Hornby 2021 - P2 new tooling

[TomScrut]

So given we are likely to have models of 2007 before the real one is finished, does anyone know if the real life design is completed (meaning the Hornby model could be accurate)? I thought it was said that they'd be making these when the real one was near completion, but as far as I am aware it isn't quite what I'd call near.

[scots region]

Also shouldn't 2007 have overhead warning stickers?  

[Johan DC]

1 hour ago, scots region said:

Also shouldn't 2007 have overhead warning stickers?  

I hope not, so I don't have to take these of (Rule 1 for me, Gresley made 7. Will be named Highland Chieftain of course)

[palmsticks]

15 hours ago, TomScrut said:

So given we are likely to have models of 2007 before the real one is finished, does anyone know if the real life design is completed (meaning the Hornby model could be accurate)? I thought it was said that they'd be making these when the real one was near completion, but as far as I am aware it isn't quite what I'd call near.

I believe that the major visual external features will have been available to the Hornby design team at the time they were designing theirs mainly because it was necessary to evaluate that the full size locomotive would conform to the reduced structural loading gauge of the modern railway early on in the design feasibility process.  Other external visual features different to the 1930s engines would have also have been known at the time: at the top of my head: balance weights on the wheels, A1 boiler washout plugs, cab cut outs, twin turbo gen set, tender tank and pantograph.  Detail design work for 2007 is all but complete. 

 

Progress on the build of 2007 has had to be delayed firstly due to consequences of the pandemic, and more recently, while the trust focuses efforts to get Tornado back together (and earning again), and they move into Darligton Locomotive Works 2. The youtube link to the Oct 2022 is quite useful in understanding the many challenges and the enormous progress made thus far.  See also: https://www.a1steam.com/prince-of-wales/news

 

 

 

[No Decorum]

9 hours ago, palmsticks said:

 

A1 boiler washout plugs, cab cut outs, twin turbo gen set, tender tank and pantograph.

 

I can’t see the pantograph on Hornby’s artwork. 😇

[AdamOrmorod]

While the tender tanks look good, the washout plugs on the partially assembled 2007 models look like the P2 arrangement rather than an A1 boiler... 🫤

 

It does seem inevitable that there will be inaccuracies in a model of something which hasn't been finished yet!

[Mad McCann]

22 hours ago, Johan DC said:

I hope not, so I don't have to take these of (Rule 1 for me, Gresley made 7. Will be named Highland Chieftain of course)

 

 

Or Black Douglas in my case. 🙂

[No Decorum]

3 minutes ago, Mad McCann said:

 

 

Or Black Douglas in my case. 🙂

Funny you should say that. I was trying to think of a name which was as fitting as the original six. Without doing any reading, Black Douglas sprang to mind. Excellent choice.

[Johan DC]

I got the inspiration from LNER Thompson A2/1 507, which might have taken the place of a fictive 2007. 

[G-BOAF]

1 hour ago, AdamOrmorod said:

While the tender tanks look good, the washout plugs on the partially assembled 2007 models look like the P2 arrangement rather than an A1 boiler... 🫤

 

It does seem inevitable that there will be inaccuracies in a model of something which hasn't been finished yet!

Cab looks correct for the newbuild (smaller cut outs)

but yes unfortunately the washout plugs do not look correct for 2007.

I wonder if this is a tooling limitation, or a design omission by Hornby?

[AdamOrmorod]

50 minutes ago, G-BOAF said:

Cab looks correct for the newbuild (smaller cut outs)

but yes unfortunately the washout plugs do not look correct for 2007.

I wonder if this is a tooling limitation, or a design omission by Hornby?

2001 did actually receive smaller cut outs before it was rebuilt, will be interesting to see if Hornby produce a "full cream" version of 2001 or feel they might have saturated the market with the railroad version.

 

I'm also not sure whether 2007 will have the myriad rivets atop the boiler between the chimney and firebox, I couldn't find a clear view from a quick google image search.

 

I had hoped that the firebox might be a separate part, to allow not only for 2007's washout plugs but also potentially 2006's unique boiler.

[scots region]

This months Engine Shed includes decorated samples of 2002/3/7. 
 

https://uk.Hornby.com/community/blog-and-news/engine-shed/view-p2

 

 

Curiously Earl Marischal seems to be missing the smoke deflectors that were included in the engineering CADs, either they’ve been deleted or this is just and ‘07’ painted up as ‘02’. I personally lean towards the latter. Still these look very nice indeed.

 

 

[Johan DC]

48 minutes ago, scots region said:

Curiously Earl Marischal seems to be missing the smoke deflectors that were included in the engineering CADs, either they’ve been deleted or this is just and ‘07’ painted up as ‘02’. I personally lean towards the latter. Still these look very nice indeed.

 

 

It's not 2007, the running plate of 2002 is different than 2007, and they have different running gear too. There are other differences too, quite a lot, but apart from the tender, I don't know the correct terms in English. Mea culpa!

[Ollie K]

Glad to see the physical models at last, but disappointing the larger 2002 deflectors have apparently been omitted despite being present on the earlier CAD and previously confirmed to another poster on here that they would be fitted. Would be good to see Hornby provide updates on details like this in The Engine Shed blog.

[scots region]

1 hour ago, Johan DC said:

It's not 2007, the running plate of 2002 is different than 2007, and they have different running gear too. There are other differences too, quite a lot, but apart from the tender, I don't know the correct terms in English. Mea culpa!

Yes, it slipped my mind that 2007 is tracking closer to Cock o’ The North. Also 2007 appears to have a significantly different tender from 2002/3

[Pre Grouping fan]

One error is that the boiler in steam was off Tornado not 2007.

 

 

[No Decorum]

I love the P2s. So long as Hornby doesn’t make a muck of the trailing truck I’d fancy all four but realistically, that’s likely to be just one or two at a pinch. I’m thinking of Chamossaire, though. An A2/3 with a slight difference in the boiler cladding from classmate Edward Thompson. Well done Hornby for observing it but Chamossaire ended up discounted. With four newly tooled P2s, is Hornby risking having to discount some of them? Time will tell, I suppose.

[AdamOrmorod]

Another one here a little disappointed about the lack of smoke deflectors on 2002, think I'll hold off in the hope there's a future release with them.

 

I noticed 2002 has separately fitted nameplates while the other two do not, hopefully they all have them included in the detail bag.

[Hilux5972]

Hornby have previously confirmed that 2002 WILL have the separate smoke deflectors. 

[Ollie K]

9 hours ago, AdamOrmorod said:

Another one here a little disappointed about the lack of smoke deflectors on 2002, think I'll hold off in the hope there's a future release with them.

 

I noticed 2002 has separately fitted nameplates while the other two do not, hopefully they all have them included in the detail bag.

 

3 hours ago, Hilux5972 said:

Hornby have previously confirmed that 2002 WILL have the separate smoke deflectors. 

 

Looking again at the samples, I wonder if the large separate deflectors for 2002 will be in the detail pack for customer to fit.

 

The models pictured don’t have a front steps, screw link front coupling, drain cocks, loco brake rigging or a cab crew fitted - items usually in the Hornby accessory packs. So I hope we’re going to get a best of both worlds solution that will allow the buyer to choose whether or not to fit the deflectors.

At this price point and given the extent of other manufacturer detail packs (featuring lamps, etched nameplates etc) I don’t think that’s a massive ask… 

 

[micklner]

Why do people always say this on every new model ??.

 

 

It is SAMPLE not a finished product.

[JamieR4489]

10 minutes ago, OliverBytham said:

Looking again at the samples, I wonder if the large separate deflectors for 2002 will be in the detail pack for customer to fit.

I think that's unlikely as the original deflectors were shortened when the second pair were fitted.

[Ollie K]

1 hour ago, JamieR4489 said:

I think that's unlikely as the original deflectors were shortened when the second pair were fitted.

Now you say that, I remember reading as much somewhere. Cheers Jamie.

[AdamOrmorod]

1 hour ago, JamieR4489 said:

I think that's unlikely as the original deflectors were shortened when the second pair were fitted.

I also think the front sections of the original handrails were removed

[Ollie K]

There’s a review of 2007 in the new issue of Hornby mag. It states the next set of models in the run will feature 2002’s extra deflectors plus further locos with the Bugatti nose. Etched nameplates are in the detail bag.