New structure for British railways

[Ncarter2]

40 minutes ago, 96701 said:

 

I'm assuming the proposed organisation included Network Rail who currently own the railways in England, Scotland and Wales.

It will indeed. Over the next few years, staff at NR & GBR when it takes over, are in for a tough time, with reorganisations and impossible targets which generally lead down one not so good path….. 

[96701]

1 minute ago, Ncarter2 said:

It will indeed. Over the next few years, staff at NR & GBR when it takes over, are in for a tough time, with reorganisations and impossible targets which generally lead down one not so good path….. 

I'm glad I'm retired and out of all that.

 

[corneliuslundie]

I think this is the first topic on RMWeb where everyone is in agreement.

There's an achievement for whoever "designed" this mess.

Jonathan

[RichardT]

10 hours ago, frobisher said:

 

They have taken this one the whole nine yards really.  The normal Tory fixation that British means English... Because of course this Great British Railways only pertains to the franchises running within England because of the devolved administrations having direct control of their railways.

Yes, part of the same policy fixation which has renamed Highways England as “National Highways” even though its remit does not extend to Scotland, Wales & NI.

 

Richard T

[Dunsignalling]

1 minute ago, RichardT said:

Yes, part of the same policy fixation which has renamed Highways England as “National Highways” even though its remit does not extend to Scotland, Wales & NI.

 

Richard T

 

Though at least "National Highways" won't require a further expensive rebranding  if/when England becomes a stand-alone entity.... 

 

John

[PaulRhB]

18 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

 

Though at least "National Highways" won't require a further expensive rebranding  if/when England becomes a stand-alone entity.... 

 

John

 most get rebrands every few years anyway. NR has had two logos in twenty years! The original and revised which just moved the lines to the perspective point and added the shiny light at the end of the tunnel . . . 

[Compound2632]

2 minutes ago, PaulRhB said:

 most get rebrands every few years anyway. NR has had two logos in twenty years! The original and revised which just moved the lines to the perspective point and added the shiny light at the end of the tunnel . . . 

 

Whereas the arrows of indecision have endured unaltered for 57 years which must be some kind of record for the railway industry.

[BernardTPM]

The idea of combining elements of the Union flag with the Double Arrow is something BR played with from time to time. Here's a Rail Rover poster, for example. I've got a BR leaflet from around 1971/2 that does something similar too if I can find it...

[corneliuslundie]

I think it should just be BR

Hat, coat etc

If I get banned I deserve it

It reminds me of a recent attempt to put a Union Flag on the whole side of a building in Cardiff to be occupied by whatever the Welsh office is called this week.  The official reason for dropping the idea was cost.

Jonathan

[Dunsignalling]

29 minutes ago, corneliuslundie said:

I think it should just be BR

Hat, coat etc

If I get banned I deserve it

It reminds me of a recent attempt to put a Union Flag on the whole side of a building in Cardiff to be occupied by whatever the Welsh office is called this week.  The official reason for dropping the idea was cost.

Jonathan

 

I doubt there's any need to ask where the individual who dreamed up the idea is based....

 

The amount of the UK that our parochial London-centric administration actually understands seems to shrink by the month and won't extend much outside of the M25 before long. 

 

Not surprising there are demands for independence.

 

John

Edited February 11, 2022 by Dunsignalling

[Compound2632]

55 minutes ago, Dunsignalling said:

Not surprising there are demands for independence.

 

... and that's just Berkshire.

[Wheatley]

2 hours ago, Compound2632 said:

 

Whereas the arrows of indecision have endured unaltered for 57 years which must be some kind of record for the railway industry.

It must be some kind of record for the advertising/branding business too. Possibly Ford, maybe one or two others ? It's even the original arrows, not the slightly distorted RDG version. 

 

What's really annoying is that someone will have been paid for that. 

[uax6]

Why didn't they just use the original XP64 one with a red background?

 

This version is going to look a bit odd on a blue vehicle isn't it?

 

Andy G

Edited February 11, 2022 by uax6

[John M Upton]

I am sure us frontline rail staff will be wooed with a badge and a pen, seems to be standard form for any rebrand these days.

[Gwiwer]

1 hour ago, John M Upton said:

I am sure us frontline rail staff will be wooed with a badge and a pen, seems to be standard form for any rebrand these days.

We got a notebook as well when they gave us the "Team Clapham" re-branding pack.  Except that we still can't use any of it except the name-badge for reasons which no-one either knows or is prepared to divulge.  

[Wheatley]

2 hours ago, uax6 said:

Why didn't they just use the original XP64 one with a red background?

 

This version is going to look a bit odd on a blue vehicle isn't it ?

 

They have been for internal communication ! 

 

Expect the new livery to make Boris' VIP Voyager look tasteful. 

[Max Legroom]

Jeez this logo is depressing. Someone needs to tell them that Cool Britannia was 25 years ago. All we have left are naff symbols.

[John M Upton]

I reckon the standard double arrow was got at by Boris with his crayons and the resulting mess sent off to a focus group of yes men and this was the result.

[Mike Storey]

20 hours ago, Ncarter2 said:

It will indeed. Over the next few years, staff at NR & GBR when it takes over, are in for a tough time, with reorganisations and impossible targets which generally lead down one not so good path….. 

 

Much the same as BR then. I worked for BR for c.20 years, up to privatisation, and in that time, was displaced 6 times, each during one of the myriad reorganisations. In mitigation, for most of them, I ended up back in almost the same job but with a different title or geography. Most of the reorganisations were driven by a new Chairman (of which I think I endured 6 of which 2 were very good), and followed the latest trend in management, at that time. In almost every case, new targets were included which were all about cost reduction, and nothing else. But one, above all, made sense (and it wasn't OforQ!!!!) - sectorisation, under Reid 2. That was the future, and it was just beginning to make headway when John Major came along.

 

Conversely, in Railtrack, for all its faults, I believe we only reorganised once (in 8 years), and that was early on. In NR, whilst I remained there, from 2002 to about 2005, I recall being reorganised 3 times, but I think those were all localised to my Major Projects division.

 

So, it would be nothing new, but it is endemic when government believe they can do things better. The only realistic hope is that GBR is given a degree of autonomy and longevity of targets and budgets, that allow sensible decisions made over realistic timescales. Fat chance.

 

The new logo debate, whilst entertaining, is about sweet FA.

 

 

[Mike Storey]

You are invited to contribute to the Great British Railways debate (but not yet):

 

https://www.railwaygazette.com/uk/consultation-soon-on-great-british-railways-legislation/60897.article

 

[Wheatley]

24 minutes ago, Mike Storey said:

 

The new logo debate, whilst entertaining, is about sweet FA.

 

 

It is, but it's the only tangible output of the process that any of us have seen so far, unless you count a voluntary severance scheme which almost no-one in my particular TOC has been allowed to take. 

 

Meanwhile we wait for someone to explain to Mr Shapps what the 'plan' bit of the Williams-Shapps Plan For Rail actually is. Once they get the crayons back off Boris to write one. 

[Gwiwer]

16 minutes ago, Wheatley said:

a voluntary severance scheme which almost no-one in my particular TOC has been allowed to take. 

Ditto.  Despite which we are still being pressed to reduce our establishment by 20% overall though clearly in some departments / grades more than others.  And despite the severance offer and "necessary" staffing reductions more staff are being recruited and trained every week on a running-to-stand-still basis.  

[Michael Hodgson]

44 minutes ago, Mike Storey said:

You are invited to contribute to the Great British Railways debate (but not yet):

 

 ... but don't expect anybody to pay any heed to anything you say. 

It's called consultation, and its purpose is to enable the bosses to say it's not our fault when it all goes t*ts-up.

[Titan]

50 minutes ago, Wheatley said:

It is, but it's the only tangible output of the process that any of us have seen so far, unless you count a voluntary severance scheme which almost no-one in my particular TOC has been allowed to take. 

 

From what I have heard on the grapevine Network Rail has been compelled to offer the voluntary severance to everybody, and to refuse no-one no matter what their position until the quota is met. Unfortunately as there is a national shortage of certain engineers, so many are accepting and immediately starting new jobs, no doubt with a pay increase to boot and are laughing all the way to the bank.  Meanwhile Network rail are now having to draft in engineers on contract or secondment from other companies to cover the shortfall in key positions...

[Wheatley]

55 minutes ago, Gwiwer said:

 And despite the severance offer and "necessary" staffing reductions more staff are being recruited and trained every week on a running-to-stand-still basis.  

 

13 minutes ago, Titan said:

 

From what I have heard on the grapevine Network Rail has been compelled to offer the voluntary severance to everybody, and to refuse no-one no matter what their position until the quota is met. 

Exactly. My own TOC has let no frontline staff go and in fact barred most of them from even applying. There are more new posts on this week's vacancy list than were allowed to leave from 'other' posts. 

 

If there is a plan it meets no definition of 'plan' that I've ever heard.