Corona-virus - Impact of the Health Situation worldwide

[The Stationmaster]

4 minutes ago, Reorte said:

If they're prepared to pay rent for space owned by non-employees they should be prepared to pay rent for office space owned by employees. Using peoples' homes as free office space is blatant exploitation IMO.

But on the other hand people working from home can, subject to HMRC rules of course, potentially claim certain tax reliefs

[Reorte]

45 minutes ago, 4630 said:

 

Antony Jay and Jonathan Lynn could never have imagined how much their brilliant writing - and wonderfully acted of course by the late Paul Eddington, Nigel Hawthorne and very recently Derek Fowlds - has always been so close to the mark.  Absolutely ageless and still spot on.

 

Thanks for posting that Andy.  It's a real tonic today.

 

I suspect they might have imagined to be honest - I'm sure I read somewhere that they got a lot of their ideas by looking through news stories from years earlier and just tweaked them a bit to suit the setting - they certainly recognised that lots of things never change in politics.

[Reorte]

3 minutes ago, The Stationmaster said:

But on the other hand people working from home can, subject to HMRC rules of course, potentially claim certain tax reliefs

 

Do businesses get the same or similar tax reliefs on the bills necessary to keep the office running (being business expenses)?

 

Anyway, time to go off to the supermarket to see if they've sold out of everything. I'm down to my last toilet roll so there had better be some.

Edited March 14, 2020 by Reorte

[Metr0Land]

1 hour ago, Gwiwer said:

 

In the short term the winners seem to be the supermarkets whose tills are ringing furiously.  Today's visit to Waitrose found nothing lacking from my list but shelves stripped bare in many areas including canned vegetables, pasta, rice, medications, sanitary products, tissues (but not toilet rolls), store-baked bread and cat food (why cat food???). 

 

I haven't had a cat (or any other pet) since 1991 but suspect if I had one now I'd want to make sure they don't go short.  Many pet owners are altruistic in that sense (even if it means a shortage for fellow pet owners).

[runs as required]

2 minutes ago, Reorte said:

If they're prepared to pay rent for space owned by non-employees they should be prepared to pay rent for office space owned by employees. Using peoples' homes as free office space is blatant exploitation IMO.

I've been reflecting on this along different lines.

AFAIK the majority of M'learned Friends are partners (therefore co-owners in various proportions), several maybe 'interns' - maybe paid nowt. 

I was wondering about the clerical workers - many of whom I bet travel in from cheaper peripheral London areas. Would they get paid to stay away? Or maybe have to find new jobs.

 

I once worked for a large firm of engineers who had to move out of Portland Place to Regent House, above a petrol station in Brixton after the retirement of a couple of Senior Partners. 

Watching trains was brilliant, but a sod of a commute from Highgate .

[John M Upton]

You can bet any restriction of movement or event banning legislation or order will be subject to a legal challenge in the courts within a matter of hours!

[Andy Hayter]

1 hour ago, Gibbo675 said:

Hi Jonny,

 

This may well be true but does it allay any of what I wrote with regard the shutting down of the social and economic structures of the world as we know it.

 

A friend of mine went skiing in Italy not long ago and at the border with France everyone on the bus was zapped with a laser thermometer. Should any one have had a temperature they would have been off to quarantine. The question then needs to be asked how many things can cause a temperature, it could be all manner of things but off to quarantine it would have been regardless.

 

Gibbo.

 

The common cold generally does not induce a fever - so no increase in temperature.  Flu viruses do cause a fever but do not show positive for C-19.   You seem to be making something out of nothing.

[AY Mod]

32 minutes ago, Reorte said:

Anyway, time to go off to the supermarket to see if they've sold out of everything. I'm down to my last toilet roll so there had better be some

 

Please be aware some restrictions are in place.

 

[sharris]

I think any comparison with the common cold is dangerous at the moment.

 

Yes, about 15% of colds can be attributed to a coronavirus. However there are over 200 virus strains that can cause colds - the most common being the rhinovirus which is a type of enterovirus. Polio is also caused by an enterovirus - I don't think anyone would compare polio to a cold!

[APOLLO]

1 hour ago, Gibbo675 said:

Hi Mike,

 

In the spirit of problem-reaction-solution the populous of the western nations may well be shepherded into the acceptance and acquiescence of:

• Severe travel restrictions.
• Fully traceable digital currency systems connected to a Chinese style social crediting system.
• The reduction of property rights.
• Restriction of employment and work opportunities causing financial ruin.
• The reduction of privacy.
• Enforcement "bio prevention measures".
• The application of equal rights / poverty for all.
• The dismantling of current economic and financial structures as we know them.

 

John McDonnells (and Corbyn's) wet dream !!!  - and just why Boris & his party got in with such a majority (including here ooop north) in the recent GE.

 

The average Brit will take a lot on the chin, perhaps a return to the war time spirit etc - I don't know.  But accept the above !!! - The pitchforks will be out, wielded by millions  the fit, the sick and coughing and those on their deathbed will also arise.

 

Our politicians need to tread with care - Health care being No 1.

 

Donald Trump, useless git he usually is took very good measures in his emergency speech last night - the US Government teaming up with private enterprise to help the population & fight this virus. Perhaps we in the UK need to do similar actions - like TODAY. I have little faith in Boris & his minions.

 

Brit15

 

 

[Reorte]

41 minutes ago, Reorte said:

Anyway, time to go off to the supermarket to see if they've sold out of everything. I'm down to my last toilet roll so there had better be some.

 

Just got back - and there weren't any. Society's losing the plot (or would be if it hadn't done so years ago anyway).

[boxbrownie]

Our Son and family just had a few days at Centre Parks during their return he got a text message saying his job/workplace has been deemed a v.high risk area......he is a doctor in A&E (they have had several positive walk ins this week)........his wife and two kiddlewinks will be coming down to stay with us for the foreseeable future as they consider it too much of a risk to be in the same house.......and when her company heard they said she could now work from home, she has been asking to work two days a week from home for months (nothing to do with COVID19)......now they agree!

 

Yes indeed things are starting to get very real.

[Hal Nail]

5 minutes ago, boxbrownie said:

Yes indeed things are starting to get very real.

My organisation sent all 18 employees home last week.

 

I could have gone to Cheltenham along with 200,000 others with a bit more warning.

[EddieB]

1 hour ago, Andy Hayter said:

 

The common cold generally does not induce a fever - so no increase in temperature.  Flu viruses do cause a fever but do not show positive for C-19.   You seem to be making something out of nothing.

No, there are plenty of other factors - women of a certain age*, for example.

 

[For clarification, the above refers to factors that can cause raised temperature, which can include a phase most women go through in their fifties (give or take). We have a family friend due to return from India next month, assuming there are still flights, who suffers quite strongly from this factor and hence may appear to be carrying the virus and denied passage.]

 

*Reference to Tina Turner?

Edited March 14, 2020 by EddieB

[friscopete]

Re women of a certain age .My daughters good  friend in Northern Italy has just lost a  previously fit friend  aged about 30  to  it .She says it is killing the young as well as old hippies.The authorities dont seem to be accurate in age death rates .There may well be a lot of dead formerly smug people  joining her  friend .

Edited March 14, 2020 by friscopete

[melmerby]

1 hour ago, APOLLO said:

 

 

 

Donald Trump, useless git he usually is took very good measures in his emergency speech last night - the US Government teaming up with private enterprise to help the population & fight this virus. Perhaps we in the UK need to do similar actions - like TODAY. I have little faith in Boris & his minions.

 

Brit15

 

 

After trying to blame the Democrats & the media for scaremongering over it and burying his head in the sand.

Panic measure I would call it, to try and claw back some political cred he's lost over it in the last few weeks.

Edited March 14, 2020 by melmerby

[Gwiwer]

1 hour ago, John M Upton said:

You can bet any restriction of movement or event banning legislation or order will be subject to a legal challenge in the courts within a matter of hours!

 

Scotland has been very careful in its wording of what the media is touting as a "ban".  They "strongly advise against" such events but they are not banned.  There remain suggestions that there is no statutory instrument which can support an outright ban unless emergency legislation is first passed.  

 

The question is whether one is prepared to be a part of something which is "strongly advised against" and the other question is whether such an event would find its public liability insurance null and void.  

 

There are churches - certainly around London - where more than 500 people gather at a time for worship.  I believe the Morden mosque, and possibly others, exceeds that number quite easily for Friday prayers.  At what point does this take precedence over freedom to worship?  And are we (the collective "we") willing to accept that?  

[Metr0Land]

38 minutes ago, Gwiwer said:

 

 

There are churches - certainly around London - where more than 500 people gather at a time for worship.  I believe the Morden mosque, and possibly others, exceeds that number quite easily for Friday prayers.  At what point does this take precedence over freedom to worship?  And are we (the collective "we") willing to accept that?  

 

The restriction (advice?) in Scotland and the probable impending similar limit in England has been stated by the polictians that it's not based on strict scientific advice.  The concern about larger crowds is they (may) need policing and standby ambulance crews in place.  

 

I don't fully understand what else the police would be doing at the moment as there aren't mobs of vigilantes roaming around, however having ambulances on station at large events proably isn't the best use of them for the forseeable future.  Given that churches and railway trains don't normally require resources from from ambulance crews and police (apart from Thuggexes) there's no reason why these things shouldn't have numbers in excess of 500? 

[Gibbo675]

2 hours ago, jjb1970 said:

The problem isn't temporary restrictions to try and control a virus but the risk that governments will use the opportunity to increase their powers to track and monitor us and usher in changes which could easily lead to something sinister under the pretext of the greater good. I really wouldn't be surprised if the tracking apps that have been rolled out in some countries quietly become a long term requirement. 

Hi JJb,

 

This is precisely the problem that the little people face by way of abuse of power by governments all around the world.

 

Gibbo.

[Gibbo675]

2 hours ago, Reorte said:

 

Do businesses get the same or similar tax reliefs on the bills necessary to keep the office running (being business expenses)?

 

Anyway, time to go off to the supermarket to see if they've sold out of everything. I'm down to my last toilet roll so there had better be some.

I found these on ebay, they must be worth more than normal ones in a crisis !

 

https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/3-x-100-Novelty-Toilet-Roll-Dollar-Bill-USA-American-Money-2-Ply-Printed-Paper/252029104413?hash=item3aae1af11d:g:X58AAOSwZedeLVsG

 

Gibbo.

[57xx]

5 hours ago, spikey said:

 

I look forward to the day when A&E departments do that.  Something's got to be done before much longer to stop people misusing emergency services.

 

My Missus' nephews girlfriend is a nurse. She says she has never seen A&E so quiet! Show just how many people go there for trivial things and are now too scared to venture out.

[phil-b259]

1 hour ago, friscopete said:

She says it is killing the young as well as old hippies.The authorities dont seem to be accurate in age death rates .There may well be a lot of dead formerly smug people  joining her  friend .

 

So do road traffic acidents.

 

While the death of anyone 'before their time' as it were is indeed tragic, please lets not try and pretend that everything would be perfect for everyone without Covid-19 being pressent.

 

The key question is not whether people die from Covid-19 (as harsh as that sounds), its more of a question of what catagories they fall into - gender, age, any pre-exsisting health conditions or specific lifestyle factors (e.g. being a smoker).

 

Based on the above statistical analysis it still remains that in general:-

 

Women with Covid-19 seem to suffer less than men (some comanality with ordinary Flu has beenn sugested with regard to this)

Children seem Covid-19 less likely to suffer than adults.

Older people seem to suffer more than younger and are more likely to die.

Those with pre-exsisting illnesses suffer more and are more likly to die.

Those who have certain lifestyles suffer more and are more likly to die.

 

The Covid-19 circulating in Europe is no different to that which emerged in China and as such the above will not change. Yes there may be differances in the actual figures and some factors like only 3% of women in China smoke (a proven risk factor to developing a more serious case of Covid-19) will influence the figures, but that doesn't alter the fundamentals

 

1 hour ago, friscopete said:

The authorities dont seem to be accurate in age death rates .There may well be a lot of dead formerly smug people  joining her  friend .

 

And this is how conspirusy theories or dangerious / stupid behaviour starts!

 

While I am naturally sceptical of Governments, I equally see no reason to ignore the factual / scientific reasoning of scientists, healthcare profestionals or statisticans when dealing with all maters Covid-19.

 

As bad as Covid-19 sounds - we lose thousands each year to road acidents, seasonal flu and even mundane activities like going down a set of stairs!

 

[AY Mod]

The panic-buying of toilet rolls is a problem. I was in Tesco earlier and there wasn't any to be found on the shelves, searched all the ends of aisles up and down the store too. I asked at the information desk as well after a bit of a wait to ask if they'd got any out the back. No chance but she was a bit short with me.

 

It was pretty embarrassing walking back to the gents with my trousers around my ankles.

 

[grandadbob]

1 hour ago, Gwiwer said:

 

I believe the Morden mosque, and possibly others, exceeds that number quite easily for Friday prayers.  At what point does this take precedence over freedom to worship?  And are we (the collective "we") willing to accept that?  

 

This is just down the road from me. I believe the prayer halls can accommodate 6000 and the entire complex 13000 people. Traffic on a Friday there can be interesting at times.

[Gwiwer]

Just now, grandadbob said:

 

This is just down the road from me. I believe the prayer halls can accommodate 6000 and the entire complex 13000 people. Traffic on a Friday there can be interesting at times.

And it most certainly does require the attendance of the police.  Partly to manage both vehicular and pedestrian traffic and partly as a deterrent to anyone intent on inappropriate or abusive behaviour.  If gatherings of 500+ are "banned" then this is one of the places which may be both affected and which raises objections on religious grounds.  At times of crisis people often turn to their deity of choice.