Hornby W1 Hush Hush

[Godfrey Glyn]

9 minutes ago, Dodger said:

I hope Simon Kohler is following this thread and perhaps as one respondent said in an earlier post Hornby would like to comment on the condition some of the models are in when received by the final customer in the chain.

If we keep accepting this state of affairs it will never be addressed - fire a letter or email to Hornby complaining.

Stay safe,

Roger  

I suspect that those retailers who do check their stock before sending them out and who have discovered damaged locos will have been on to Hornby straight away. Clearly it would appear that like a few other heavy loco models from other manufacturers the packaging is not adequate to the task.

As regards those retailers who did not check their stock before sending it out; it takes the same time for a small retailer to check each loco as it does for a large retailer. I don't accept the argument that the large retailer cannot do it. The only reason could be that they are offering a more competitive price and so make less profit on each sale and have factored that into the customer care service they offer. In that case the buyer is taking a risk that may not be quite so sensible for them in the long term.

 

All the best

Godfrey

[Fair Oak Junction]

28 minutes ago, Godfrey Glyn said:

The only reason could be that they are offering a more competitive price and so make less profit on each sale and have factored that into the customer care service they offer. In that case the buyer is taking a risk that may not be quite so sensible for them in the long term.

 

Yes well hindsight is always 20/20. Certainly in my case I didn't buy the W1 from the retailer I chose because of some sense of loyalty, or because they were charging less. It was purely because at the time I ordered they were one of the few places that actually had stock. Yes maybe I could have shopped around, but I couldn't have known when I placed the order that they wouldn't check the loco; and by the time I found that out the order was being processed. While I probably could have cancelled there was no guarantee I'd find one elsewhere. Probably I'm a complete idiot for taking it for granted that the shop would be able to help me or maybe I was massively naive in ordering a loco that I knew had potential problems, but whatever it's done now.

Edited December 12, 2021 by Obsidian Quarry

[cctransuk]

2 hours ago, 828CC said:

It does seems some are just taking Hornby's sealed boxes and shunting them straight out the door .....

 

..... or, in the case of direct sales, Hornby may even be having the said sealed boxes delivered directly to the fulfilment sub-contractor, so that the goods in question never actually enter Hornby premises! This is the way that many companies operate nowadays - very little, if any, involvement in the manufacture and distribution process.

 

It WILL come back and bite Hornby in the end - and keeping their heads down and hoping the furore dies down will NOT mitigate against the loss of trust which now embroils them.

 

Their perceived failure to fulfil dealer orders in order to maximise direct sales, combined with allowing significant quantities of damaged product to come into the public arena, speaks of a company that is totally focussed on the bottom line of the company accounts, with no interest in the company reputation. Outsource as many aspects of hands-on involvement, and to hell with the customer!

 

Stand up and be counted - this is a total b*lls-up; (and by no means the first)! You cannot keep disappointing customers for expensive products in this way, and retain your market share.

 

CJI.

Edited December 12, 2021 by cctransuk

[zr2498]

1 hour ago, Ian Hargrave said:

I thought that China dictated packaging standards. Be that as it may,this whole area needs urgent attention from factory assembly line to UK retailing . Hornby have a good R&D team .They would do both Hornby and ourselves a favour if they’d devote some of their time to this .

The packaging capabilty for each new model should get equal importance when the initial samples are sent to Hornby for inspection and correction. Couple this with various amounts of handling (normal and abnormal) to optimise the packaging. Finally specify the minimum requirements for the method for goods to be shipped to the cusotmers. Again test this. It would be money well spent.

[Ian Hargrave]

1 hour ago, Dodger said:

I hope Simon Kohler is following this thread and perhaps as one respondent said in an earlier post Hornby would like to comment on the condition some of the models are in when received by the final customer in the chain.

If we keep accepting this state of affairs it will never be addressed - fire a letter or email to Hornby complaining.

Stay safe,

Roger  

Without wishing to dampen your admirable sentiments,Hornby ,including Simon,have been made aware of this many times over the past decade but seem to be either in collective denial or pass it off as a matter of rejects etc, as within acceptable limits. He used to post online regularly but no longer does.As I have already posted recently on this thread…..and others over the years…..this admittedly unacceptable state of affairs has been around a long time.

I'm beginning to believe it “goes with the territory “ when you decide to buy Hornby .They once had a presence on this forum but no longer. Do not expect any perusal by Hornby of this topic. Some find RMWEB not to their taste and there is a mistaken impression that everyone in the world of model railways follows us. Some don’t.

I wonder what response you’d receive if you emailed or wrote.Anyway,good luck with that.

 

[w4rrn]

We were very lucky looking at other folk’s experiences on here. Me and my son collected our R3840 from our local model shop yesterday and I’m happy to say it’s fine, the guy at the shop had previously checked it before to picked it up. He gave it a quick test run in the shop and it was fine. Once we got it home we then gave it a gentle 5 hour running in session on my sons railway. Superb model very happy with it.

 

Edited December 12, 2021 by w4rrn
Edit

[polybear]

19 minutes ago, Ian Hargrave said:

I'm beginning to believe it “goes with the territory “ when you decide to buy Hornby .They once had a presence on this forum but no longer. Do not expect any perusal by Hornby of this topic. Some find RMWEB not to their taste and there is a mistaken impression that everyone in the world of model railways follows us. Some don’t.

 

 

 

I fully expect that they do, but in the background without raising their heads above the Parapets...

[micklner]

3 minutes ago, Ian Hargrave said:

Without wishing to dampen your admirable sentiments,Hornby ,including Simon,have been made aware of this many times over the past decade but seem to be either in collective denial or pass it off as a matter of rejects etc, as within acceptable limits. He used to post online regularly but no longer does.As I have already posted recently on this thread…..and others over the years…..this admittedly unacceptable state of affairs has been around a long time.

I'm beginning to believe it “goes with the territory “ when you decide to buy Hornby .They once had a presence on this forum but no longer. Do not expect any perusal by Hornby of this topic. Some find RMWEB not to their taste and there is a mistaken impression that everyone in the world of model railways follows us. Some don’t.

I wonder what response you’d receive if you emailed or wrote.Anyway,good luck with that.

 

I made a comment on their Facebook page made  yesterday re this farce.

 

Reply,  apology, what they are going to do about the situation ?? Nope they deleted the post . Sums it up nicely .

[Paul.Uni]

2 minutes ago, micklner said:

I made a comment on their Facebook page made  yesterday re this farce.

 

Reply,  apology, what they are going to do about the situation ?? Nope they deleted the post . Sums it up nicely .

You mean this post? https://www.facebook.com/officialhornby/posts/10158091344365843

[828CC]

30 minutes ago, w4rrn said:

We were very lucky looking at other folk’s experiences on here. Me and my son collected our R3840 from our local model shop yesterday and I’m happy to say it’s fine, the guy at the shop had previously checked it before to picked it up. He gave it a quick test run in the shop and it was fine. Once we got it home we then gave it a gentle 5 hour running in session on my sons railway. Superb model very happy with it.

 

Can't deny I look at this and the other photos of pristine models with a certain degree of envy!   But.... I'm grateful you post them because they also give me the hope that the next one to appear on my doorstep will be in a similar condition...

Who needs a quiet life ?  :-)

[Ian Hargrave]

2 hours ago, rxj27 said:

I received my model preordered direct from Hornby after seemingly an age to get through Hermes distribution network. 

 

On arrival I noticed the smoke deflector was broken so immediately packed it back up again and emailed Hornby hoping they can replace it. 

 

The lack of stock got me thinking that if they can't replace it whether a repair would be noticeable if I just glued the smoke deflector back on. On second inspection I also noticed that the tender drawbar connection was also damaged which put pay to any hopes of just repairing the smoke deflector as the tender mounting is totally broken making the loco unusable.

 

Very disappointed. Just hope Hornby can sort something but I do feel for them as I expect this is going to hurt them financially (which they really don't need) with so many broken models out there.

Feel for them when this is nothing less than a self inflicted wound and something for which they are totally responsible ?  I think not.

[Steamport Southport]

3 hours ago, 828CC said:

I'm afraid that can only be summed up as poor service.  Again, perhaps they weren't expecting this (who would?), but they do have a duty of care towards their customer.....

 

How many models do you think the so called "box shifters" are processing. About 1000 just of these I would assume. Then all their other items.

 

I don't expect Currys to test my washing machine. It should work.

 

 

Jason

[ikks]

Over the years , the only  products I have had to return(from Australia) have been Hornby, two Brits and a Duchess, fortunately they were supplied by Hattons and replacements were quickly made available...........Message to Hornby, forget this silly tier system and get back to supporting retailers like Hattons and Rails, they actually sell your product.Mike

Edited December 12, 2021 by ikks

[Legend]

39 minutes ago, polybear said:

 

I fully expect that they do, but in the background without raising their heads above the Parapets...

If you were in marketing you would surely review these forums for feedback like this  and news of what you’re competitors are doing , unless you are misguided and believe you are so big it doesn’t matter .

 

This week  you have a direct comparison between Rails /Bachmann delivering their Caley 812 and Hornby delivering their W1 . Yes , I know one is much bigger than the other and appears more fragile , but they both cost around the same . I don’t think I’ve seen a single faulty loco in the 812 thread compared to on here .  The difference is stark . If I were Hornby I’d realise I have a problem .

 

Maybe they should have a big model shop doing distribution for them ……….you know someone like Hattons or Rails.  

[828CC]

12 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

How many models do you think the so called "box shifters" are processing. About 1000 just of these I would assume. Then all their other items.

 

I don't expect Currys to test my washing machine. It should work.

 

 

Jason

You're right.... It should work.  But if there's growing evidence that it might not, I would hope any retailer regardless of size would seek to reassure potential customers that their product is saleable and fit for purpose.

There are, mind you, plenty of alternate washing machines out there. 

 

[Ian Hargrave]

17 hours ago, Dodger said:

I have been reading the posts on this thread and have noticed their similarity to concerns on other websites relating to our hobby. Not all are attributed to Hornby or a specific model. I have returned to the hobby after a break of some 30 years,

and it appears this receiving damaged goods through the post was not as prevalent 30 years ago when as a rule models were purchased in person from a local model shop. In todays retail climate the use of couriers and the postal service is becoming the norm and notwithstanding the distance the models travel from manufacturer to the customer, it is no surprise that occurences of damage on receipt. I have also noticed that the lighter items such as rolling stock do not attract the same criticism although their transit conditions have been the same.

Packaging is no doubt a relevant contributor to the state the goods arrive in and it is to the sender of the goods that we must look to for the remedy. I suspect that the majority of damage occurs here in the UK with the exception of that caused during packing at the manufacturers. Unless the retailers up thier game I am afraid we will have to accept things as they are.

In my opinion a letter to the seller along with the goods returned would go a long way to putting this issue to rest.

Stay safe,

Roger

Roger          

I assume you’re talking mail order here ?
In defence of retailers,I think that’s grossly  unfair and I believe the damage is caused at the manufacturer by hurried clumsy packaging. Some retailers ,Derails is an example.do check and test before dispatch and in a perfect world many more could do so. Others ….and there certainly are some….have premises with no test facility.Be that as it may,the process of sending damaged goods back to Hornby is difficult,especially when a cash flow situation creates problems  for the business with refunds for dissatisfied customers at £200 each. And then they have to negotiate refunds from Hornby in addition. A hassle indeed. And there is no concrete evidence that as you appear to allude this is chiefly down to lack of due diligence on the part of the retailers. Indeed I am sure they would have something to say about that.. Advising the trade to “up its game” is insulting and far too simplistic a solution when there is a long fault chain from the UK to China 

 

 

[Ian Hargrave]

43 minutes ago, Legend said:

If you were in marketing you would surely review these forums for feedback like this  and news of what you’re competitors are doing , unless you are misguided and believe you are so big it doesn’t matter .

 

This week  you have a direct comparison between Rails /Bachmann delivering their Caley 812 and Hornby delivering their W1 . Yes , I know one is much bigger than the other and appears more fragile , but they both cost around the same . I don’t think I’ve seen a single faulty loco in the 812 thread compared to on here .  The difference is stark . If I were Hornby I’d realise I have a problem .

 

Maybe they should have a big model shop doing distribution for them ……….you know someone like Hattons or Rails.  

I get a strong impression they rely on other sources for feedback,ones more to their taste where maybe they hear what they want to hear rather than the direct cutting edge of RMWEB which they have shunned for quite a while.

Simon is a company man and no disgrace in that but maybe his somewhat Messianic approach to all things Hornby causes a somewhat one eyed approach…..except of course when a competitor rains on his parade in which case he’s wide awake with both barrels loaded

[micklner]

In this case he needs to urgently point both Barrels at either/both The Couriers or whoever is doing the packaging /designing the packaging in China .

It needs to be stopped now , or Hornby will be losing many future customers and whats left of their reputation after this fiasco.

[melmerby]

3 hours ago, rxj27 said:

 

So I'm not alone with having the tender drawbar the wrong way around, it should have the adjustment holes on the tender end.

That is a basic assembly fail.

 

I would still like to know why the close coupling assembly shown on the leaflet is not present.

[828CC]

14 minutes ago, micklner said:

In this case he needs to urgently point both Barrels at either/both The Couriers or whoever is doing the packaging /designing the packaging in China .

It needs to be stopped now , or Hornby will be losing many future customers and whats left of their reputation after this fiasco.

Hi fellow Essex LNER enthusiast!

Whilst I agree wholeheartedly with your first paragraph. not too sure about the second....

Yes, with so many returns they will lose money, which is bound to lead to internal repercussions.  And some sort of press statement ASAP wouldn't hurt either.

But, as for losing future customers?  Maybe if viable alternatives exist.  But to carry on the washing machine analogy started above, I can't see Zanussi coming up with a W1 any time soon, or Hotpoint for that matter!

Seriously though, we enthusiasts will always clamour for these 'out there' models of prototypes we'd never dreamed of seeing in the past.  Yes, I'm p*ssed off at the moment, but my two P2 orders still stand.....

[polybear]

Well I've now applied power (only via a couple of lengths of straight track and it runs quietly & very well, starting at something like 2.6v straight out of the box - I guess I'm one of the very lucky ones; I hope all those who are disappointed get their purchases sorted satisfactorily without too much hassle.

I'm not so sure about the pony truck arrangement though; having wheels that float about a 1mm above the rails just doesn't seem quite right to me - I look forward to the various "fixes" that I'm sure will follow.....

[Steamport Southport]

1 hour ago, 828CC said:

You're right.... It should work.  But if there's growing evidence that it might not, I would hope any retailer regardless of size would seek to reassure potential customers that their product is saleable and fit for purpose.

There are, mind you, plenty of alternate washing machines out there. 

 

 

But it shouldn't be the retailers checking these. That should be Hornby's QC.

 

I want my model BRAND NEW IN BOX, not having some junior member of staff pawing over it. If there's something wrong that's my onus to get sorted out.

 

Any retailer opening models are not getting my money I'm afraid.

 

 

Jason

[828CC]

9 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

But it shouldn't be the retailers checking these. That should be Hornby's QC.

 

I want my model BRAND NEW IN BOX, not having some junior member of staff pawing over it. If there's something wrong that's my onus to get sorted out.

 

Any retailer opening models are not getting my money I'm afraid.

 

 

Jason

Absolutely!  In an ideal world it shouldn't be necessary.  

But in this instance somebody has screwed up big time.  So if a visual check by the retailer at my request saves me the hassle of returning the model, then I'm more than okay with that...

Edited December 12, 2021 by 828CC
additional text

[andyman7]

I agree that it is frustrating that a number of these eagerly-awaited models appear to have suffered damage in transit. However, some of the comments seem to be a bit over the top in suggesting some cynical conspiracy by Hornby. Hornby will be the ones that need to shoulder the issue of returned models, and anyone with a defective item is entitled to a full refund. Remember the broken bogie issue on the Bachmann Class 90s? (Well maybe not as that's modern image) - it's not just the red box people that have problems.

 

Given the shortage in the original production run, Hornby will hopefully make an additional batch - they have done this with other recent sellouts, for example the maroon Ivatt Coronation. So hopefully even if an exchange is not possible now, you can get an example in a few months and Hornby will shoulder the cost of returns. They certainly don't benefit from these issues.

[atom3624]

There's a broken tender top grey W1 on Ebay with more than one day to run, currently at £310 + P&P ....

Fair enough, if that's what people are prepared to pay, their call.

Ridiculous!!

Al.