colin smith Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 That's why I think the Great Model Railway Challenge works. It shows groups of relatively normal identifiable characters having fun creating something in an accessible way that appeals to a wider range of people. Not super talented, super skilled modellers hand knitting their track, turning their own wheels on lathes or the like which admittedly has a place....the idea of some self appointed Don dribbling on about a model railway in the way McLeod does on Grand designs I suspect would not click with the kind of audience this show is reaching. I wouldn't even watch something like Grand Model Railway Designs if it reached the level of pretentiousness the building show does. Whereas I would love it. I'm an ex-architectural modelmaker and I agree that for the vast majority of people the buildings they work and live in are shoddy, dull, mass-produced crap. That is a massive problem and some TV show needs to be made examining why that is and what can be done about it. Hopefully Jonathan Meades would present it. But not all episodes of Grand Designs have been about people with bags of money: many have examined new-builds done very cheaply, but with imagination, and many have looked at restorations of historic properties. In particular, Grand Designs works for me because it is NOT about the ordinary. I'm not interested in ordinary or what ordinary people can achieve. If I want a role model I'm not going to choose someone ordinary. I'm happy with the tone of GMRC and the contest formula but would like a greater focus on the modelling of actual railways and less focus on gimmicks. The chief obstacle to doing that are the themes. If they used themes that lend themselves to the realistic modelling of actual railways, real or freelanced, and then reward the models for their verisimilitude rather than their gimmicks and you'd have a decent programme. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Hobby Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 I've often thought that the traditional train set with an oval of track is a bit lacking in imagination. It's supposed to give a beginner everything they need to get started I suspect the reason that set is like it is and doesn't have points is simply a cost factor... Also why if the person who's buying it can also get "track packs" to add to it... I have to say that at 5 years old I was quite happy with an oval to start with, as long as it worked that was all that mattered. I doubt anything has changed over the years. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zomboid Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 My first train-set (at age 5) had a siding. I didn't know what to do with it. That's changed now, but until I was about 10 high speed tail chasing and massive pile-ups were order of the day, so that set would have been fine for me. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jeff Smith Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 I bought my grandson a cheap US HO train set some years ago. Although it had a couple of points to form a loop the major problem was actually getting the all-bogie stock on the track. At least with the Hornby set it's much easier for little fingers to put the stock on. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginelane Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 The BARB figures for the first episode show over 1.25 million viewers. That’s more than Big Brother or even walking britains lost railways but less than Paddington station at about 1.7 million. That’s probably a very good start. It will be interesting to see how the figures settle down in future weeks. If figures remain over the 1 million mark I guess it will be seen as a successful. I know nothing about the TV industry or expectations for this programme. I hope it becomes an annual thing. Team Wakefield mobilising the population of Wakefield for the episode to be aired 2nd November. Will be visiting the pubs and clubs down the famous Westgate run to tune their tellies from Sky sports etc to Channel 5 on that Friday. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
muddy water Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 (edited) Sounds a great idea changing channels in the pubs. I wonder how many will last the whole hour? Hope it does not start a fight!! Maybe you could also do the same in any late night retail shop selling televisions? Edited October 21, 2018 by muddy water Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
wombatofludham Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 That set's aimed at the kids market and i doubt they are bothered about whether it's got a brake van or not (even if they actually know what one is!)... So it doesn't matter what it looks like as long as it works (it does) and is colourful to attract they market it's aimed at (it is)... End of story, really, if it was aimed at the serious modeller then I'd agree, but it isn't and does the job it's meant to... My first set was the Triang Snow Rescue set, full of gimmicks so many of you dislike, very colourful and not at all realistic. But it got me started in Model Railways and I'm still here 5 decades later... Horses of courses... I bought my niece, now age 6, a G scale battery operated set last Christmas, after Santa tipped me off she'd asked for one, and her favourite play mode is to set the train running carrying a load whilst she plays with the Playmobil figures and the farm animals she lays out around it, then stopping the train to change the load or put on the passenger carriage I bought her later. The key thing isn't the lack of operating potential, it's how in the child's imagination the train can become part of a wider play scenario whilst moving. It also subconsciously "normalises" the concept of trains and might develop into something bigger later on. My niece also likes buses having bought her two large scale vehicles, one a coach with opening doors and one a bendy-bus, again with opening doors. Those sort of "play features" are more important than the fact they are half the size they should be in relation to the train. Plus, when she decides to change the track layout, she can now run a rail replacement bus service. My brother on the other hand thinks I'm a bad influence on her. 7 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold gwrrob Posted October 21, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 21, 2018 (edited) The program has just been reviewed on Gogglebox and one of its contibutors commented " that we are all just little boys who haven't been laid yet" Edited October 21, 2018 by gwrrob Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
enginelane Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 The program has just been reviewed on Gogglebox and one of its contibutors commented " that we are all just little boys who haven't been laid yet" Bless and Gogglebox as well 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin2 Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 As an aside, I noticed that you used the phrase 'model railway geeks' which strikes me as the sort of belittling phrase this programme Sorry if the word "geek" is not appropriate - I did not mean it in a derogatory sense. I am very happy to be considered a computer programming geek and a model railway geek. What would be a better word? ...R 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Colin_McLeod Posted October 21, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 21, 2018 Sounds a great idea changing channels in the pubs. I wonder how many will last the whole hour? Hope it does not start a fight!! I can just see a bar room brawl over the merits of OO and HO. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jol Wilkinson Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 Sorry if the word "geek" is not appropriate - I did not mean it in a derogatory sense. I am very happy to be considered a computer programming geek and a model railway geek. What would be a better word? ...R Enthusiast? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Ben Posted October 21, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 21, 2018 Enthusiast? What he said. Or railway modeller, model railway builder, model train hobbyist, etc etc. There is no shortage - we have a very rich language! Cheers Ben A. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Coryton Posted October 21, 2018 RMweb Premium Share Posted October 21, 2018 The program has just been reviewed on Gogglebox and one of its contibutors commented " that we are all just little boys who haven't been laid yet" It's quite possible to enjoy both "hobbies"... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RJS1977 Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 Hello all, I don't accept this "fact" at all. To me the hobby is in a healthier position than I have ever known. There are RTR models of esoteric prototypes or one-offs, revised and improved versions of stalwarts, exciting developments in 0 gauge, crowdfunding methods enabling modellers to come together to self finance niche items, new scenic techniques such as laser cutting, download-and-print and static grass, DCC Sound and exciting developments happening in signals and control. Yes, the retail side is changing but retailers with vision and foresight are adapting and evolving. What this programme does is personalise the hobby - it's really about people, not bits of plastic. They're not mocked, or belittled, but shown using their skills to overcome challenges while having fun and enjoying themselves. I'd argue that in itself is more likely to grow the hobby than any number of detailed demonstrations of how to apply ballast, or how to build a card building, all of which can easily be found on You Tube. Cheers Ben A. It could be argued that the fact the model manufacturers are concentrating 99% of their effort on existing modellers through a) Introducing ever-more detailed re-tools of existing models to encourage people who own existing models to upgrade b) Producing models of ever-more obscure prototypes that only long-term enthusiasts would have heard of whilst only paying lip-service to attracting new blood into the hobby through entry-level models (particularly of contemporary prototypes), is a good indication that all is not well for the hobby. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcolm7mm Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 I thought it was a good use of a product that could easily be dismissed as toy like. Certain quicker than traditional methods, gaugemaster or woodland scenic? And does it count as pre built guagemaster i think does not count as a prebuild nor do figures fyi Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Dunsignalling Posted October 21, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 21, 2018 (edited) It could be argued that the fact the model manufacturers are concentrating 99% of their effort on existing modellers through a) Introducing ever-more detailed re-tools of existing models to encourage people who own existing models to upgrade b) Producing models of ever-more obscure prototypes that only long-term enthusiasts would have heard of whilst only paying lip-service to attracting new blood into the hobby through entry-level models (particularly of contemporary prototypes), is a good indication that all is not well for the hobby. Certain assumptions being made here? a) Re-tools of popular existing models are just as applicable to the wants of newcomers as established customers who have earlier versions. b) Assuming a (relative) lack of nostalgia in those new to the hobby (those with a strong draw in that direction presumably gave in long ago) the obscurity or otherwise of individual prototypes is probably less of a factor than being able to assemble a complete train that "goes together". If one fancies the Lyme Regis branch, for instance, one train pack from Hornby and a dozen suitable wagons pretty much gets you there. c) What constitutes an "entry level" model is determined by whether one means kids or adults and, from what I see, those interested in the "contemporary scene" are generally more concerned with accumulating memories and photographs of it, which may translate into a desire/intention to model it some time in the future. 'twas ever thus, IMHO. Most youngsters these days become familiar with preserved steam long before they encounter the main-line network. Therefore, the likelihood of them choosing to model "modern" is, in no way, a foregone conclusion. John Edited October 21, 2018 by Dunsignalling 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Malcolm7mm Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 (edited) God no. I'm all for a variety of prototypes and scales and I'm irritated that apart from a couple of bits of N gauge and OO9 everyone has gone for British outline OO. I love foreign railways and especially narrow gauge and like different scale combinations. More obscure the better. For example, I'd have done the movie challenge as High Noon in Fn3. But whatever the prototype, for me the emphasis is on translating that prototype into model form with a degree of verisimilitude. GMRC has almost no proptype element at all and gives the impression model railways exists in a bubble completely separate from real railways. this was always in oo permission for n gauge if required Edited October 21, 2018 by Malcolm7mm Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Jol Wilkinson Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 whilst only paying lip-service to attracting new blood into the hobby through entry-level models (particularly of contemporary prototypes), is a good indication that all is not well for the hobby. Perhaps it is an indication of where the RTR manufacturers believe the easiest/softest market is. Attracting new entrants to the hobby is rather an unknown science. Gone are the days when most young boys wanted a train set for Christmas, which they could buy in the local toy shop. How would you recreate that demand and how would you get the product in front of them. Arguably model railway shows do more to attract newcomers through shows nowadays, although it isn't necessarily top of their priorities. The fact that they are chasing revenue from punters through the door means that they often have family orientated layouts (Thomas, etc.) rather than they are trying to attract newcomers into the hobby. Why haven't Hornby, Bachmann or the others sponsored/provided a "starter" style layout to tour local shows? 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEAMYAKIMA Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 What he said. Or railway modeller, model railway builder, model train hobbyist, etc etc. There is no shortage - we have a very rich language! Cheers Ben A. What he said. Or railway modeller, model railway builder, model train hobbyist, etc etc. There is no shortage - we have a very rich language! Cheers Ben A. What he said. Or railway modeller, model railway builder, model train hobbyist, etc etc. There is no shortage - we have a very rich language! Cheers Ben A. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Zomboid Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 It's quite possible to enjoy both "hobbies"...Though not at the same time 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Phil Parker Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 It could be argued that the fact the model manufacturers are concentrating 99% of their effort on existing modellers through a) Introducing ever-more detailed re-tools of existing models to encourage people who own existing models to upgrade b) Producing models of ever-more obscure prototypes that only long-term enthusiasts would have heard of whilst only paying lip-service to attracting new blood into the hobby through entry-level models (particularly of contemporary prototypes), is a good indication that all is not well for the hobby. It not only could be, it regularly IS in several other threads. However, unless anyone has some actual numbers to provide verifiable facts, it is all conjecture. You can just as easily argue the other way. I recently stood in a local exhibition chatting to someone behind a layout. "There's no-one new coming into the hobby", he said, "It's all old men". To illustrate the point, he waved his arm at the crowd in the room. The room was full of families. My guess is that those who have facts, manufacturers and retailers, aren't going to share the finer details. The rest of us can chunter on and take another thread off topic. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TEAMYAKIMA Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 The program has just been reviewed on Gogglebox and one of its contibutors commented " that we are all just little boys who haven't been laid yet" I don't think we should worry about Googlebox reviewing the programme ....................... There was a Monty Python sketch about Oscar Wilde whiche ended with ' The only thing worse than being talked about .............. is not being talked about. ' Googlebox review might get even more people looking for the programme on-line to see what all the fuss is about. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Gilbert Posted October 21, 2018 RMweb Gold Share Posted October 21, 2018 Though not at the same time You should meet my other half...actually on second thoughts..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Robin2 Posted October 21, 2018 Share Posted October 21, 2018 Enthusiast? That doesn't have the same bite as "geek" My Concise Oxford Dictionary defines "geek" as "a knowledgeable and obsessive enthusiast" - which is the sense in which I use it. ...R 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts