How often is a exhibition layout not 'ready to go' at 'doors open' at exhibitions?

[OnTheBranchline]

One show I was at had an interesting layout of large scale Thomas & Friends where they had the engines on the nicely decorated layout but nothing was running. After 2 hours of periodically checking back, maybe one of the trains was running, I seem to remember them trying to figure out what's wrong with Gordon (isn't this something that is figured out before) - I just had the feeling of "come on guys, you're on display here" and the guys running this layout didn't seem have their wits together. But maybe I'm being unrealistic in my expectations because things to do go wrong and I've never been on the other side before.

 

Note - when I say not ready to go, I don't just mean putting a few more wagons on the tracks etc etc...

Edited September 10, 2023 by OnTheBranchline

[37114]

52 minutes ago, OnTheBranchline said:

One show I was at had an interesting layout of large scale Thomas & Friends where they had the engines on the nicely decorated layout but nothing was running. After 2 hours of periodically checking back, maybe one of the trains was running, I seem to remember them trying to figure out what's wrong with Gordon (isn't this something that is figured out before) - I just had the feeling of "come on guys, you're on display here" and the guys running this layout didn't have their wits together. But maybe I'm being unrealistic in my expectations because things to do go wrong and I've never been on the other side before.

 

Note - when I say not ready to go, I don't just mean putting a few more wagons on the tracks etc etc...

There have been a few close calls for sure but generally in my experience as an exhibitor most layouts are ready to go and it tends to be glitches that manifest just minutes before the show that are the ones the public see. Also having been on the otherside of the table I generally have sympathy for someone struggling to get a layout to work and one layout not working wouldn't break the show for me.

 

From personal experience, It is  tough call to balance being at a show in good time and allowing time to fix any manner of issues vs leaving it close to the wire. I do mostly local shows so try and arrive as early as poss before the show opens, typically this gives 2 hours to unload and set up. Putting the layout up take 15 minutes and putting all stock on, coupling up etc takes 30 mins, so I have 1.25hours to test/deal with issues. Touchwood I have never had an issue to be ready for show opening but if a point failed or there was some electrical damage in transit then it would be close. 

[Gilbert]

IMHO - I think an unforeseen problem caused by the journey can be a real risk -electrical joints do fail and track can get damaged- however not having spare rolling stock in the event of a loco failure is something I think we can plan for and ensure we have spares....what can be a problem is the control system - I had a Lenz system fail and had to revert to DC after a fair bit of digging.........I now use NCE and carry a spare Powercab...having said that I was once helped to unload by members of a host club who turned obvious stock boxes on their side despite "please keep level" labelling - they were the old Parkwood Arts boxes with inserts that only come half way up the side of the locos and stock...you can guess the rest.

Chris H

[SR71]

I never cease to be amazed by people who turn up at a show with box of untested locos and stock with dirty wheels.

 

Enough goes wrong by itself without setting out to test the limits of possibilities.

[Gilbert]

1 minute ago, SR71 said:

I never cease to be amazed by people who turn up at a show with box of untested locos and stock with dirty wheels.

 

 

Having been around a bit I'm not at all surprised .....sadly.

[Chris M]

There are things that can go wrong that you can’t have a back up plan for bit exhibitors should have a plan to cope with problems. Also everything should be tried and tested before setting out.

 

The worst thing I have done is forget to take the supports for the layout lighting system. By the time the show opened we had got two bits of timber cut them to length drilled holes and fitted them. We were lucky in that one of the organisers lived a few doors away and was able to lend me some tools. Oh, and somehow somebody found a piece of timber that could do the job.

 

There are some layouts that are too big to be set up and tested at the owners house. This inevitably makes it harder to ensure the layout is fully prepared for an exhibition.

[Chris M]

The thing that happens all too often is the layout operators don’t know how to run the layout. This should be avoided. Having said that I had two new operators on my layout over this weekend (one each day) but they were experienced exhibitors and  quickly brought up to speed.

[TheQ]

We had a club layout that during the morning set up, blew it's DCC controller, not many carry a spare and we didn't.

Another of our large club layouts had its track damaged at one board end in transit, not good on a roundy roundy, they managed to get a partial layout running .

 

I was at another show not ours, where a largish DC layout had a major wiring failure , they didn't manage to get anything running for the one day show. They spent the entire day trying to fix the wiring.

 

Yet another show not ours, I was watching a layout standing next to the guest of honour for the show, an entire train pulled into the fiddle yard... unfortunately it was a cassette yard with no base board, just framework.. the lot hit the tiled floor.. leaving them missing a train for the rest of the day...

 

Our club spends hours trying to make sure of every possible failure.. not always successfully

[009 micro modeller]

1 hour ago, OnTheBranchline said:

One show I was at had an interesting layout of large scale Thomas & Friends where they had the engines on the nicely decorated layout but nothing was running. After 2 hours of periodically checking back, maybe one of the trains was running, I seem to remember them trying to figure out what's wrong with Gordon (isn't this something that is figured out before) - I just had the feeling of "come on guys, you're on display here" and the guys running this layout didn't have their wits together. But maybe I'm being unrealistic in my expectations because things to do go wrong and I've never been on the other side before.

 

Note - when I say not ready to go, I don't just mean putting a few more wagons on the tracks etc etc...

What I find odd about the specific example you mention is that they didn’t just put Gordon to one side and run something else to start off with, assuming the track/control equipment/electrics were OK (maybe they weren’t though). I always bring more locos than I need (if available) even when they’re reliable ones, just in case they are damaged in transit/overheat in service/develop an unexpected fluke fault (even though it’s unlikely). In any case I prefer to have two locos to do one job and alternate them hourly.

 

On the other hand, electrical issues with the layout itself might be more difficult to sort out and can happen even to very skilled and well-prepared modellers. I was talking to someone once (who is very good and who I look up to, both as a modeller and as a person) who described a situation with a layout they were once involved with that (iirc) suffered an electrical issue minutes before show opening that temporarily reduced operations to shunting a single train up and down the length of the layout (although I think they did manage to restore normal service later in the day).

 

From my own, slightly more slapdash experience - I used to enter the Dave Brewer Challenge at ExpoNG quite frequently, and for the years that involved building a working layout that was sometimes “interesting”, because by definition the layouts were built for the competition and hadn’t been exhibited before, and in my case were often finished at the last minute, although that’s perhaps slightly different from “proper” exhibiting. Aside from this, I did once do an exhibition on a very hot day where, as usual, I exhibited a selection of micro layouts. The one with T gauge track didn’t like the hot and slightly dusty surroundings and the track attracted a lot of dirt which didn’t help, and the lighting also failed (though it turned out later that this was due to wear and tear to a particular wire caused by the way it was mounted and was perhaps something I should have noticed beforehand, perhaps if I’d had more time to prepare that particular layout and not had to do as much on the others). The then-new 009 one also had some teething problems, which probably wouldn’t have become apparent outside the exhibition environment.

 

Not being ready on time for opening would seem to indicate bad planning but again I appreciate there can be delays, things can go wrong etc. etc., especially if the arrangements for unloading and setting up at the venue introduce delays which the exhibitor couldn’t have predicted (even if the organiser could). After 2 hours though it’s probably more likely to be an issue with the layout itself than the result of slightly over-optimistic time management.

[PaulRhB]

1 hour ago, Chris M said:

There are some layouts that are too big to be set up and tested at the owners house. This inevitably makes it harder to ensure the layout is fully prepared for an exhibition.

Yep my layout falls into that catergory!

 

1 hour ago, Chris M said:

thing that happens all too often is the layout operators don’t know how to run the layout. This should be avoided.

My large HOm hasn’t been out since Nov 2019 and I can’t set it up to train operators, it’s next show Is the 009 50th do at Statfold next week so around half my regular crew and backups are taking or helping on other layouts! I have a new operator as there is no other way to get a full complement so I’ll be spending my rest time doubling up until he’s up to speed. Oh and ones just had to drop out of the Sunday and the other new backup now can’t make it. Then there’s me recovering from an op so hopefully won’t keel over as a result! 
Life is chaotic 😉 we do the best we can but professionals we ain’t so I rely on the goodwill of at least five friends and sometimes a load of them get a late curveball! 😆

 

It’s just us playing trains trying to put on a show, sometimes the law of sod conspires against us 😉

Edited September 10, 2023 by PaulRhB

[brossard]

The proverbial sh*t happens.  I took my layout to the local railroad museum back in August for their special layout weekend.  I had just completed some wiring mods and did manage to test the layout at home before the show.  Everything worked then.

 

We usually arrive with the layout on Friday evening and it doesn't take long to set up.  After we had done that and started testing I was gutted to find one track without power.  Happily after scrabbling about under the board I found a broken solid core wire and a repair was jerry rigged.  We also had another piece of track without power (my fault, I forgot the dropper when the track was modified).  Some solder at the track joint sorted that.

 

The layout ran perfectly the whole weekend but I confess we got lucky.

 

I just spent the last two weeks basically rewiring the layout.  I got rid of as much solid core wire as I could and I have put droppers on the offending track mentioned above.  I am determined that the wiring will be as reliable as possible.

 

John

Edited September 10, 2023 by brossard

[Lemmy282]

Back in the 1970's I was part of the team exhibiting a very large 3 rail layout at the York show in the De Gray rooms. Next to us was an LNER branch terminus layout, possibly Em or P4, anyway the exhibition was over the Easter weekend, and as far a we could tell not a train moved at all. For the first day feverish attempts were made and lots of solder smoke was evident, slightly less activity on the second day. On the last day there was no one with it all day, and after we packed up our layout it was still there!

[Erichill16]

I think with large layouts there will always be an issue somewhere but its a case of managing the situation. For example not using a particular point or length of track and not letting the public know there’s an issue. 

I think I read somewhere that on most spaceshuttle launches there was a minor ‘issue’ that had to managed.

Edited September 10, 2023 by Erichill16
Spelling

[PaulRhB]

2 minutes ago, Erichill16 said:

 

I think I read somewhere that on most spaceshuttle launch there was a minor ‘issue’ that had to managed.

We have that, he’s called Mike 🤣

[Michael Hodgson]

30 minutes ago, Erichill16 said:

I think with large layouts there will always be an issue somewhere but its a case of managing the situation. For example not using a particular point or length of track and not letting the public know there’s an issue. 

 

You should follow prototype practice and run a replacement bus service

[SM42]

Our layouts were designed so that something could move if other bits failed  

A back up toolkit was essential and a soldering iron ( unplugged)  hung over one of the legs as a talisman. 

 

Operators were regulars with some back ups if one of them couldn't make it  

 

Did it work? Mostly 

 

However it has to be remembered that an exhibition layout has a tough life. 

 

It gets loaded into and then bounces around in vans or cars, get put up, taken down, plugged in, unplugged, gets warm, gets cold  and spends at around 10 hours being used intensively over a weekend. 

 

The stock has the same hard life. 

 

Breakages and failures are a fact of life. 

 

The other possible problems are traffic and breakdowns delaying arrival.

 

Layouts arriving with barely 20 minutes before show opening has happened at our show and credit to them they had something running 10 minutes after opening.

 

 

The exhibition circuit is a challenging environment for layouts, stock, vehicles and operators. 

 

We've had members  find the stock box has been left at home and even on  one memorable  occasion  the fidfdle yard

 

Things happen. 

 

Andy

[Erichill16]

42 minutes ago, PaulRhB said:

We have that, he’s called Mike 🤣

I think most clubs have ‘issues’!

[Invicta]

There's always the potential human error factor- I've never exhibited in my own right, but some years ago spent a fair few weekends behind a couple of clubmates' layouts at shows. I think the biggest drama I can recall was doing a fairly local show about 25 miles away, and we were travelling in two cars. We were about half-way there when we got a text from  the other car, asking  "have you got the station buildings, or have we?" Basically ,the main station building, canopy, goods shed and signal box were all removable from the layout, and travelled in a separate box- which was still in the layout owner's garage.... After he'd made a detour back home to retrieve the buildings box, while we pressed on to start setting up the half of the layout that was in our car, we made it by the skin of our teeth- IIRC we'd just got everything connected up and were still putting stock on the layout when the doors opened to let the punters in....

[john new]

S*** happens.

 

Not my error but I do recall a modeller I won’t name arriving into the Knavesmire suite, checking the show guide pack to find his stand location to discover he’d loaded the wrong layout.

 

Also at one of the Oxford shows with Mike Cook many, many, years back, miscommunication during unloading meant a transit got backed over part of a layout that had been put onto the ground behind said van. (Luckily not ours or our fault).

 

Daftest error of mine, got to the venue in plenty of time about twenty years ago to discover I had left the box trailer keys at home! Frantic call home, luckily we had two cars. Met my wife half way between home and venue. Was up and running a single train about 10 mins late with the rest of the stock then unpacked and railed.
 

The other daft error was once forgetting a pair of trestles*, local Screwfix purchase on way back to hotel fixed that for Saturday opening. A stupid error, I had split the folding hinges (action forgotten) and counted four and put four legs in the car - yes only two whole trestles. Not bad for about 40 years of various events.

 

Even with a check list errors will happen.

 

* for one of the stock tables. The legs can be either top hinged as an A frame or side hinged as an L frame. Splittable hinges.

 

Edited September 11, 2023 by john new
clarity

[roundhouse]

2 hours ago, PaulRhB said:

Yep my layout falls into that catergory!

 

My large HOm hasn’t been out since Nov 2019 and I can’t set it up to train operators, it’s next show Is the 009 50th do at Statfold next week so around half my regular crew and backups are taking or helping on other layouts! I have a new operator as there is no other way to get a full complement so I’ll be spending my rest time doubling up until he’s up to speed. Oh and ones just had to drop out of the Sunday and the other new backup now can’t make it. Then there’s me recovering from an op so hopefully won’t keel over as a result! 
Life is chaotic 😉 we do the best we can but professionals we ain’t so I rely on the goodwill of at least five friends and sometimes a load of them get a late curveball! 😆

 

It’s just us playing trains trying to put on a show, sometimes the law of sod conspires against us 😉

Our last show , we kept the accomodation and expenses to a minimum, so just me and my other half travelled with two local to the venue operators instead of the normal three plus me. Whilst my other half doesn't generally operate the layout, she does help set up and more importantly drive the car as these days I cant do long distance driving by my self. Just aswell as when we swapped over 'half way' we then had to divert due to an accident and  my part of the drive took 4 hours instead of 2 hours. Got to the venue and just me and my other half to unload and set up. Luckily this was early Friday afternoon. However a fiddelyard turnout had completely lost a point blade despite checking these boards before loading the day before. Never had a Peco turnout do this in the 40+ years of doing shows so no spare with me   but luckily a friend had a spare.I now have spares in my toolbox.  If that had been our usual Saturday morning set up then we wouldn't have been ready to run trains.

 

So that was sorted on the Friday to then get a call that one of our local to the show operators had Covid and despite trying to find another we were down to just one operater each shift instead of the normal two. This much reduced the number of trains being run on the Saturday. Luckily we did manage to have a full operating crew on the Sunday.

 

Another show closer to home but still over an hours drive, we keep the expenses down by setting up on the Saturday with a full crew but the venue opens the doors at 8 am for set up and due to the queue waiting, by the time  we get inside we don't start setting up till about 8.20 am but the show opens for advance ticket holders at 9.30 am. We normally allow 2 hours set up time for the larger layouts so this does make it very tight. One time, we did not quite get all the stock set up by opening so had one or two people comment that it wasnt good enough. I kept saying ' never again' re that show but once set up its a good show and we enjoy it despite the journey home on the Sunday evening often taking twice as long as it should.

 

Anyway, Paul enjoy Statfold . Would love to visit but we have a show this weekend.

[BR60103]

Our club's first two shows were in a hotel in downtown Toronto on the umpteenth floor.  The elevator we were using on Saturday morning was the same one that room service and housekeeping used. 

 

[darrel]

Imagine you take the layout out of the club room put it in a van transport it to the exhibition set it up in the hall, in the winter with the hall doors open test the layout it all works. Overnight the doors in the hall are closed and the hall heats up the track expands and in the morning when you start running the layout before the doors open.... you find all sorts of issues that were nor there the night before. It's happened before to one or two of our layouts 

[The Johnster]

6 hours ago, SR71 said:

I never cease to be amazed by people who turn up at a show with box of untested locos and stock with dirty wheels.

 

'Ran perfectly last time I used it, hasn't been out of the box since, so there can't be anything wrong with it' yeah, but that was two years ago, the lubricant has gone solid and expansion and contraction from temperature changes in the garage you stored it in have affected electrical connections. 

 

5 hours ago, Chris M said:

The thing that happens all too often is the layout operators don’t know how to run the layout. This should be avoided

 

A major problem in my view.  A BLT with a fairly simple track plan should be reasonably easy to manage from cold with any operating system, but more complex layouts need training and experience, as well as a standard and effective means of communicating between operators (not bell codes, please!).

 

But requiring complex arrangements of tracks requiring alignments across board joins with a plethora of electrical connections to perform predictably in a range of different environments with differing levels of temperature, humidity, floor types (I once exhibited in a hall with a suspended dancing floor, not a good idea), and a variety of neigbours (at another, a general modelling show with exhibits other than railways, the layout was repeatedly hit by 1/24th R/C cars at speed and, allegedly, 'out of control', resulting in derailments and a few coupling breakages until one of them got accidentally 'stepped on') is asking a lot.  It is inevitable that things will go wrong, and they will go wrong at embarrassing times and when the bloke who knows how to fix it is absent, or, worse, in the bar.

 

One sees layouts at shows with complex track layouts and sidings or yards to run into, but only the up and down main are in use, sometimes by the same circling trains.  It is not difficult to suspect that most of it doesn't work, and that most of the stock you can see in the fiddle yard doesn't work either, and that the operators, not paying any attention to the trains and involved in their own conversations, mugs of tea, and sausage rolls, and who probably don't know how to set the road for the colliery reception or whatever, have more or less given up, as these are  the only locos and stock present that can be trusted to run reliably.  Clearly, the stock has not been tested beforehand on this layout, though it may well perform perfectly at home, and the layout hasn't been test run for all the possible shunting movements because the deadline beat it.  Our club layout at one show lost the down main, and a member's breakdown crane was posed on it and left there for the show.

 

Operator training and exhaustive pre-testing of any locos or stock allowed to run on the layout should be a prequisite, but I was for a long time a member of a club that effectively ignored this aspect despite my warnings while insisting imposing it's own back-to-back specification, track/flangeway profile, and couplings standards believing that that that would be enough to ensure good running.  It's a step in the right direction, but only a step.

[Rhys]

A couple from the other side of the planet(NZ). We were once invited to an exhibition in Christchurch (1990's) and thought why not. As we were in Wellington (the other side of Cook straight, think the English channel with a serious attitude problem) it was not overly simple. After looking at all the options we shipped our layout with a local shipping company in return for some advertising (now thats a level above brave) and we flew with all our kit. Layout turned up at the venue before we did and setup was easy. However we didn't check anything ran before we left for the night. Our electrickery guru had rewired the layout before we left (and had stayed at home). Saturday morning 30 minutes before the doors open and theres a dead short. With 10 minutes to go we are under the layout cutting wires untill something moves. 5 minutes to go and theres life and we get a train running round. Rest of the morning is a limited sevice with some soldering to undo the slash and burn. We did it again the next year without the drama.

Going home we were at the airport when I was pointed out the "don't carry this onboard" display. After ticking off 1/2 of them in our carry on luggage I just thought "well, we got it all down here" and didn't say a word. No issues on the way home The layout was shipped back in an empty container and returned home smelling slightly of fish....

The other one is when my younger brother while doing some emergency soldering triped 1/2 the fuses in the stadium.

[Chris M]

To a large degree it is all about having rules and working to them. Here are mine:-

1. Some weeks before the event know who is going to be in charge; especially important for club layouts. 

2. Know who is coming and what stock they are bringing before the event. This is important to provide sensible set of stock for the layout. I'm very strict on this and my operators would never dare bring along any stock without prior approval.

3. All locos must be properly tested and wheels cleaned before the exhibition.  Merely testing that a loco goes round and round on an oval of track is not good enough. How is the slow running? How does it go over points? If a loco doesn't get an A then it doesn't go to the exhibition.

4. If an item of stock gives any trouble at an exhibition then immediately remove it. DO NOT FIDDLE WITH IT WHILE THE EXHIBITION IS OPEN. Sometimes a loco can be fixed and tested after closure on Saturday ready for Sunday but the best place for a troublesome item is in its box ready for the journey home.

5. Always give yourself an hour or more spare time when setting up - you might well need it if a fault has mysteriously appeared during transit. Or even worse a building has been clunked during transit.

6. Always make sure you have a complete tool set. For me this include a couple of spare controllers ( I actually had to use a spare on Sunday), various types of glue, a few (often nearly empty) bags of various types of Woodland Scenics greenery. This can disguise any number of issues that have suddenly arisen.

7. Give the layout a careful visual check as well as a track test. Sometimes things go wrong with the scenery and you just don't notice.

9. The person in charge of the layout must check that the layout is correctly assembled and that all power leads are made as safe as possible - i.e. no trip hazzards.

10. Make sure all the operators know what the layout is about so they have a chance of talking sensibly to any visitors.

11. Make sure everyone running the layout has the phone number of the person in charge of the layout. You can guarantee that if something is going to go wrong it will be when one operator is there by them self.

 

All simple and obvious stuff, but I think important.

 

For me a good exhibition is when everything runs well and I get an invite or two to take the layout to other shows. I also love chatting with the visitors while my operators do all the work! If you take your layout to a few exhibitions and don't get invited elsewhere then maybe you need to take a long hard look at your layout and how you run it at exhibitions.