Corona-virus - Impact of the Health Situation worldwide

[Oldddudders]

When you don't have a working tv (it's the dish or the box that are OOO) and you never watch the local tv anyway, as I don't, it helps enormously when the French Government contacts you direct, as it did 10 minutes ago by text. No doubt some would bristle that my phone-supplier has passed on Big Brother's news. I do not. 

 

I now know that I may only leave the premises if I have a form specifying my employment, or need to leave for my health or essential shopping. Unambiguous, at least. 

 

 

[boxbrownie]

1 minute ago, Oldddudders said:

When you don't have a working tv (it's the dish or the box that are OOO) and you never watch the local tv anyway, as I don't, it helps enormously when the French Government contacts you direct, as it did 10 minutes ago by text. No doubt some would bristle that my phone-supplier has passed on Big Brother's news. I do not. 

 

I now know that I may only leave the premises if I have a form specifying my employment, or need to leave for my health or essential shopping. Unambiguous, at least. 

 

 

We have been told the NHS will contact people in the high risk groups this week with official advice, how they will do it we have no idea.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

7 hours ago, gismorail said:

Something that has been wandering through my mind recently is the fact that we have not had any news regarding the situation in Russia has anyone any info 

Putin is immune and invulnerable. That is all anyone needs to know.

1 hour ago, Ashcombe said:

... Yes, Johnson, the message is clear: protecting the financial institutions matters more than supporting the Arts. 

Alternatively, this is life as art, and it's Improv.. Some of the acts will be flops, that's the nature of the beast.

[Phil Bullock]

All of a sudden the purpose of NHS Connecting for Health becomes rather stark....

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NHS_Connecting_for_Health

 

As for news from Russia - I tend to lump the world news on issues like this in to 3 categoeries:

 

1. Third World countries - we dont hear much, probably because largely there isnt the infrastructure in place to gather the information let alone manage the consequences. The situation is probably more dire than in 2 and 3 below.

2. Totalitarian countries - we might hear, but whether we chose to believe is another matter.

3. Western style countries - we will hear, but may suspect the agendas behind some decisions and actions.

 

Note I mention no names - best left to personal judgment.

Edited March 17, 2020 by Phil Bullock

[Oldddudders]

3 minutes ago, Phil Bullock said:

All of a sudden the purpose of NHS Connecting for Health becomes rather stark....

 

https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/NHS_Connecting_for_Health

'His credentials were questioned by his own mother, a campaigner for the preservation of local health services in her area, who expressed her amazement at his appointment, criticising the whole scheme as "a gross waste of money"' Thanks for that gem! 

[Rugd1022]

40 minutes ago, AY Mod said:

 

Mrs Y likes 'helmety', stuff with dragons, axes, gratuitous sex and regular beheadings. I prefer more cerebral, she thinks I'm being swotty watching Only Connect but there's another couple of reasons for that.

 

I have a sneeking suspicion Mrs Y and Mrs D Rug1022 may be distantly related, her helemety stuff is (apparently) far superior to the '70s Italian crime flics and low grade Lew Grade Roger Moore / Peter Wyngarde output I prefer to watch...!

[Phil Bullock]

7 minutes ago, Oldddudders said:

'His credentials were questioned by his own mother, a campaigner for the preservation of local health services in her area, who expressed her amazement at his appointment, criticising the whole scheme as "a gross waste of money"' Thanks for that gem! 

 

The preservation of local health services is exactly what we need and you might hope that thoughts around over-centralisation based on political dogma and as a smokescreen for a failure to plan and recruit sufficient healthcare professionals for the last 25 years - the period since the NHS last did a national staffing review - might be the best thing to come out of the current issues.

 

The down side of local health care information systems is that we are a mobile population and may not be within a local system when a personal crisis arises.....

Edited March 17, 2020 by Phil Bullock

[John Tomlinson]

Actually Phil, I think a lot of very good things might come out of this. To take another, the idea that the purpose of life is conspicuous consumption, one-upmanship and generally anything to do with money - hopefully we might get some changed priorities!

 

Probably best wait until we have light at the end of the tunnel however before elaborating too much on this.

 

John.

[EddieB]

50 minutes ago, Oldddudders said:

'His credentials were questioned by his own mother, a campaigner for the preservation of local health services in her area, who expressed her amazement at his appointment, criticising the whole scheme as "a gross waste of money"' Thanks for that gem! 

To say nothing of his costly - to the taxpayer - involvement with a company who were formerly banned from Government work following the DeLorean scandal.  That was until a minister with a family connection was appointed...

[MJI]

I am getting stocks in.

 

Next company will be Gibson for wheels

[jjb1970]

1 hour ago, Phil Bullock said:

1. Third World countries - we dont hear much, probably because largely there isnt the infrastructure in place to gather the information let alone manage the consequences. The situation is probably more dire than in 2 and 3 below.

 

 

Most least developed countries have enough easily preventable deaths for which the technology and knowledge already exists for prevention that Covid-19 probably isn't their biggest issue to worry about. 

[spikey]

1 hour ago, wasabi said:

It's not about being fortunate it's forward planning.  I worked in Life Assurance and Pensions for quite a few years and learnt a bit about this.

 

But obviously not that there are some people who have never earned enough to be able to afford a pension, and others who conributed to a scheme just as they were advised to, but which turned out to be worth a fraction of the promised amount.

[melmerby]

1 hour ago, 34theletterbetweenB&D said:

Putin is immune and invulnerable. That is all anyone needs to know.

 

And in power for the next couple of generations, at least

[Liam]

3 hours ago, tractionman said:

If / when that comes into force in the coming weeks my concern will be for the very many folks for whom--like my dad--become isolated in their own homes. He's in his 80s, lives alone a long way from me and my siblings, reliant not on social media and gadgets (eg yesterday, over the phone, my attempt to help him set up Skype failed), and reliant much more so on the tele. I wish there was wall-to-wall classic films or old sport on the TV (Freeview) at the moment, to occupy him and help him pass the time, rather than being drawn into the 24-hours news coverage which is just too alarming. 

 

Meanwhile I am encouraging him to get outside, potter round the garden (thankfully he has one), and go for a short walk (but keeping a distance), rather than feeling he has to stay indoors.

 

 

You could always order him an ‘Oh, Mr Porter’ DVD from Amazon - currently £3.99. A classic British comedy. I wonder who’ll be the first to reply to this with a quote from the film... 

 

https://www.amazon.co.uk/Will-Hay-Oh-Porter-DVD/dp/B003UUKD2M/ref=sr_1_1?crid=3RNL6PY3LN58E&keywords=oh+mr+porter+dvd&qid=1584447845&sprefix=Oh+mr+%2Caps%2C143&sr=8-1

[John M Upton]

This morning has been interesting on the trains going up and down the Sussex Coast.

 

Noticeably less commuters although it being a nice sunny warm morning may have influenced a few decisions there and I expect some will return once the rain comes back.

 

Less school kids despite nearly all schools still being open, quite a few have decided to skive off it would seem

 

Then a surge in passengers (and road traffic too) mid morning as it seems the nice weather has enticed people out for a day out with a 'Boris can get stuffed' attitude prevailing.

 

I would wager we will see Saturday timetables with amendments coming in at some point.

 

Mind you with less travelling, Network Rail could get a heck of a lot of engineering work done.

[Metr0Land]

8 minutes ago, John M Upton said:

 

I would wager we will see Saturday timetables with amendments coming in at some point.

 

 

 

Mayor of London was on Sky News earlier (and maybe other outlets).  He's saying TfL looking to reduce tube frequencies to Saturday levels and then Sunday levels.  (Didn't specifically mention buses but inference is they'd be the same)

[Reorte]

17 minutes ago, John M Upton said:

Then a surge in passengers (and road traffic too) mid morning as it seems the nice weather has enticed people out for a day out with a 'Boris can get stuffed' attitude prevailing.

If they're just out for a walk then that's all fine. Although if they're cramming in to trains, maybe less so.

[John Tomlinson]

A question for you all - I've searched for an answer on NHS releases and so far failed, so maybe someone can help?

 

In the UK we know the strategy is to let the virus spread through the population until, as it were, it burns itself out by having no more hosts, or at least an inadequate density thereof. The idea is to do this in a structured way, in order to match the demand for treatment of the really sick to the capacity of the NHS to administer same. Having had the virus, it is thought highly probable, but perhaps not 100% certain, that one is thereafter immune, and also cease to be a carrier.

 

My question, to which there may not be an answer, is how do we know we've had the thing, if indeed we are amongst the fortunate to be barely aware or only moderately ill? Whilst the symptoms of a continuous cough and/or a high temperature are being widely publicised, they are not much different to the symptoms of many of the colds and flus that circulate anyway, and I for one would be hard pressed to know the difference. The reason it matters is that if we've had something else, we're still at risk and can be a carrier, whereas if we've had Covid-19 itself we should be in the clear for both.

 

Moreover we know that in the UK even with the priority being given to increasing testing, the capacity of this is unlikely to go much beyond NHS staff and those clearly seriously ill.

 

Any answers?

 

Many thanks,

 

John.

Edited March 17, 2020 by John Tomlinson
clarity

[Reorte]

As individuals most people who get it probably won't ever know for certain. One way they'll be able to tell though is when there's enough testing to do meaningful random samples and infer from those.

[Gwiwer]

41 minutes ago, John M Upton said:

a 'Boris can get stuffed' attitude prevailing

 

Clearly in evidence around me with a significantly reduced morning peak towards London but near-normal levels of contra-peak traffic.  Which (for the many who won't know) is as heavy now as the with-flow peak around London.  Schools are open, not all universities are (but they are better set up to lecture / assess remotely).  A large number of welcomes and smiles in evidence and the usual friendly banter about the workplace.  And the usual one who takes everything out on the staff when her train didn't run (it broke down in the platform).  

 

There are mixed feelings as might be expected.  Some fatalists still suggesting the world will end before dinner-time.  Many adopting the "Keep calm and carry on" approach.  Most aware of the official advice but either unable or unwilling to comply.  It is, after all, only advice.  

 

There are legitimate concerns as to the effects of reducing public transport.  A Saturday service would have little impact and offer a business minimal savings.  A Sunday service would prevent many who rely on public transport in our cities from getting to and from work; remember that includes hospital and emergency services staff, delivery drivers, teachers, cleaners and a great many others.  And alarm bells being sounded over reductions in bus services as this would leave many very vulnerable and older folk without their only go-shopping lifeline.  Outside the main cities finding a bus at weekends is often impossible so Saturday or Sunday timetables will see vast areas cut off.  

 

And a sense - voiced by some - that full lockdown will be widely disrespected if it was tried if only because the "melting pot" will boil over.  Manage it with sensible advice and frustration, impatience, anger and boredom may not explode in destructive and uncontrolled ways.  

 

I agree with offering advice on restricting interaction but allowing us to make our own choices.  Local pubs were busy last night and may be again tonight.  There is a "blitz" spirit rising in some quarters.  I cannot and will not agree that politics of enforcement will work either in the short or longer term.  That is, in my view, likely to cause far more harm than good in all sorts of ways.  

 

TV?  100 channels and nothing on worth watching.  I have one indoor hobby.  The rest take or require me to be outdoors.  As does work.  I shall carry on.  

 

[John Tomlinson]

The fact that we're being given "advice" rather than "instruction" suggests to me that there is, as Gwiwer says, a view that appealing to people's sense of public spiritedness is more likely to be effective than hard enforcement - if indeed this would be practicable - as one could envisage widespread dissent after a period.

 

Clearly the French government doesn't share this view, and it will be interesting to see how well both approaches fare in the coming days.

 

John.

[Rugd1022]

1 hour ago, John M Upton said:

 

 

Mind you with less travelling, Network Rail could get a heck of a lot of engineering work done.

 

This is something I and my colleagues are thinking about at the moment - it's an ideal time to make hay while the sun shines (sort of), a huge part of our work at Freightliner HH is based around providing infrastructure trains. I'd like to think that at some point the CV crisis will be over and life will have to return to normal, if at all possible it would benefit all concerned in the long run to crack on as usual on certain parts of the network.

[boxbrownie]

2 minutes ago, Rugd1022 said:

 

This is something I and my colleagues are thinking about at the moment - it's an ideal time to make hay while the sun shines (sort of), a huge part of our work at Freightliner HH is based around providing infrastructure trains. I'd like to think that at some point the CV crisis will be over and life will have to return to normal, if at all possible it would benefit all concerned in the long run to crack on as usual on certain parts of the network.

If the doom mongers are right, we might even get HS2 finished before CV dies.....

[Reorte]

6 minutes ago, John Tomlinson said:

The fact that we're being given "advice" rather than "instruction" suggests to me that there is, as Gwiwer says, a view that appealing to people's sense of public spiritedness is more likely to be effective than hard enforcement - if indeed this would be practicable - as one could envisage widespread dissent after a period.

Ideally it works much better I think. No-one likes being told what to do, and ordering people to do anything is pretty obnoxious so best avoided if possible. And leaves some room for odd little snippets of normality to help keep people sane. Going down to the pub every night should be out now but how much quicker will it spread if people still have an occasional drink at the pub, just nowhere near as regularly? Just helping keep people going is worth a small increase in risk IMO.

 

The downside is that relies on there not being a big enough group with no sense of responsibility who'll ignore absolutely everything.

[Metr0Land]

40 minutes ago, John Tomlinson said:

 

My question, to which there may not be an answer, is how do we know we've had the thing, if indeed we are amongst the fortunate to be barely aware or only moderately ill?

 

Any answers?

 

Many thanks,

 

John.

 

That's the one test the Dr Chris Whitty keeps saying we desperately need I'm afraid.  On the BBC News just now there was a Welsh couple who'd been stuck on a cruise ship and tested frequently but were ok.  When they flew home they were tested before boarding, then 3 times in the flight (presumably just for temperature).  Now they're home they've tested positive and yet they've had no symptons.

 

In fact the gent was an ex-miner who always has chest problems whenever anything goes around, but this time has no perception of anything despite being positive for the virus.