are modellers.

As for forming small handrails from brass wire it should take even a modeller of limited skills about five minutes tops and same again to fit so I still think its a valid comment.

This forum is about offering help and advice so I would be happy to post a step by step instruction of above.

 

Kindest regards to you

 

Dave. 

[mikesndbs]

LOL Now then I also don't want to cause any offence and having a dad that was a master modeler I understand the work that can go into a model.

 

However, we are not buying toys here! these are premium expensive models that are offered as the state of the art fine detail 'working' models for collectors and runners.

 

They are not £40 cheap and cheerful crude representations of the real thing.

We are also supposed to be protected by trade laws in regards to models being fit for purpose.

 

If on every occasion when we buy a model we end up having to spend hours and hours fettling the dam things to make them work, exchanging motors or sending off for spares it suggests we are being seriously ripped off.

 

The QC recently on Hornby stuff has been abysmal, seriously a blind man on a galloping horse could have done better.

 

On further examination of my Coronation I have discovered a warped or poorly fitted rear driving wheel and that one of the pistons is hitting something inside the plastic piston molding which results in the uneven running of the piston rod.

Who ever built this simply bent the slide bars to increase travel and avoid the obstruction, resulting in the thump, thump I observed.

 

So now a childhood dream of owning one of these lovely locos is coming to an end which I find gutting to be honest.

[Silver Sidelines]

Hello Mike

 

Stop and ask yourself what else can I buy for £150 (or whatever the exact price).

 

I still say cheap at the price.

 

..They are not £40 cheap and cheerful crude representations of the real thing.

We are also supposed to be protected by trade laws in regards to models being fit for purpose.

.

The QC recently on Hornby stuff has been abysmal, seriously a blind man on a galloping horse could have done better....

 

If we were talking £500 a throw we might be hoping for better.

 

I could go on at great length about some of the issues I have had with current Hornby products.  However the bottom line is that I don't have to buy them - and the more rubbish items that drop through the letter box the fewer that I will be buying in the future.

 

Ray

Edited January 1, 2019 by Silver Sidelines

[Steamport Southport]

I agree with the idea that they should all be perfect. Doesn't matter how expensive they are.

 

I would guess that I've bought approximately 30 or 40 new RTR locomotives over the last couple of years and they've all been perfect. Maybe I've been lucky or I might be part of the silent majority that hasn't had a bad one.

 

After all. If you have a bad meal you tell everyone not to go to that restaurant and post online. If your meal is fine you tend not to say anything....

 

 

 

 

Jason

[Legend]

Lets not forget the majority of locos that do run fine from the word go.

 

My Duchess has been perfect from the beginning and still runs faultlesly although I would have been happy to forgive it any small cosmetic issues like missing handrails for such a superb model at a price that is impossible to match with a kit.

 

I sometimes think we are unrealistic in our expectations looking for finer and more accurate models at a price cheaper than the kits that were the only alternatives and thats before we factor in the time and skills required to build and paint the latter.

 

I would suggest that each and every loco could easily be checked and tested and after shipping rechecked but it would likely be double the price.

 

I agree that the valve gear issue is a concern and having had two Black 5s with the same problem Hornby do need to address this but small parts that are easily repaired or replaced..we are all supposed to be modellers aren't we?!..I suggest we accept this as the price you pay for a great value for money model that has been shipped half way round the world. 

 

Stanier going strong..one of Hornbys best.

IMG_1069-8.jpg

 

And apologies if I upset anybody so the very best to all for 2019.

image1-14.jpg

This is the sort of post that really exasperates me . Sorry Vital Spark, we normally agree on most things but your initial statement that things to not work fine from the word go really has tripped all my switches . This is a £200 model. It should! The fact that many modellers tweek and put up with things really does the overall modelling community no good at all. It makes Hornby complacent. The thing is that sending it back from the U.K. is a hassle, sending it back from New Zealand has got to be worse. So Hornby get away with it. I’m sitting watching telly seeing a Curry’s advert for a washing machine at £160. If faulty do we just say “ ah well things don’t always work from the word go “ and fix it ourselves ? No because you expect it to work and it probably will . Why should a Hornby model railway loco be any different?