Horsetan Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 ....pre-order sellout. ... I still have difficulty with this. Does it only sell-out purely to pre-orders? In which case, it only demonstrates that it's all about the hype rather than any substance. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted January 22, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 22, 2014 A manufacturer makes a certain number. They invite orders from the retail trade who will order as many as they think they can sell plus (in most cases at least) a handful of "spares" in case of returned faulty ones. If the production run is fully ordered or over-subscribed then the manufacturer may advise it is "Sold out in advance" or a similar phrase. In other words you might not be able to purchase one over the counter if all the retailer stock is also assigned to advance orders. If Dapol were to say the Westerns were sold out to pre-orders there may or may not still be some unspoken-for at a retailer. But you can bet they'll be snapped up very quickly. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 ....I've never quite understood why people succumb to the faux-exclusive hype of pre-ordering anything. All it seems to do is ensure you get disappointed quicker than everyone else. I've done it once, on the basis that this was a model I had never been able to complete to a satisfactory standard by my own efforts, the NRM is worth supporting, likely to be popular in my estimation, therefore worth a punt. I'll do so again if a GNR large atlantic or Stirling single are announced by the same team; for the very same reasons. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jon020 Posted January 22, 2014 Share Posted January 22, 2014 (edited) ....I've never quite understood why people succumb to the faux-exclusive hype of pre-ordering anything. All it seems to do is ensure you get disappointed quicker than everyone else. I'd had a discussion with DD at Ally Pally regarding the options that would "then" have been available; that concluded with the decision that the products as advertised would fullfil my requirements and I pre-orded to show my support for the product line which was still in early production development. I cancelled, when it seemed that the QA issues were mounting and the control of the QA problems was not being shown to be managed in a manner that I would expect for a product manufactured in the UK under appropriate QMS control. I realist that this is not relevant and I'm not opening old issues here... but there was some suggestion that manufacturing issues related to the drawings/inctructions not being followed (or perhaps not sufficiently detailed?) that when these were discussed on here.. the same person that I'd discussed the product with at AP suggested that I'd better cancel my pre-order... so I did. I've waited a while for the next batch and now I have one. I still worry about the QA issues and I do feel that the wiring I've seen on top of the chassis looks less than perfect ... but we'll see! The product does look good... but it needs to be engineeringly solid when I start to dismantle to "work" on it... as I said, we'll see! So far, I've taken the body off and tried (and failed) to remove the small electrical connector (PCB to lights) as I can't see how to release it - so hopefully someone will explain this at some point ... before I try it again. Jon Edited January 22, 2014 by Jon020 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
chopper20059 Posted January 28, 2014 Share Posted January 28, 2014 (edited) Class 52 D1058 Western Nobleman was delivered this morning, just had been running it in for about 20 mins when it slowed right down and stopped with strong smell of electrical burning back to supplier in the morning Replacement arrived test run for 45 mins each way no problems fantastic model. Edited January 28, 2014 by chopper20059 4 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Johnfromoz Posted January 30, 2014 Share Posted January 30, 2014 Time for a 'why oh why' rant with Dapol, having just received my third western with stupid, avoidable faults (this time with all lighting circuits wired in reverse to loco movement. Just for once, it would be nice to anticipate a quality model at well over one hundred notes in cost. Come on Dapol, we support you by buying these things, despite a shaky start. Get your act together!! John Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted January 30, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 30, 2014 (edited) If I had any amount of hair I would perhaps have torn some out earlier tonight. Five Dapol Westerns form the major part of the "1000" fleet here with a quartet of Heljan ones having seen little use since their newer sisters arrived. The minor niggles such as very slight waddling (one loco, one end only) and the fiddly fitting of parts (avoided for the most part on the Kernow limited editions) have been lived with and not of consequence so far as my locos are concerned. Until tonight when testing for a running day whereupon three of the five insisted on derailing. An hour of careful observation hasn't definitively identified the cause. They do it at the same spots every trip and whatever the train. Favoured theories are the long run of warm weather having caused the loco components to expand just sufficiently that some thing is (or things are) catching as the bogies swing and ride the track work (there is slight but audible plasticky clicking on one loco), that the warm weather has caused a minuscule change in the track geometry (perfectly plausible after a couple of weeks of 30-plus days and one of 40-plus) or simply that the locos are not enduring what is a normal level of use on the layout. I favour a bit of items 1 and 2 both being at work. One loco works OK in one direction but not the other. Increasing the cant in the track at one curve has eliminated the problem there but has not stopped the same locos derailing elsewhere. In all cases it is the leading wheel set on the lead bogie which rides up and clear of the rail head leading to disaster. I've had the same problem with Bachmann class 66 locos which was fixed by rebalancing the bogies. I'll keep you posted. But overall I'm still impressed with the locos. Edited January 30, 2014 by Gwiwer Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium SJR Posted February 3, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 3, 2014 If I had any amount of hair I would perhaps have torn some out earlier tonight. Five Dapol Westerns form the major part of the "1000" fleet here with a quartet of Heljan ones having seen little use since their newer sisters arrived. The minor niggles such as very slight waddling (one loco, one end only) and the fiddly fitting of parts (avoided for the most part on the Kernow limited editions) have been lived with and not of consequence so far as my locos are concerned. Until tonight when testing for a running day whereupon three of the five insisted on derailing. An hour of careful observation hasn't definitively identified the cause. They do it at the same spots every trip and whatever the train. Favoured theories are the long run of warm weather having caused the loco components to expand just sufficiently that some thing is (or things are) catching as the bogies swing and ride the track work (there is slight but audible plasticky clicking on one loco), that the warm weather has caused a minuscule change in the track geometry (perfectly plausible after a couple of weeks of 30-plus days and one of 40-plus) or simply that the locos are not enduring what is a normal level of use on the layout. I favour a bit of items 1 and 2 both being at work. One loco works OK in one direction but not the other. Increasing the cant in the track at one curve has eliminated the problem there but has not stopped the same locos derailing elsewhere. In all cases it is the leading wheel set on the lead bogie which rides up and clear of the rail head leading to disaster. I've had the same problem with Bachmann class 66 locos which was fixed by rebalancing the bogies. I'll keep you posted. But overall I'm still impressed with the locos. Hi Gwiwer, I had a similar experience with Western Princess from Kernow Model Centre. For some reason (not obvious to the naked eye) it would not negotiate a curved SMP turnout on my layout where as no other locos experienced any difficulties including sister locomotive Western Sovereign. On its first trip back to Cornwall Kernow's adjusted the back-to-backs but to no avail; on the second visit they replaced the chassis. This solved the problem and 1042 now traverses the turnout no problem. It is a great model' just a shame it required so much effort and expense to make it work. Regards simon Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted February 3, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 3, 2014 Still not 100% sure what it is, but it's only affecting the locos with cab steps and speedo cables added. Which suggests something is catching just fractionally on one of the steps (because the cables are out of harms way in terms of bogie swing) and I only need to trace that to rectify the problem. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Horsetan Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 ....Come on Dapol, we support you by buying these things, despite a shaky start. Get your act together!! The one person who could have ensured that, left the building a while ago...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
the penguin of doom Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 The one person who could have ensured that, left the building a while ago...... Elvis???..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold tetsudofan Posted February 3, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 3, 2014 I've purchased four of the Dapol Westerns - dessert sand, green, maroon and blue versions. All have received SouthWest Digital decoders. All have run perfectly apart from the blue version which ran perfectly the first day of purchase. Second day the sound fired up, lights on, power applied, the motor responded building up speed, blowing it's horn, slowed down, brakes squealed.....only problem was that the loco did not move at all during this sequence. Loco was returned to the retailer who decided to send the loco to DCC Supplies who said they could find nothing wrong with the loco and returned it to the retailer. The retailer then fitted a new sound decoder and returned to loco to me having told me it was working. Upon receipt the loco was placed on the track and, just as before, it just sat there making all nice noises that a SouthWest Digital decoder does. Movement was non-existant. Before anybody says it must be my track, my digital equipment, my this, my that I do have three other Dapol Westerns fitted with same equipment that work on my track. Getting a little cheesed off by this time (especially having three other working Westerns fitted with the same decoders) contact was made with DCC Supplies to discuss my problems with the Triage Tepartment..... No, there is nothing wrong with the loco. Have you tested the loco on dcc? No. Why? Because a dcc sound decoder is add-on fitment. But the loco does not move when a dcc decoder is fitted.... oh really, that means the decoder must be faulty....... We then started going round and round in circles.... but getting nowhere. To cut a long story short I did manage to get a return-post label out of the Triage Department (and that was probably only because I also had a very recently purchased dead Cl.22 to return). The Cl.22 was returned to me and is now working perfectly even after the fitting of a sound decoder. The Western was returned to the retailer who then fitted another sound decoder......and again the loco would not move.... Since then the loco has resided with the retailer. I was offered my money back but I turned this down as I wanted a working Western with sound, not a refund. One idea was to wait until the second release of these locos arrived and swap my old loco for a new loco ..... but having read of the above failures that have been reported above think it is now time for me to pull the plug...... give up on the thought of a blue Western with sound and take up the refund offer. Shame, it's a beautiful looking model..... Keith Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Phil Bullock Posted February 3, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 3, 2014 Still not 100% sure what it is, but it's only affecting the locos with cab steps and speedo cables added. Which suggests something is catching just fractionally on one of the steps (because the cables are out of harms way in terms of bogie swing) and I only need to trace that to rectify the problem. Shortening the cab steps slightly by trimming the mounting blocks should increase clearances and probably solve this problem - we have had to do this on ours Cheers Phil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
steveb860 Posted February 3, 2014 Share Posted February 3, 2014 Shortening the cab steps slightly by trimming the mounting blocks should increase clearances and probably solve this problem - we have had to do this on ours Cheers Phil Rather annoyingly, my three have had their steps fixed in place with a spot of varnish to keep them in place, now they catch on the bogies when negotiating curves. Apart from this minor niggle, I think they are superb. Will have to free the steps and adjust as you suggest, Phil. Btw, is it you I keep seeing in CMC causing merry hell about your reserved covhops being on Trevs van !!! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Phil Bullock Posted February 4, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 4, 2014 Yup that's me! Phil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Enterprisingwestern Posted February 4, 2014 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 4, 2014 Aha, that's why I couldn't have any Covhops at Southampton then? Mike. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
westerner Posted February 16, 2014 Share Posted February 16, 2014 Paul and Heiter One assumes the back to backs have been checked in both cases? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium brushman47544 Posted February 20, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 20, 2014 Good news, for Geoff Endacott in particular, is that the latest version in BR blue - D1072 Western Glory - appears to have the original battery box clips https://railsofsheffield.com/class-52-western-glory-d1072-br-blue-full-yellow-ends-4d-003-005-JJJA25768.aspx Just bought a Nobleman, named as Ambassador - so will have to save up now. BTW, I used the Precision Labels L41 3.6mm self-adhesive headcodes stuck on the outside and they look spot-on to me. The 4mm ones would IMHO be too big. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Nobby (John) Posted March 12, 2014 Share Posted March 12, 2014 Bought my first blue Western, put it on track to test, buzzed a bit and then dead as a Dodo. Western Glory did not live up to its name........ Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
southernelectric Posted March 13, 2014 Share Posted March 13, 2014 (edited) Bought my first blue Western, put it on track to test, buzzed a bit and then dead as a Dodo. Western Glory did not live up to its name........ What is it with the QC on these models? I would really like another maroon with SYP, having got the WLA Western Courier Limited Edition model. Tested it out on a rolling road for a few hours, seemed OK but I'm dreading testing all three of mine over pointwork, which is a trad tricky for me as I don't have a permanent layout. The first blue one I got (Venturer) wouldn't even stay on a short section of straight test track. In the end I got a new loco from Dapol via DCC Supplies but not after it had been sent back, 'repaired' and then sent back to me still not right. Going to have to get the Hornby VSOE set out, set up the trackmat on top of my Scalextric layout in the garage, then test all three of mine out over points. I have a Western Champion limited edition on pre-order with Cheltenham Model Centre. Seriously thinking of cancelling. My confidence in these models, reading the problems on here, is somewhat diminished. And then there's Heiter's comments about fixing the derailment problems. Unbelievable!!! Come on Dapol, sort this out!!! The consumer should NOT have to fix problems with the locos that should not have come out of the factory like this. Sort out the flipping QC and this kind of s*** won't be necessary. Rant over. Anyone from Dapol on here like to comment now that Dapol Dave is not Dapol Dave these days? Edited March 13, 2014 by southernelectric Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Silver Sidelines Posted March 13, 2014 Share Posted March 13, 2014 I guess it all depends on whether you want to sit and look at it - or run it. (Whisper my Heljan Westerns - pre China - just go on and on and on). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
southernelectric Posted March 13, 2014 Share Posted March 13, 2014 I guess it all depends on whether you want to sit and look at it - or run it. (Whisper my Heljan Westerns - pre China - just go on and on and on). Ultimately Ray, I want to run them! But that won't be on a regular basis until I have a permanent layout built. EPIC permanent layout it will have to be too, given how much stuff I've acquired in anticipation :-) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Gwiwer Posted March 13, 2014 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 13, 2014 Quality control does seem to be an issue for some of these models and I wonder whether there is any greater proportion of them considered faulty compared with similar offerings from other manufacturers. I have been quite lucky in that none of mine exhibits significant problems. True I have a slight waddle on one loco at one end and one sounds coggy but runs smoothly. It's true I encountered derailing problems until I identified a tiny point of contact between bogie and fixed suspension mouldings and again when I fitted the cab steps. But all those contacts arise because we are offered almost a precision-quality model at a bulk ready-to-run price. Manufacturing tolerances might not be equal to the original plans; all through development Dave Jones was keen to include as much accurate detail as he could and this results in a model with extremely fine tolerances. They don't like uneven track as a consequence of that though they do go through first-radius reverse curves. And they do manage my outdoor track which has develop a few lumps and bumps over the years thanks to the environment it is in. A couple of small shims under the track to give a little cant have helped keep them aboard on curves. There should be no excuse for models which simply fail to work out of the box although there will likely always be a few lemons in a batch. You get that with top of the range cars costing six-figure sums as well - it's not confined to model trains. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
D1056WesternSultan Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 Dapol D1056 Western Sultan did NOT like Peco code 75 so it was returned and returned and finally returned at the retailers expense...It cost me £8.00 for the privelage and that's another customer TMC have lost.... You can't blame TMC for the build quality. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
D1056WesternSultan Posted March 14, 2014 Share Posted March 14, 2014 Having come back to this topic after a short absence I remain faithful to the Heljan western despite it's slight flaws. At least they don't derail and blow up. And they can be bought for considerably less than the Dapol version. I shall stick at one Dapol Western , D1062 Western Courier, which I am very happy with. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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