royaloak Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Did your location, as stated under your avatar, have any bearing on all this? I dont think so.although there are a couple of levers in there as well! Somebody has pushed my buttons though! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Rucksacks? A minor and momentary hiccup; next year I'm getting togged up to rake a journey into the gents. That's the real danger. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
royaloak Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 I never noticed anyone with BO, but then I am not due for my annual bath until February! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wombatofludham Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Do you think if I bought up a stock of cheap knock-off Chinese rucksacks the Warley organisers would let me rent a stand to sell them? As an added incentive the first 25 get the choice of a free personal hygeine kit or a pair of boxing gloves as a free gift? We're clearly missing a trick here. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wombatofludham Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 PS I could also source a supply of adult nappies or those absorbent-lined p1ssy pants older gentlemen with bladder control issues use. I'd be coining it in.That'll be my fleet of 87s funded, or even one Bachmann Mk2f if they ever see light of day. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
royaloak Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 We need a yuck smillie! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BlackRat Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 This thread is almost as exciting as th MRJ ones....... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
298 Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Having never been to Warley or any UK model train event in ages, I can assure you that you are not alone, rucksacks are alive and well in the US. Probably not as many as most US visitors will arrive by car as the availability of public transit is sometimes limited. This helps the situation as it all but eliminates some of the concerns voiced. Prams can be left home and babies with mother while father and friends get to see the trains. Why anybody would take a baby to a train show is beyond me anyway, yet you see them held high with father trying to get their attention and going Choo Choo, as though Junior will understand. Junior will never ask for a train set at Christmas as even at a young age such things are from another time. I dunno, BRM seemed to be doing a lot to promote the hobby by supplying a ready made stocking filler with every subscription that Junior could proudly open on Christmas Day and run on Grandad's train set (other family members may also have layouts or receive the free gift once handed on as a present). What if you are mother? And then the penny dropped for me, perhaps Warley has a different demographic to other shows and although these culprits are obviously present at other shows, they are more prevalent due making up a larger percentage and the sheer attendance numbers. And although those who went will say there were families there, I'd hazzard a guess that their percentage was a lot lower than probably all but specialist shows. And if you're still reading and haven't assumed that I'm "having a go" at the organising club (which I'm not), one obvious problem with aiming a show at a certain demographic is if their attendance radically drops off then the show might become unattainable, and suddenly being in a comfortable position where whatever you do attracts 20 something thousand people becomes a self-inflicted decline as costs are cut, leading to a further drop in attendance. You see the same thing at village hall/school shows that seem to attract more families, and if they didn't aim themselves at that level then they too wouldn't be viable. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 This thread is almost as exciting as th MRJ ones....... Indeed, I wonder if..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
woodenhead Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Maybe if Bachmann and Dapol didn't have their sales stands then there might be less shoving and bumping though where else would you get a Blue Thumoer for £70. At that price I might have been tempted to consider a bit of blue. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
royaloak Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 I see Phil has failed to answer either of my quite easy questions, namely- Why is okay for you to assault people by pushing them but not okay for them to retaliate/protect their children and What would you do if somebody assaulted your children for no apparent reason in front of you. Maybe they werent so easy after all! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
royaloak Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Maybe if Bachmann and Dapol didn't have their sales stands then there might be less shoving and bumping though where else would you get a Blue Thumoer for £70. At that price I might have been tempted to consider a bit of blue. I had actually bought my quota but as I walked away they opened another box and there they were, far too good to resist although I now wish I had bought 2 of them, it was marked up at £80 (still a bargain) but I got a bit of discount due to my previous purchases. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 PS I could also source a supply of adult nappies or those absorbent-lined p1ssy pants older gentlemen with bladder control issues use. I'd be coining it in..... You could have a stand within Continent layouts.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wombatofludham Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 ...or Frinton. After all, the old music hall joke was Harwich for the Continent, Frinton for the incontinent... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Huw Griffiths Posted November 28, 2016 RMweb Gold Share Posted November 28, 2016 I see Phil has failed to answer either of my quite easy questions, namely- Why is okay for you to assault people by pushing them but not okay for them to retaliate/protect their children and What would you do if somebody assaulted your children for no apparent reason in front of you. Maybe they werent so easy after all! ... Perhaps they were - and the answers so obvious that they don't need to be said. Do you think if I bought up a stock of cheap knock-off Chinese rucksacks the Warley organisers would let me rent a stand to sell them? As an added incentive the first 25 get the choice of a free personal hygeine kit or a pair of boxing gloves as a free gift? We're clearly missing a trick here. Why stop at boxing gloves? My local sports shop does a roaring trade in snooker cues and baseball bats ... . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
howardpidd Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 If some of the angry, dogmatic, and plain silly opinions expressed here are a true reflection of exhibition going modelers then no wonder people are starting to avoid Warley. What a pity we can't just agree that it's not a good idea to be a smelly, inconsiderate bully who pushes and shoves their way to the front and stop trying to justify anti social behavior, rucksack wearing or not! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenrithBeacon Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 Glad I went to the Letchworth show! No hassles, no BO, no modellers with anti-social attitudes, just a really good model railway exhibition. Regards Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
royaloak Posted November 28, 2016 Share Posted November 28, 2016 If some of the angry, dogmatic, and plain silly opinions expressed here are a true reflection of exhibition going modelers then no wonder people are starting to avoid Warley. What a pity we can't just agree that it's not a good idea to be a smelly, inconsiderate bully who pushes and shoves their way to the front and stop trying to justify anti social behavior, rucksack wearing or not! But according to some they are not the biggest problem, that accolade is reserved for rucksack wearers whether adult or children who, it seems, are fair game to push around simply because they are wearing a rucksack, at no point (within the first 70 odd posts) did he mentioned being knocked (by accident) by anyone wearing a rucksack. I find that quite abhorrent and would protect myself and my children to the best of my ability, some seem to think that is wrong, maybe they shouldnt threaten to push people and their children around in the first place! You might question whether deliberately pushing people around is the right response if they have accidentally bumped into you? But me saying I will protect my children and 're-arrange the teeth' of somebody who has just assaulted my child is wrong, well tough, dont deliberately assault peoples kids (or the adults themselves) if you dont want the same back! Anything wrong with that? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
60159 Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 I have just wasted a small but valuable portion of my life wading through this thread. I had hoped to learn a bit about how Warley went and enjoy some good humoured banter about the "perils" of attending such a show. Instead the thread was peppered with immature comment from the seemingly thuggish Royal Oak who is proud to boast about re-arranging some-one's teeth and proud of his right hook. Royal Oak - grow up. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium t-b-g Posted November 29, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 29, 2016 Some of you are sounding like real school yard teenage bullies. Yet when I look at the age of most people attending shows, I worry that any attempt to resort to physical violence, including swinging a rucksack, is only likely to lead to a heart attack, or something like a scene from "Last of the summer wine". Bringing a rucksack to a show is not wrong. It doesn't automatically make the wearer evil. Many people have been seen by me at shows, wearing rucksacks, causing no problems whatsoever. It is when the wearer starts swinging it about with no regard for anybody behind them, who happens to be in the way, then that person is in the wrong. Mostly, it is a case of being too lazy to take it off and carry it by hand (as has been illustrated) when you get into a tightly packed part of the show. There are clearly people who do behave like that otherwise the thread wouldn't have been started and got this heated. I would hope that nobody on here does behave like that and worse, thinks that such behaviour is quite OK and that it is up to the rest of the crowd to anticipate their next move and get out of the way. Anybody who does think that way clearly has a lack of respect for others and a behavioural problem. Dealing with such a problem by shoving or pushing just makes the person doing the pushing and shoving just as badly behaved as the person with the rucksack. I always thought of model railways as a hobby for thoughtful, creative and gentle people, capable of performing tasks that a neurosurgeon would be proud of with our scalpels and a soldering irons. Perhaps I was wrong and we are just a bunch of selfish thugs, with no regard for the welfare of others. How sad. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium PMP Posted November 29, 2016 RMweb Premium Share Posted November 29, 2016 PS I could also source a supply of adult nappies or those absorbent-lined p1ssy pants older gentlemen with bladder control issues use. I'd be coining it in. Ooh would you be so kind? I'll have one, so much at this thread that a little bit of wee has come out .. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pete_mcfarlane Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 I must go on the Saturday one year to see what it's like. Based on the comments, I'm now imagining it's something like this. Sunday wasn't too bad, although I'd echo the sentiments about people pointing oversized DSLRs in front of your face - this seems to be a new trend, although I saw far fewer people this trying the equally personal space invading technique of taking photos using iPads this year or trying to video layouts. I didn't get barged too much or encounter any BO, but I wasn't that interested in buying stuff from the Bachmann stand or looking at the latest 3D prints of models that will come out in several years time. I stayed until the end, and found that it got quieter from about 3:30ish, so that was the time to look at the more popular layouts like Copenhagen Fields without too much of a scrum in front of them, although it probably helps that I can see over most people's heads. The only downside for me was having to stand on the XC train from Birmingham International to Derby. But I expect no less from XC after using them many times before. After that, the half empty EMT class 153 to Nottingham was quite pleasant. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bertiedog Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 On flash photography many users simply do not know how to turn it off, and there are a few digital cameras around where you cannot override the flash. Never seem to be bothered with rucksacks, maybe because I do not stand or walk so close as some people tend to in a crowd. The main problem is a person suddenly turning and placing the full back pack bag in the way, but if it hits you, you may be to close anyway. People tend to push together to get a view, and this can bring out bad manners, hold back, and wait a few moments and it usually clears. Some people are unfortunately naturally rude and pushy, tends to go with grumpy old men and there are lots of us in model railways!!!!! Stephen Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Bomag Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 But according to some they are not the biggest problem, that accolade is reserved for rucksack wearers whether adult or children who, it seems, are fair game to push around simply because they are wearing a rucksack, at no point (within the first 70 odd posts) did he mentioned being knocked (by accident) by anyone wearing a rucksack. I find that quite abhorrent and would protect myself and my children to the best of my ability, some seem to think that is wrong, maybe they shouldnt threaten to push people and their children around in the first place! You might question whether deliberately pushing people around is the right response if they have accidentally bumped into you? But me saying I will protect my children and 're-arrange the teeth' of somebody who has just assaulted my child is wrong, well tough, dont deliberately assault peoples kids (or the adults themselves) if you dont want the same back! Anything wrong with that? Is there anything wrong with that? Nothing that an inability to spot humorous hyperbole could not exacerbate. I have to suggest that your stout defence of what is generally agreed to be undesirable and your flogging to death of your argument that you are right to propose beating people up rather reinforces some people's prejudice of backpack wearers. While you are free to continue, the general advice is to stop digging. I have no personal opinion against backpack wearers at Warley - I think anybody who goes to the NEC for pleasure needs help. The last time I went to the NEC (except when being paid) was 1991, luckily have got over it. For the avoidance of doubt the above contains irony and satire. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Alan J Kirkman Posted November 29, 2016 Share Posted November 29, 2016 Well when Mark Casson had his van stolen and had to withdraw Grime St from Warley this year I decided that I'd go and ride Heritage Tram Operations in Blackpool instead of trudging round Warley. I may have missed picking up some specialist bits and pieces but the sheer hard work of the walking and carrying of even what you buy and the fact that you have to take a decision to come with perhaps less clothing layers that you need changing trains etc. because you can't carry bag space round the show to put it in nor can you carry food to avoid paying NEC prices and the resultant queues and lack of table spaces. when you've finally got it just makes Warley too tiring and fraught and hard on the legs nowadays, So being unabke to drive 4mm scale Leeds Trams I opted to sit on real Blackpool ones. Seriously as everyone says you can't solve the problem by restricting sales that simple abolishes the reason for the show ( some might just suggest you could abandon layouts after what we 've seen folk caring about for years) but perhaps it the time of the year which excarbates all the Problems. Just think how much less emcumberance would be being carried and worn in summer and how much better long journeys would be to attend or how much less of a problem a howling gale round the extremities of a platform would be waiting for a train. And how much easier exhibitors would find queueing to set up in daylight! Time to rethink the date I think. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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