Bachmann E4

[Market65]

Well the E4's are lovely, but have they sold? Still full price in the local shops, and still on the shelves.

 

With regards,

 

Rob.

[Forester]

I have to say I am a bit miffed that the E4 is now being sold at a price very close to the one I originally ordered at but which the same shop refused to honour when it arrived in stock.

 

It was my decision to accept and pay the much higher price asked. I'm not blaming anyone else. But in response I've changed my buying habits.

 

I don't pre-order any longer and won't buy "ordinary" freight and mixed traffic locos within the price lock period. I still make a judgement with named express locos on what the demand will be and whether they will sell out quickly.

 

I can see both sides of the issue but I'm not sure anyone will benefit in the long term from the general loss of confidence in pre-order prices and supply. Short term profits may rise but in the long term loss of trust is bad for business.

Just my view.

[darren01]

Hi

The thing is that everyone rushed to buy one thinking that if they did not get one now then they will miss out,so people were prepared to pay the new price.

Now the price has dropped down to what they were originally were going to be , i think some maybe a little annoyed by this.

I stopped doing pre orders  and i am happy to wait a few months and see if the price come down a bit and not get caught up in the must get it now mentality.

[it's-er]

I wonder if we can generalise off Bachamnn's SR E4? The first production runs of their L&Y 2-4-2T and LMS 1F 0-6-0T completely sold out, and seem to be unavailable anywhere. A second production run of the L&Y 2-4-2T has just reached the shops, so these are available, but if you want one of the first run, they don't seem to be anywhere. The LMS 1F 0-6-0T seems to be completely unavailable now, though a second run is coming sometime.

 

Did they produce more of the SR E4? Or are they just not as popular? I'd be interested to know.

 

John

[JSpencer]

I did not rush to buy either a 1F nor L&Y tank. They too hanged around for a good few months before finally being sold.

 

That said the E4 was not exactly high on any wish lists and even I was surprised Bachmann did this loco rather than the far more popular H class or Adams radial.

[miles73128]

Yes, I cancelled all my pre-orders for locos (4) Birdcages (6) and LNER teak coaches (4) when this ridiculous price protection period came in. I'd rather miss out than risk paying more for a model that subsequently drops in price. Plus I rather enjoy the game of outwitting Bachmann! Let's see who blinks first!

Hi

The thing is that everyone rushed to buy one thinking that if they did not get one now then they will miss out,so people were prepared to pay the new price.

Now the price has dropped down to what they were originally were going to be , i think some maybe a little annoyed by this.

I stopped doing pre orders and i am happy to wait a few months and see if the price come down a bit and not get caught up in the must get it now mentality.

[No Decorum]

Yes, I cancelled all my pre-orders for locos (4) Birdcages (6) and LNER teak coaches (4) when this ridiculous price protection period came in. I'd rather miss out than risk paying more for a model that subsequently drops in price. Plus I rather enjoy the game of outwitting Bachmann! Let's see who blinks first!

I'm all in favour of lower prices and bargains. However, of recent models, the E4 is the one I've been most happy with and I was willing to pay a higher price rather than take the risk of not getting one. I managed to secure the original Wainwright C by acting quickly. If I hadn't, I probably wouldn't have one at all because of the high price they command in the second-hand market.

Edited October 17, 2015 by No Decorum

[Ian Hargrave]

I think the message from the above postings is that you have to keep a close eye on the state of the market from day to day. Since the release and rise.....and rise.....of the original Wainwright C there does appear to be a "levelling off" in sales .Hence,if you are prepared to wait a little longer....as has already been posted here.....prices will fall on new stock.This has happened recently with both Bachmann and Hornby.Apart from limited production runs,it appears the bubble of "must have" new releases has burst.....that is,of course,for the time being.You'd need a crystal ball to determine what might happen in a few months or a year's time.

[Oldddudders]

I did not rush to buy either a 1F nor L&Y tank. They too hanged around for a good few months before finally being sold.

That said the E4 was not exactly high on any wish lists and even I was surprised Bachmann did this loco rather than the far more popular H class or Adams radial.

I believe an 0-6-2T is rather easier to engineer than either an 0-4-4T or a 4-4-2T.

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

...Apart from limited production runs,it appears the bubble of "must have" new releases has burst...

It's very subject dependent. Probably best not to be in the path of any group of Swindebeests when the expected 4-6-0 with the steam roller look about it is released.

[Ian Hargrave]

It's very subject dependent. Probably best not to be in the path of any group of Swindebeests when the expected 4-6-0 with the steam roller look about it is released.

You think so ? There seems to be an avalanche of newly-tooled Kings ( I take that to be the subject of your quaintly amusing sideswipe at those devoted to the GWR ) which will keep all but those who desire a streamlined version happy for many a day.There have in any case been gut rumblings re: Hornby's anaemic new offering which might possibly herald (or maybe not) a downward turn in price.

[miles73128]

I'm all in favour of lower prices and bargains. However, of recent models, the E4 is the one I've been most happy with and I was willing to pay a higher price rather than take the risk of not getting one. I managed to secure the original Wainwright C by acting quickly. If I hadn't, I probably wouldn't have one at all because of the high price they command in the second-hand market.

Now £69.99 at Model Railways Direct!

[No Decorum]

Now £69.99 at Model Railways Direct!

I'm surrounded by four walls. Which should I bash my head against?

[Andy Y]

I honestly don't understand how some people can't comprehend a simple concept. Retailers charge a price which isn't too far removed from each other when any product (not just model railways) is newly released. Depending how many they bought and how many customers they have determines whether they sell out before the last customer who comes through the door asking for one. If you've got more than your customers need you may have to reduce the price if you bought too many or the product isn't as much in demand as anticipated.

 

http://youtu.be/8Xjr2hnOHiM?t=1m49s

 

If you want something you've either got to make sure you get it or, like Scorpio, prepare to take a chance that you may never know whether there's enough stock on the shelves for you to take the last one.

[amdaley]

I wasn't interested but when the price dropped to £80 I bought an umber model.Lovely model.

If it was something I really wanted then I might have bought earlier but there is a price limit I won't go past.

Everyone is different.

[Clearwater]

If you want something you've either got to make sure you get it or, like Scorpio, prepare to take a chance that you may never know whether there's enough stock on the shelves for you to take the last one.

I'd note that on MRD's website there are none of the southern green ones.. Illustrates Andy's point nearly. I wonder if that sold better as that's the livery the prototype is currently wearing on the Bluebell!

[JeremyKarl]

I wasn't interested but when the price dropped to £80 I bought an umber model.Lovely model.

If it was something I really wanted then I might have bought earlier but there is a price limit I won't go past.

Everyone is different.

Likewise - I bought the olive green version very early one as I wanted to be sure of getting one, then I stumped up for a late crest BR version and finally succumbed to the umber version as a luxury extra when the price reached £80 last week when a well-known Liverpool shop broke ranks on the discounted price last week. No doubt if I had waited a few days, I could have paid £70 today, but then I might have been too late so it's all down to personal choice as Andy Y indicated above.

 

I note that the late crest one at around £70 sold like hot cakes today on MRD and were soon sold out in contrast to the less ornate early crest version - not a statistical survey, but based on this observation, I presume looks count for something (as with the ornate early C-class that also sold out so quickly).

 

Jeremy Karl.

[brushman47544]

I was surprised Bachmann did this loco rather than the far more popular H class or Adams radial.

 

I believe an 0-6-2T is rather easier to engineer than either an 0-4-4T or a 4-4-2T.

I hadn't thought about engineering difficulties with the H Class, but that aside I assumed Bachmann was steering clear on the assumption Hornby would already be doing it as another loco to go with their Pull-Push sets. I do hope I'm not going to be disappointed and it will appear reasonably soon from someone.

[No Decorum]

Hopefully the Bachmann collectors club Birch Grove is also selling slowly, it'll give me a chance to get some money together.

 

Nik

According to today's Bachmann Club e-newsletter, stock is now below 50.

[SDJR7F88]

Had my LBSC E4 out again the other day, and decided to do a bit of sound editing. 

Hope you enjoy!

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=AnFG2BCs5W8

[Pete47401]

I honestly don't understand how some people can't comprehend a simple concept. Retailers charge a price which isn't too far removed from each other when any product (not just model railways) is newly released. Depending how many they bought and how many customers they have determines whether they sell out before the last customer who comes through the door asking for one. If you've got more than your customers need you may have to reduce the price if you bought too many or the product isn't as much in demand as anticipated.

 

http://youtu.be/8Xjr2hnOHiM?t=1m49s

 

If you want something you've either got to make sure you get it or, like Scorpio, prepare to take a chance that you may never know whether there's enough stock on the shelves for you to take the last one.

 

I think most people can comprehend it. Members here seem like an intelligent bunch despite what you might think. Disingenuous maybe to imply that things have always been this way, yes there has always been discounting and yes people have always made mistakes and sometimes ordered too many of something but customers are really baulking at higher prices these days and say it will kill the market but the thing which has changed most of all is the now widespread expectation of future discounting. Several of my biggest and best customers now routinely say they will wait for prices to come down on pretty much any release by Heljan (though will be interesting if the steam prototypes follow the same pattern) and now increasingly on Hornby too. Bachmann not so much, as there is more scope for small retailers to be flexible on price without actually losing money. This never used to be the case.

 

Cannot blame any individual for wanting a bargain but it must ultimately be damaging when it reaches a point of people expecting them all the time.... our reps tell us it just isn't like this in the European market, people are happy to support new releases at RRP, don't know how true this is but the situation here is that we now won't hold stocks of models "on spec", just supply to definite customer orders and any spares just get rid of on eBay at cost. Why risk holding stocks of Heljan when they will appear on the sites of big model shops in 18 months time at prices we can never hope to match without taking a big loss? Why risk holding stocks of Hornby when some Black Friday promotion comes around and they undercut their own retailers? Why risk holding stocks of Bachmann when if you make a mistake and need to liquidate prior to the price fixing period being over you can't do so? 

 

Ultimately, assuming we aren't the only ones in this position, it means less orders up front for the manufacturers, less inclination to support a second run or livery of something if the first wasn't well supported and maybe less chance of a similar type of model being contemplated in future.

 

So we are out of new models, and sticking to secondhand.... sad. If the trade wants higher prices to stick then they have to stay firm on them otherwise people just won't get used to them or come to accept them as the norm.

 

Just my thoughts, based on 15 years of selling and lately seeing increasing customer resistance and expectation of price cutting which we aren't able to provide given reduced profit margins.

[JSpencer]

We should all pre order Bachmann, cancel them just when they come out, wait several weeks for the fix price period to go them buy the cheaper!

 

It should be noted my pre orders have dropped dramatically in recent times based on the fact that prices are fixed. I miss out on a few items but nothing to loose sleep over.

[The Bigbee Line]

Are we all that tight? Manufacturers need to cover costs etc. If I want a model, I take it on the chin and pre-order.

If later there are bargains, I might get another.

If I've over stocked I should get my investment back on eBay.

The E4 was a good choice. A good mixed traffic loco. Just need to get mine out of the box......

[Dunsignalling]

We should all pre order Bachmann, cancel them just when they come out, wait several weeks for the fix price period to go them buy the cheaper!

 

It should be noted my pre orders have dropped dramatically in recent times based on the fact that prices are fixed. I miss out on a few items but nothing to loose sleep over.

I model the non-electrified part of the South Western section of BR Southern Region with side-interests in overlapping bits of the WR and S&D .

 

Bachmann have, in the past, contributed much to the latter but surprisingly little to my core interest; BR Standards, Ivatt tanks and N's are about it. I've probably spent as much on coaches and wagons. Recently, paying full price for the tiny number of new models Bachmann produce "for me" has been easily financed by ignoring any that don't really "fit". I therefore bought a 64xx but not the E4 and C. 

 

Just as well, really, because, starting with Hornby's 700s, other manufacturers have begun to siphon my cash off at a fairly alarming rate, a situation that (happily) seems likely to continue for a few months yet.

 

I have quite a long list of pre-orders but, in the (anticipated) short term, Bachmann only feature in terms of one auto-coach, two parcels vans and a Wickham trolley - less than 5% of the total by value (I'm not including the re-chassised Ivatt tanks, because I'm beginning to doubt they will appear even next year).

 

John

Edited November 2, 2015 by Dunsignalling

[Pete47401]

Are we all that tight? Manufacturers need to cover costs etc. If I want a model, I take it on the chin and pre-order.

If later there are bargains, I might get another.

If I've over stocked I should get my investment back on eBay.

The E4 was a good choice. A good mixed traffic loco. Just need to get mine out of the box......

 

I think many people genuinely don't have that much money to spend, but I do wonder if it's more a matter of principle with others. Perhaps they have read too many headlines about "rip-off Britain" and have come to believe that items selling at anything near RRP is part of a wicked conspiracy against them.

 

A few years ago, if a £60 loco got discounted to £50 after a while it was no big deal, but with a a £125 loco today, people hope to pick it up for less than £100, makes a much bigger difference to the wallet now.