Horsetan Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 I can't wait to see what Dapol make of the 4mm scale Western. The RTR market has been blessed with three attempts so far - each of them with their own unique blend of errors, so I understand. It's going to be great. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennine MC Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 The RTR market has been blessed with three attempts so far - Four. Trix/Lilliput, Lima, Hornby, Heljan. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Four. Trix/Lilliput, Lima, Hornby, Heljan. I stand corrected. Four it is. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bigherb Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Except the Trix Western was to 3.8mm scale. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugd1022 Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 As for the battery box doors, again, read AC's books...WR control told WR depots to change the original pear drop design to the new design asap after Talisman came off the rails on Dec 19, 1973...Curtis even produces archive stuff detailing the modification number and the size of the new clips, we must read up chaps! Ah, but not everyone has the Adrian Curtis books, or wants them, or knows where to get them from.... his writing style is an acquired taste which has put off a few people I know from buying them, but they are a great source of info, granted. As good as they are, there are still several mistakes in his photo captions (dates and places mostly but that's ok). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mark Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 I hope if Dapol do put an outer cup bearing on the middle axle that there is some means of allowing it to move vertically to accomodate any irregular track work. Not too much of a problem for 00 but a real pain in P4. With regard to the battery box doors, my preference would be for the original clips to be provided in preference to the post 1973 modifications. The vast majority of the life of the class was with the original clips, which allows for all livery variants. It would be quite easy for individuals to add a small piece of micro-strip for the modified version, but not very easy to retro fit the original pattern. Regards Mark Humphrys Why would that matter, so long as the external appearance conforms to the prototype? In general on models, we don't worry about the stuff we cannot see, so long as what is on view looks right; exhibit 1, large DC electric motor in a space normally occupied by a diesel engine block. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Andy Y Posted February 22, 2011 Author Share Posted February 22, 2011 At last, does nobody read Adrian Curtis's books - if you did this thread would have been a waste of time. Such an apt username to dispense condescension . I also note that you seem to have a tendency to mention his products at every opportunity. I do hope that this is not self-publicity masquerading behind an anonymous email address. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennine MC Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 Except the Trix Western was to 3.8mm scale. Oh do you know, I'd have put money on some bright spark pointing that out. It was used by 4mm modellers, ergo its inclusion is valid AFAIC; if you ever meet someone who models exclusively to 3.8mm scale, do let me know Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
'CHARD Posted February 22, 2011 Share Posted February 22, 2011 come on chaps, get to grips with it. YES, SIR! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted February 22, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 22, 2011 Why would that matter, so long as the external appearance conforms to the prototype? In general on models, we don't worry about the stuff we cannot see, so long as what is on view looks right; exhibit 1, large DC electric motor in a space normally occupied by a diesel engine block. I quite agree that we don't worry about stuff we can't see but as far as I can see it could possibly mean something having to be either overthickness or externally overwide in order to accommodate the bearing? I don't know the size of the bearing cups but as the axle centreline is a bit higher than the centre line of the beam carrying the coil springs it might be possible to hide the bearing where the beam is a bit wider and there is of course the 'meatier' area above where the body is riding on the bogie. But it does seem a bit odd to bother with an outside bearing on one axle when the other two have inside bearings - possibly a way of improving sideplay for smaller radius curves? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
craigwelsh Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 But it does seem a bit odd to bother with an outside bearing on one axle when the other two have inside bearings - possibly a way of improving sideplay for smaller radius curves? Actually i'd have thought it'd make it worse, the middle axle is really the only one that needs sideplay and most diesels have that built in with inside bearings - the wiper pickups centre. The outer axles could do with being constrained more to avoid the brake shoes (unless you go for the Stove R method ). As Mark said you also need upward travel on the centre axle, something Bachmann have missed on their AWD and especially bad when you get a banana bogie to start with. Heljan had the right idea with their A-1-A arrangement really as it was simple, cheap and effective. Unless this is some N-gauge thing we 4mm modellers shouldn't really worry about . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 Actually, I am very curious generally about this proposal to put pinpoint bearings on centre motor diesel chassis. They don't need low friction drives, the space for a relatively large motor to overcome drag within the drive train does the job. (It might make some sense if the drive train is reversible with bevel gears or similar to turn the drive instead of worms; with pick up through pinpoints that would potentially bestow a very smooth coasting performance. But then again with widespread adoption of DCC, and coasting thereby no longer required from the mechanism because it may be simulated electronically, the need for this low friction characteristic appears to me to be going obsolescent. Perhaps there is some aspect I have missed, someone here will doubtless put me right. With centre motor shaft drive from numerous manufacturers (including B, He and Ho in the UK OO sector) reliably delivering smooth and quiet performance from a variety of inside bearing designs, the need for any different arrangement strikes me as questionable.) Mixing inside and outside bearings on the Western is going to place an extra design and asembly burden on the bogie structure. Instead of three pairs of bearings of one design in a common plane, this requires two pairs of bearings of one type, and another pair of another type, to be colocated in the same effective plane when carrying load. Why add complexity when simpler alternatives are proven? The good old KISS principle, boring to some perhaps, but to those of us with a utilitarian streak, very attractive. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DapolDave Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 Hi everyone, Just a quick note to let you know that today we have published the revised 'un-modified' Hall names / numbers and liveries for the first batch of loco's out in a couple of months. They are; 5935 Norton Hall in unlined with G W R lettering on tender ND135A 6923 Leighton Hall in lined GWR green G (crest) W on tender ND135B 6910 Gossington Hall lined black livery early crest ND135C 6952 Kimberley Hall BR lined green late crest ND135D Please also note our re-use of the product numbers alocated for the modified ones (which will take up a different number range when formally announced). All stockists with an e-mail registered at Dapol have been notified, as have the press and hard copies of the release will be going to all stockists (not just those without e-mail) soon. cheers Dave Dapol Ltd Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold jcmjcm Posted February 24, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 24, 2011 6923 Leighton Hall in lined GWR green G (crest) W on tender ND135B Dave Please check the number of Leighton Hall several sources such as http://www.greatwest...ames_namesl.htm give the number as 6953 Best Regards JCM Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted February 24, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 24, 2011 Dave Please check the number of Leighton Hall several sources such as http://www.greatwest...ames_namesl.htm give the number as 6953 Best Regards JCM Presumably a typo - 'Leighton Hall was indeed 6953, and of course spent some of its time as an oil burner 1946-47. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 Presumably a typo - 'Leighton Hall was indeed 6953, and of course spent some of its time as an oil burner 1946-47. Presumably a typo, or do you have better information, Mike? RCTS has 4/47 to 9/48. Of course, it was then renumbered 3953. Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted February 24, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 24, 2011 Presumably a typo, or do you have better information, Mike? RCTS has 4/47 to 9/48. Of course, it was then renumbered 3953. Nick Nick - every source I've got shows it as 6953 (or, as you pointed out, 3953 for a short while) so I presume it was just a typo in the number (in one edition of the Ian Allan ABC 6923 and 6953 are on the same line so it could have been a misread if that was the source?). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
buffalo Posted February 24, 2011 Share Posted February 24, 2011 Sorry, Mike, slight misunderstanding. I wasn't disputing the number which my sources also agree on but, with tongue firmly in cheek, was questioning whether your dates were a typo Nick Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted February 24, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 24, 2011 Sorry, Mike, slight misunderstanding. I wasn't disputing the number which my sources also agree on but, with tongue firmly in cheek, was questioning whether your dates were a typo Nick They were indeed a trypo - sorry Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
DavidB-AU Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 I'm a bit puzzled about the choice of numbers/names. Only 1 of the 4 represents the 60% of the class built before WW2. None appear to be representative of the significant number of Halls allocated to the West of England. The four models in the era each wore that livery seem to concentrate around Old Oak Common, Reading, Didcot and Oxford. Leighton Hall with GW crest tender is a curious choice. 6953 ran unnamed until 1947 and was named only one month before conversion to oil firing. It was converted back to coal after Nationalisation. In other words I hope they are easy to renumber! Cheers David Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted February 25, 2011 Share Posted February 25, 2011 Dapol usually base their choice of prototypes on photographs so that is probably where the decisions were made. I do not know if they are cast in stone but if certain choices are not good representatives of the prototype then I suggest contacting Dapol. The best thing to do is offer constructive advice. If a certain prototype only existed in that particular condition for a short period of time then try supplying a photo of another prototype in the same/similar livery that lasted longer. Dapol are fairly approachable but constructive advice is likely to be much better received than a simple criticism of their choices. 6910 Gossington Hall lined black livery early crest ND135C Woohoo! Nice to see that lined black has made the final cut. The only problem is that now I have to budget for that as well as a GWR green one. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
97403_Ixion Posted March 5, 2011 Share Posted March 5, 2011 Hi all, I cannot find mention of these on here, so here goes: Osborns Models are commissioning D1000 Western Enterprise in Desert Sand and 5900 Hinderton Hall in GWR green - both in N-gauge The Western well and truly ordered and also tempted by a Hinderton Hall too Great news! Cheers, Ixion. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium brushman47544 Posted March 7, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 7, 2011 Hi all, I cannot find mention of these on here, so here goes: Osborns Models are commissioning D1000 Western Enterprise in Desert Sand and 5900 Hinderton Hall in GWR green - both in N-gauge The Western well and truly ordered and also tempted by a Hinderton Hall too Great news! Cheers, Ixion. Very interesting about the Western. Price £106.95, number and nameplates and plaques pre-fitted, and November 2011 delivery. I wonder how this translates for the OO scale models, which were supposed to appear first IIRC? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted June 10, 2011 Share Posted June 10, 2011 This thread has been a bit quiet lately so I thought I would post this production sample picture of Norton Hall. I hope DapolDave does not mind me stealing his thunder. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted June 10, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted June 10, 2011 There is a picture of the haul on the n gauge soc's exhibition thread as well for those who might not have seen this. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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