Hattons Model Railways to close

[phil-b259]

13 hours ago, RJS1977 said:

 

But the majority of cars, clothes, and food sold nationally aren't at the luxury end, even though they may be of a higher spec than years gone by.

 

 

 

Model trains are a hobby - they are not a life essential!

 

Nobody is entitled to be guaranteed to be able to afford to partake of the hobby any more than everyone is entitled to be able to afford to play golf or go fishing or own a Playstation games console.

 

If that means model railways become a 'luxury hobby' then so be it - its called living in a capitalist society, where other than the basics in life, we leave things up to the power market forces to do as they see fit.

 

It might sound harsh, but the reality is if you can't afford it thats your problem and nobody else's - least of all retailers or manufacturers. It only becomes a problem (for them) if sales (in terms of profit - which is not the same thing as number of sales made) continues to meet the requirements of the owners or shareholders who the company ultimately exists to serve.

 

Given the trends over the past few years with several manufacturers joining the ranks favouring high quality, feature packed and high priced items products I then its not unreasonable to conclude that the hobby still offers significant opportunities to make money even if some end up being excluded from starting / continuing with the hobby.

 

 

 

Edited January 10 by phil-b259

[fezza]

Very sad to hear this news. The staff have always been great and I hope their expertise finds work elsewhere. I am sure it will.

 

We've seen a lot of model shops close in the north west despite the fact there is a vibrant model railway scene in the region and that retail real estate costs are often lower than elsewhere in the country.  It is a puzzle.  It seems even those that offer an excellent online offer like Hattons are not immune.

 

I do sometimes worry higher prices have produced a smaller market that might ultimately cause problems for retailers. Having said that there is still a lot of choice out there across the hobby. I recently picked up a sweet running Mainline Peak for £35.  I could have spent £150 on a DCC ready Bachmann version or £220 on a DCC sound Bachmann version. There is still stuff out there in shops for every pocket if you look.

 

 

[Steamport Southport]

2 hours ago, adb968008 said:

 
ironic but isnt the old Hattons smith downroad premises a Tea Shop ?

 

Yep. More of a licensed eatery which has things like bands and DJ sets than a tea shop. Aiming more for a student and middle class clientele.

 

But they did need substantial building work to get it usable again. It was literally falling down!

 

https://www.thisisleaf.co.uk/smithdown-rd

 

 

 

Jason

[Bernard Lamb]

7 hours ago, fezza said:

Very sad to hear this news. The staff have always been great and I hope their expertise finds work elsewhere. I am sure it will.

 

We've seen a lot of model shops close in the north west despite the fact there is a vibrant model railway scene in the region and that retail real estate costs are often lower than elsewhere in the country.  It is a puzzle.  It seems even those that offer an excellent online offer like Hattons are not immune.

 

I do sometimes worry higher prices have produced a smaller market that might ultimately cause problems for retailers. Having said that there is still a lot of choice out there across the hobby. I recently picked up a sweet running Mainline Peak for £35.  I could have spent £150 on a DCC ready Bachmann version or £220 on a DCC sound Bachmann version. There is still stuff out there in shops for every pocket if you look.

 

 

That is part of the irony, If you offer an excellent service, it has an impact on the bottom line. With four impacts on sustainability all hitting Hattons in a short space of time, thay have been forced into making a decision. One option would have been to lower standards and they clearly seem not to want to  go down that road. All praise and honour to them for making that decision. Others would have reacted differently. To me it does not bode well for the future of the hobby.

My own dealings this year show the small imact I have had on the situation. One order cancelled by Hattons as the supplier cut their delivery. One order that I had forgotten about did not appear when other suppliers and customers had received the items. I oredered from the manufacturer three weeks after release of the prosduct. A week later I heard  from Hattons that they now had the items in stock. That was two orders they lost, through no fault of theirs. If a large number of customers had similar problems then it would soon be affecting Hattons.

Bernard 

[jjb1970]

I admit I myself am now speculating, but I suspect the decision to close is an informed one, that they have considered various possibilities (changing their business model, restructuring,  selling the business etc) and concluded (I suspect with a heavy heart) that a controlled exit while they're still in a reasonable position is the most appropriate way forward.  And I think they deserve respect for that.

[adb968008]

8 hours ago, phil-b259 said:

Given the trends over the past few years with several manufacturers joining the ranks favouring high quality, feature packed and high priced items products I then its not unreasonable to conclude that the hobby still offers significant opportunities to make money even if some end up being excluded from starting / continuing with the hobby.

the hobby has a very low bar, less than £50 can get you started at the s/h market.

Theres really not many who could be excluded.

[Izzy]

Having been in conversation recently with a local model shop owner about trading levels, all the various factors in play,  I am naturally saddened but not overly surprised about this news. Given the excellent level of service Hattons have given over the years all I can do is wish both the owners and staff all the best with whatever comes next for them.

 

Bob

Edited January 10 by Izzy
spelling! auto correct grrr..

[Mike Bellamy]

15 hours ago, melmerby said:

Large batches of stock (hundreds) have vanished from the website in the last couple of hours.

13 hours ago, johnofwessex said:

Well there are a lot of plain black 0 gauge Terriers for sale if anyone's interested!

 

256 when I looked a few minutes ago - but they did not show in the same search yesterday and so some stock is still being added . . . . . . 

.

[DavidH]

14 hours ago, John M Upton said:

The fact remains that in this Internet age, high street retail is dead, we have become a nation of coffee shops and very little else.

 

Oh ye prophet of doom fear not for a light of hope shineth yet in the darkness ... people are still shopping in towns and cities with stuffed shopping bags in a way that suggests they haven't noticed your total lack of "very little else".

[melmerby]

11 hours ago, RJS1977 said:

 

But the majority of cars, clothes, and food sold nationally aren't at the luxury end, even though they may be of a higher spec than years gone by.

 

The most succesful UK clothes retailer is Primark, cheap and cheerful. A subsidary of a food company.

The most successful part of M&S, primarily a clothes retailer, is their food halls.

 

Make of that what you will.

[scots region]

Is it bad that I want to cry over a shop? 

[Bucoops]

13 minutes ago, melmerby said:

The most succesful UK clothes retailer is Primark, cheap and cheerful. A subsidary of a food company.

The most successful part of M&S, primarily a clothes retailer, is their food halls.

 

Make of that what you will.

 

I will mull that over when having my lunch.

[phil-b259]

26 minutes ago, melmerby said:

The most succesful UK clothes retailer is Primark, cheap and cheerful. A subsidary of a food company.

The most successful part of M&S, primarily a clothes retailer, is their food halls.

 

Make of that what you will.

Primark has deliberately NOT set up an internet based sales platform so that distorts the issue as people HAVE to visit a physical store to get access to the product. If they did offer online ordering I bet their store footfall would be decimated.

 

Consequently they are problematic when it comes to making comparisons because competitors DO use online sales and this will represent a higher chunk of their income while the physical stores will see lower footfall and be more of a drag finically.

M&S food is seen by consumers (and M&S themselves - who can forget the “this is not just X - it’s an M&S X” tagline they have been using for decades) as luxury / high end food.

 

(Moreover M&S are not unique - in many ways John Lewis is the same with their Waitrose food division performing better than the non food department store side).
 

Demographically speaking M&S food customers (along with Waitrose customers) are those with plenty of disposable income while those who shop at Asda tend to be those with less disposable income (Hence Asda’s marketing slogans “that’s Asda price” which drew attention to that aspect of their business)

 

 

What is somewhat remarkable is the way Lidil and Aldi have managed to pinch market share from both the luxuary end (Waitrose, M&S) and the middle - low end chains like Sainsbury’s, Morrisons, Tesco, Asda). However a closer examination will show that although both types of shopper use the discounters - they use it in different ways. A traditional M&S customer will typically use a discounted for basics like cleaning products - but still buy upmarket food from M&S for example.

 

Edited January 10 by phil-b259

[ruggedpeak]

If possible can we avoid this thread becoming about things that are are nothing to do with Hattons closing.

 

Thanks 🙂

[Jol Wilkinson]

14 minutes ago, melmerby said:

The most succesful UK clothes retailer is Primark, cheap and cheerful. A subsidary of a food company.

The most successful part of M&S, primarily a clothes retailer, is their food halls.

 

Make of that what you will.

 

Simply an indication that buyers are often attracted to the perceived lowest price offering.

 

In model railways, retailers have come and gone over the years. The Fratton Bargain Shop was one of the earliest I can recall to take large adverts in Railway Modeller offering discounted prices (although I haven't bought RTR for decades so haven't followed such thing that closely). Others joined in and as the internet developed things seemed to get more competitive. Those retailers with a strong financial footing were able to grow, those without often fell by the wayside as they didn't have the funds, staff and/or space to compete. The winners in this were the consumers who were readily able to buy from wherever they chose, rather than rely on their local shop.

 

Hattons are closing down for whatever reasons they have. Others, probably the already established larger online retailers, will pick up the pieces as buyers continue to seek competitive (low) prices and efficient service, although these two don't always go hand in hand.

[Phil Parker]

2 minutes ago, ruggedpeak said:

If possible can we avoid this thread becoming about things that are are nothing to do with Hattons closing.

 

Thanks 🙂

 

Please. Issues with the high street aren't really relevant in the case of a business based away from said high-street, and with a prominent online presence.

[Right Away]

The news of Hatton’s closure of business is very sad and a possible “wake-up call”, not just to other retailers but to us customers alike.

Like many, I have enjoyed peerless service from Hattons over the years, indeed as I have from all the model retailers I have done business with.

 

That’s it, just to say, “THANK YOU, HATTONS”

[Oldddudders]

We all wish it weren't happening, but I'm not clear what we need to 'wake up' to. This thread is awash with positive testimonials and tributes to multiple positive aspects of the Hattons 'experience' - yet it was all evidently inadequate to ensure a worthwhile future. 

 

As others have pointed out, this isn't necessarily a gipsy's warning about the entire model retail trade - every shop has its own financial model and can make the same calculations on future prospects. We, the consumer, can only continue to flash the cash as we see fit, and be relatively confident that there will always be dealers of some sort out there ready to receive our orders. 

 

Don't panic and keep spending. 

[ColinB]

I think before the tier system came in I had very many pre orders with Hattons, generally Hattons for Hornby, Rails for all makes. I then started getting the EMails saying that they could not fulfil my pre orders because Hornby had stopped supplying them with new models. I must have had at least 4 pre orders with them and I am sure I was one of many. So after that they no longer became a firm to deal with for pre orders, I bought a lot of their specials class 66s locos and Genesis. My class 66s were ok, very good value for money. I am sure that many were like me and basically didn't buy anymore Hornby off them for fear of not getting them. The ironic thing is, looking at Hornby's fire sale I suspect they would be thankful for a Retailer like Hattons, sadly no more.

[ClaughtonSteve]

Just to add my ten pennyworth, it is sad to see such an institution go, but unlike a lot of retailers, restaurants, etc that have gone recently and many more that I suspect are about to go, Hattons are going with their heads held high.   They have not called in the the receiver or liquidator and will leave the retail market without debts to besmirch their name.  Having looked at their recent accounts I can fully understand why they have decided to close.  Whilst Hattons Originals tooling may be snapped up by another manufacturer, recent history shows that retail businesses have very little residual value, Wilco being a good recent example of this.  There will many good business  reasons for closing now, apart from the quadruple storm (Brexit, Covid, Ukraine and now the Middle East) that has hit businesses over the last five years, so don't be surprised if the other majors in our hobby review their business models.

So, all I can do is thank everybody at Hattons for their service over the years and wish all there the best for the future.

Steve

Edited January 10 by ClaughtonSteve

[James Makin]

Aside from the upcoming Warwells, I've put in an order for some more of their Hattons branded decoders - they are fantastic and I'd urge others to take a look before it's too late. This was certainly a good innovation to start marketing their own range and offer modellers a cheap alternative to chips aside from the well-known DCC brands of the time.  One ironic legacy is that the Hattons brand will live on inside the hearts of over 75% of my DCC-fitted fleet for many years to come.

 

I will certainly also cherish the free pens being given away by their stands at shows too

 

 

Cheers,

James

[big jim]

5 minutes ago, James Makin said:

Aside from the upcoming Warwells……

I’ve just tried to add some more warwells to my existing order but it says ‘sold out on preorder’ so I don’t want to risk changing it from 3 to 6 then the order getting cancelled completely

 

Here’s hoping someone else takes the tooling over when the dust has settled 

 

[Guest]

just thinking of all the retailers that used to be in the merseyside and surrounding area during mid to late 70's and there was no doubt more - were the likes of the following

hattons at 180 smithdown 

beatties in st johns precinct

city models 

the model shop between clayton square and church st that did a lot of meccano - think it was called hobbies

vanguards on queens drive

birkenhead model shop

alec green's also on oxton rd who did Hornby and raleigh bikes

marriotts also on oxton rd who did hardware/household and lima 

peter toner's on seaview rd in liscard who did Hornby and think was also a bike shop

the model shop in runcorn

the model shop in ellesmere port who did mainly aero modelling but was useful for supplies and humbrol

the arts and crafts model shop down below in the rows in chester with the steep creaking staircase

 

then there were numourous  other toy shops that sold Hornby and sweet and tobacconist stores who sold the airfix kit range - what happened to them all - suppose you could say in one way as happened with grocers and supermarkets that hattons probably swallowed a lot of the trade up as the smaller retailers just couldnt compete on price and its a trait of mankind that no one likes paying over the odds for anything - whatever hattons and all the others had and have been responsible for bringing a feeling of wellbeing and smiles to so many over the years 

 

Edited January 10 by 25081

[melmerby]

9 minutes ago, James Makin said:

I've put in an order for some more of their Hattons branded decoders - they are fantastic and I'd urge others to take a look before it's too late. This was certainly a good innovation to start marketing their own range and offer modellers a cheap alternative to chips aside from the well-known DCC brands of the time. 

Not tried Zimo or Lenz? Only typically £20

Their are reports of reliability problems with the Hattons decoders, so personally I stick to the dedicated decoder makers

[melmerby]

2 minutes ago, 25081 said:

just thinking of all the retailers that used to be in the merseyside and surrounding area during mid to late 70's and there was no doubt more - were the likes of the following

hattons at 180 smithdown 

beatties in st johns precinct

city models 

the model shop between clayton square and church st that did a lot of meccano - think it was called hobbies

vanguards on queens drive

birkenhead model shop

alec green's also on oxton rd who did Hornby and raleigh bikes

marriotts also on oxton rd who did hardware/household and lima 

peter toner's on seaview rd in liscard who did Hornby and think was also a bike shop

the model shop in runcorn

the model shop in ellesmere port who did mainly aero modelling but was useful for supplies and humbrol

the model shop down below in the rows in chester 

 

then there were numourous  other toy shops that sold Hornby and sweet and tobacconist stores who sold the airfix kit range - what happened to them all - suppose you could say in one way as happened with grocers and supermarkets that hattons probably swallowed a lot of the trade up as the smaller retailers just couldnt compete on price and its a trait of mankind that no one likes paying over the odds for anything - whatever hattons and all the others had and have been responsible for bringing a feeling of wellbeing and smiles to so many over the years 

 

Buying habits change.

It applies to lots of retail shops

Most High streets now seem to be all Vape shops, Coffee shops, Charity shops, Trainer shops and Bargain shops.

 

As well as the decline of Model shops I can add another: Hobby electronics outlets.

There used to be loads of them around the country, none at all now AFAIK.