Hornby 2023 Speculation?

[Steamport Southport]

1 hour ago, Gilwell Park said:

I am getting very annoyed reading umpteen requests for Hornby to re-tool models already in the range. What is wrong with their existing LMS 8F & why o why should they be expected to produce multiple variants of the MN?. How many people really need half a dozen pacifics on their layout?  A Brighton K sounds an excellent idea as does a GE E4. Let's have some variety in the new models, not slightly different re-runs of existing models. Roger.

 

it's very basic and very dated. Certainly not up to year 2000 standards, never mind 2023 standards.

 

When you look at the Graham Farish N Gauge version and realise it's far better detailed than the one that is twice the scale then you would understand.

 

https://www.world-of-railways.co.uk/Reviews/graham-farish-stanier-8f

 

 

Jason

[rogerzilla]

Apparently the cross-country services from Basingrad to the midlands and north-west have gone now.  Used to often get a train to New Street in the 1970s, usually with a knackered Class 47 that would change ends at Reading.

[Dunsignalling]

1 hour ago, rogerzilla said:

If someone made an SR K1 or W, would much retooling be required to do both?  The side tanks are literally the same, as they were kept and recycled when the Ks became Us, and the K1 and W are visually almost identical, even down to the tank cutaways and huge side steps.

 

A K has the wrong size and shape outside cylinders, of course.

 

Though doing tooling alternative sets of cylinders wouldn't exactly break the bank anyhow!

 

The down side is that the U/U1/K/K1 need 6' wheels and the W only 5' 6" like the N/N1.

 

John 

Edited December 19, 2022 by Dunsignalling

[Steamport Southport]

56 minutes ago, Flying Pig said:

 

I wonder if we'll see the J27 released by Hornby.  It really isn't up to the standard of their own models and I think we might see a significant price increase if it did appear in their range.

 

Already in the range.

 

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/j27-lner-red-lining-no1214-or76j27004?_br_psugg_q=l%26ner+lined+class+j27+no.1214

 

 

Jason

[Flying Pig]

1 minute ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Already in the range.

 

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/j27-lner-red-lining-no1214-or76j27004?_br_psugg_q=l%26ner+lined+class+j27+no.1214

 

 

Jason

 

And without a price increase too - interesting.

[E100]

To add to my previous listing I would like to see K1 [6]2005 in lined green as per preservation. It would make use of the existing tool, but be a totally different livery for the model but in familiar colors so no need to do a lot of research colour wise and would appeal to both preservation era and 1970/80/90's depending on where it was on railtours so fairly wide appeal.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/86020500@N06/10709187675

 

Next time I see SK at a show I will mention this.

[newbryford]

51 minutes ago, E100 said:

It would make use of the existing tool, but be a totally different livery for the model but in familiar colors so no need to do a lot of research colour wise

 

Isn't that what they said about the GBRf 50? 😆

[Mr chapman]

I'm not interested in pacific's since the whole fixed pony truck thing. Even the tt:120 stuff has been afflicted. I don't get why that's so readily accepted. If they released a castle with a flangless center driver people would loose their mind! I understand why it was done, but I don't understand why it was necessary. Continental models don't seem to have these limitations. Looking at the light pacific's that had this retrofitted, was it really an upgrade? 

[Patriot87003]

There are a few items that I’ll be looking out for during the 2023 release that could tempt funds to be diverted from any family holidays!

 

- Next batch of liveries using the re-tooled HST and slam-door Mark 3’s: Original blue-grey and Intercity Executive

- Any further Class 87 liveries! IC Mainline and Intercity (with the full yellow front below the cab windows) would be preferred

- Royal Train

- WCML EMU

 

I have a feeling my chances are possibly 50%, 5%, 1% then 0%

[rogerzilla]

I guess they're trying not to have a swinging truck because LNER pacifics had a Cartazzi axle, which doesn't swivel one bit - it only allows lateral movement.  A scaled-down Cartazzi axle wouldn't get around model railway curves, though.

[ndg910]

I am open to all suggestions (as long as they are steam era) but I really don't see any point chasing the duplication market any more. Accurascale, Rapido, KR models et al are here to stay and have already eaten into the core market that was Hornbys. I have bought Hornby for many years but my demand for their product has dwindled recently and I am sure I am not alone. I think the only new models purchased in the last few years have been the SR diners and Hornby need to understand the change in market forces and need to flex with it. They cant be moaning that xyz manufacturer has snapped their golden model if they leave open goals. Yes, Hornby have a market (almost a monopoly) for Flying Scotsman and little Billy's first train set but that wont be enough for them to survive without market diversification.

 

I think I am trying to say, talk to the modelling community, do your own wishlist poll and understand what the market wants. That's how others respond to market forces (maybe not with the wishlist poll). For the past 10 years Hornby have been lucky that their major competitor have been slow between announcement and delivery allowing Hornby to keep up with them. That's now changed and many other manufacturers have different business models (no pun intended) and Hornby need to make the splash and be creative. I can well see, the Hornby B-set being brought back to fight off Rapido, the Class 50 to resist Accurascale and others in a similar vein. Hornby need to be creative in their corner and not responsive and they will succeed. I really hope in a few weeks we are saying, they've retooled that or are bringing out this - what a fantastic package of releases/announcements, and that we are not seeing the headlines of "Hornby are just reacting to xyz's announcement of a better highly detailed version of a class xxx with a Railroad version first introduced in 1975". 

 

Oh and a Saint, Aberdare, 1101 dock tank or a pre-57xx pannier (1854, 2744) would be a good welcome.

[Standards_in_OO]

1 hour ago, E100 said:

To add to my previous listing I would like to see K1 [6]2005 in lined green as per preservation. It would make use of the existing tool, but be a totally different livery for the model but in familiar colors so no need to do a lot of research colour wise and would appeal to both preservation era and 1970/80/90's depending on where it was on railtours so fairly wide appeal.

 

https://www.flickr.com/photos/86020500@N06/10709187675

 

Next time I see SK at a show I will mention this.

I would instantly buy if they did this as it fits in perfect with my North Yorkshire Moors/West Highlands theme. I would also like some green and cream liveried tourist coaches. These are perhaps a bit niche but are available in N gauge from Farish and Hornby have released some more obscure liveries on some of their coaches over the last few years. 

[Dunsignalling]

1 hour ago, rogerzilla said:

I guess they're trying not to have a swinging truck because LNER pacifics had a Cartazzi axle, which doesn't swivel one bit - it only allows lateral movement.  A scaled-down Cartazzi axle wouldn't get around model railway curves, though.

TBH, the trucks under the cabs of big locos look bloody daft going round No.2 radius curves whether they pivot or not.

 

At least the fixed ones get rid of all the non-prototypical daylight in that area and they look much better standing still. 

 

John

[E100]

1 hour ago, Standards_in_OO said:

I would instantly buy if they did this as it fits in perfect with my North Yorkshire Moors/West Highlands theme. I would also like some green and cream liveried tourist coaches. These are perhaps a bit niche but are available in N gauge from Farish and Hornby have released some more obscure liveries on some of their coaches over the last few years. 

 

I have 6 mint Bachmann mark 1's in this livery from ebay for around £300 all in purchased over the past year. At £50 a coach you are probably better going down that route!

[Standards_in_OO]

2 minutes ago, E100 said:

 

I have 6 mint Bachmann mark 1's in this livery from ebay for around £300 all in purchased over the past year. At £50 a coach you are probably better going down that route!

Yes I have thought about that having seen them previously on eBay. It is a difficult one to justify as I haven’t decided if I’d rather model the Jacobite in that period or more as it is today under West Coast Railways. If Hornby announced some WCR Mk1s in their 2023 range then I would go for that. I think this would be a good idea due to how widely they are used on charter trains etc and would go well with a variety of steam and diesel. 

[RyanN91]

CrossCountry Class 43 train pack 2022 toolings with separate MK3s 2022 toolings. With 43384 power car

 

Attached photo ©. D.W.V Hunt and © Modern Railways.com

 

 

Reintroduced 

 

Original livey InterCity 125 as they haven't been in the range a while.

 

BR Class 43 HST Class 253 Western Region 1970s power cars. With 7 BR MK3 coaches separately.

 

BR Class 43 HST Class 254 Eastern Region 1970s power cars. With 8 BR MK3 coaches separately.

 

BR Class APT-P Train pack sets 370 005 and 370 006 in Final APT-P red logo with red stripe livery. ( 5 or 7 train pack) 

 

With additional APT-P NDM and APT-P coach packs.

 

BR Class 370 APT-P DTS 370 007. On its own.

 

I wonder if the APT DTS on their own would sell on their own? 

 

370 001 DTS with  370 002 DTS plain yellow fronts.

 

370 001 DTS with 370 002 DTS both Black window surrounds with APT-P logo.

 

370 003 DTS with  370 004 DTS plain yellow fronts.

 

370 003 DTS with 370 004 DTS, both Black window surrounds with APT-P logo.

 

That way moddlers can alternative the livery of the DTS on their APT-P between plain yellow fronts and the final APT-P logo with black window surrounds.

 

[Mark Dickerson]

4 hours ago, rogerzilla said:

Apparently the cross-country services from Basingrad to the midlands and north-west have gone now.  Used to often get a train to New Street in the 1970s, usually with a knackered Class 47 that would change ends at Reading.

CrossCountry still does the route (from Southampton to Manchester) with reversal at Reading, but you have to make do with gawping at the 57s in the sidings instead...

[adb968008]

7 hours ago, Dunsignalling said:

How about two 12-car Electrostars, though?

 

I suspect that neither you or I are all that typical.

 

Despite my own record on Bulleid Pacifics (and, come two think of it, since Hornby introduced them, my average is less than 2.5 per year anyhow) I think there's reluctance to spend money on large quantities of the same/very similar stuff if a more varied selection is on offer.

 

John

Loco.. £225

coach £65 x 12

= £1005

 

£350 x 3 = 1050

 

its psychological.

 

Many buy a loco and 5 coaches… £550

One 4 car unit £350

 

From a manufacturing perspective a 4 car unit could be just two toolings used twice…

The 4 DD is exactly that… two coaches x 2 each in the box.

 

A loco and 5 coaches… well thats a 1st, 2nd, comp, brake and the loco….

 

Means you only need to sell half the amount of a loco to achieve the same sales volume.

 

Edited December 19, 2022 by adb968008

[E100]

1 hour ago, Standards_in_OO said:

Yes I have thought about that having seen them previously on eBay. It is a difficult one to justify as I haven’t decided if I’d rather model the Jacobite in that period or more as it is today under West Coast Railways. If Hornby announced some WCR Mk1s in their 2023 range then I would go for that. I think this would be a good idea due to how widely they are used on charter trains etc and would go well with a variety of steam and diesel. 

A K1 is a straight forward renunber or a black 5 for today. Transfers are available to convert maroon coaches into wcrc livery quite straight forwardly

[luke_stevens]

22 hours ago, adb968008 said:

Imagine if there was a class of Merchant Navy today, what would we have…

 

Meditteranean Shipping Company

Cosco

Maersk

Hanjin

 

or perhaps passenger friendly..

Carnival Cruises

Disney Cruises

Royal Caribbean 

or being British..

 

Wightlink 

MerseyFerries

Saga Cruises

 

What class could wear them though, 444 perhaps ?

 

 

They could announce "Seaborne Freight" which would be really easy as they never had any ships so Hornby wouldn't need to actually produce anything :) !

 

Luke

[1andrew1]

6 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Already in the range.

 

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/j27-lner-red-lining-no1214-or76j27004?_br_psugg_q=l%26ner+lined+class+j27+no.1214

 

 

Jason

It's on the Hornby website but it's not sold under the Hornby brand. From the above link, "Oxford Rail Brand".

[luke_stevens]

4 minutes ago, 1andrew1 said:

It's on the Hornby website but it's not sold under the Hornby brand. From the above link, "Oxford Rail Brand".

 

For all intents and purposes Oxford and Hornby are the "same" thing, at least for the moment. Whether that will change when Lyndon Davies stops being Hornby CEO is a good question!

 

Luke

[hellotojasonisaacs]

Alright, so, 

 

Steam

• not my area of expertise but no doubt something obscure and two other items newly tooled (D49 would be nice though)
• the usual crop of terriers, A3s and A4s, pecketts and other things
• another entry into their dublo range

 

D&E

• some railroad diesels in a range of liveries
• LNER 225
•  I do think the TfW FLIRTS will happen. See this still from the Greater Anglia video 
• loco hauled mk3s from the Oxford range

 

What I say every year and still hasn’t happened

• regional railways and NSE mk1s 
• eurostar centre coaches (maybe even a retool)
• Electrostar 

[1andrew1]

11 hours ago, luke_stevens said:

 

For all intents and purposes Oxford and Hornby are the "same" thing, at least for the moment. Whether that will change when Lyndon Davies stops being Hornby CEO is a good question!

 

Luke

The two brands seem to have different pricing policies though. 
 

I do suspect Oxford Rail is likely to be phased out as it is lumped under Hornby on the Hornby website and not given a separate page, unlike Hornby's other brands, even Basset-Lowke. Perhaps 2023 will see the Oxford Rail brand end.

Edited December 20, 2022 by 1andrew1

[Watto1990]

Today’s advent calendar prize is Collector’s Club membership and the 2023 Club Loco, so I guess technically we just saw our first confirmed 2023 model? https://uk.Hornby.com/christmas/advent-calendar?modal=offer-modal