Ingleford Wharf: 1870s canalside inglenook on the "M&WJR" in 00, and Victoria Quay: a 1900s WIP in 0

[Schooner]

15 hours ago, Mikkel said:

Ingleford is 1900, I think?

 

In GWR form, yes...ish. The roster was assembled with a haphazard approach and without a particular date in mind. I think all the stock is pre-1890, just, and the horsebox, iron Mink and 4 planks (also in grey) will be in 'as new' (and/or 'as recently repainted'!) condition with only very light weathering (a process which is very much WIP on the red stock). So, nominally, but very loosely, 1895.

 

This is to follow on from the 1885 Midland Railway setting (equally valid for the geography) which, despite stock and motive power being decided (with @Compound2632's invaluable assistance), ordered and paid for 10+ months ago, @billbedford seems reluctant to acknowledge, let alone make good, for reasons unknown.

 

The earliest iteration will be set c.1875, a fictional setting which springs from the factual suggestion that the Thames and Severn Canal Co. sell up and allow the Midland to convert the canal route to rail. In our fiction, the canal company itself steals the Midland surveyor (rumours of kompromat as-yet unproven), develops the wharf at Ingleford (previously rail served by a single siding) into a transhipment dock and sets to it themselves. The vanity of the rival mill owners of the Nailsworth and Frome valleys secures two brand new locos in the form of a Neilson 0-4-0 piano tank and a Beyer Peacock 0-6-0ST. Stakeholders more sensible to financial risk source the stock: the cheapest to be had on the second-hand market, a jumbled assortment of vehicles built in the 1850s (a glorious rake ordered with helpful input, and promptly received, from @5&9Models). 

 

How should such stock be liveried?

 

Gut instinct is repainted for/by their new owners, light grey with black ironwork, with a central white horseshoe 'illiterate mark' (it being a symbol of Gloucestershire*) and three-digit numbers (first digit denoting wagon type) in white on the lower right sheeting.

 

If I knew more about early (YMMV) wagon liveries, or indeed whether such wagons might in fact be hired rather than purchased outright, I'd wouldn't be opposed to them appearing in motley. So, the floor's open to suggestions...thanks!

 

*Well, stolen off their county council arms anyway :)

 

 

 

Edited February 13, 2023 by Schooner

[Northroader]

Wonder why they’ve put the horseshoe upside down on their coat of arms. Horseshoes are supposed to be lucky, but that way up, popular saying has it that all the luck will run out, so other way up on your rolling stock, please.

[longchap]

14 hours ago, Northroader said:

Wonder why they’ve put the horseshoe upside down on their coat of arms. Horseshoes are supposed to be lucky, but that way up, popular saying has it that all the luck will run out, so other way up on your rolling stock, please.

 

The default orientation for horeshoes in the ancient and noble world of hereldic art is with the opening at the bottom. As a note of interest, unlike in the UK, horseshoes are displayed this way for luck here in France, possibly elsewhere as well.

 

 

 

 

Edited February 15, 2023 by longchap

[Compound2632]

1 hour ago, longchap said:

The default orientation for horeshoes in the ancient and noble world of hereldic art is with the opening at the bottom. As a note on interest, unlike in the UK, horseshoes are displayed this way for luck here in France, possibly wlsewher as well.

 

A quick google finds examples either way, though legs down like a Greek Omega seem the more usual. As far as I can remember, the Observer's Book of Heraldry didn't cover horseshoes as charges. Is there a technical term to indicate which way up a horseshoe is shown?

[Gypsy]

50 minutes ago, Compound2632 said:

 

A quick google finds examples either way, though legs down like a Greek Omega seem the more usual. As far as I can remember, the Observer's Book of Heraldry didn't cover horseshoes as charges. Is there a technical term to indicate which way up a horseshoe is shown?

 

Recursant? That's head down for heraldic animals...

[Compound2632]

8 minutes ago, Gypsy said:

Recursant? That's head down for heraldic animals...

 

So what's a heads up for heraldic animals?

[Gypsy]

Depends which way they're looking, facing and standing, sitting or lying (or flying or swimming).

 

Not sure any of those apply to a horseshoe.

 

Sorry you've taken my heraldic knowledge to its limit...

[Annie]

2 hours ago, longchap said:

As a note on interest, unlike in the UK, horseshoes are displayed this way for luck here in France, possibly elsewhere as well.

The horseshoe nailed above my garage door is placed opening to the bottom and it was there and like that when I purchased my house.

[The White Rabbit]

Maybe it's a UK thing? The horseshoes nailed to our old garden shed, next door's garage and a friend in Wales' railway room were/are all 'legs up'. 

 

I have looked in my copy of The Dictionary of Omens and Superstitions - I have a varied reference library - and this supports the 'legs up' practice, as Northroader says, it's so the luck doesn't run out. It also suggests nailing it sideways in the form of a letter 'C' (to represent Christ) is 'effective'. It speculates that the power of the horseshoe originates from the symbolism of the 'sacred fire' and made from the 'sacred metal' (iron). Also, the ability of the shoe to be nailed to the horse's hoof with nails without the horse feeling any pain. Rather than attributing this to biological factors, it was seen in earlier times as the amazing power of the horseshoe. As such, when it had finished 'active service', it still retained power and was therefore a useful amulet to keep about the place. I accept it's hardly conclusive proof but the Wills plastic kit of a village forge (SS31) shows one 'legs up': an example at https://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/314271539662?chn=ps&norover=1&mkevt=1&mkrid=7101533165274578&mkcid=2&itemid=314271539662&targetid=4584826055637456&device=c&mktype=&googleloc=&poi=&campaignid=412354546&mkgroupid=1299623041023876&rlsatarget=pla-4584826055637456&abcId=9300541&merchantid=87779&msclkid=15f6d6ded29c13f38e34b53536a31bfa 

 

Two local superstitions include the Scottish fishermen's belief that a horseshoe fixed to a mast will protect the vessel from storms and in 'the North', if you find a horseshoe, spit on it and throw it over your left shoulder while making a wish, this wish will be granted. 

[Gypsy]

23 minutes ago, The White Rabbit said:

if you find a horseshoe, spit on it and throw it over your left shoulder while making a wish, this wish will be granted. 

 

Assuming that you're not nicked first for clouting the poor sod standing behind you???

[Schooner]

28 minutes ago, The White Rabbit said:

the Wills plastic kit of a village forge (SS31) shows one 'legs up'

 

Ah.

 

 

Well, that's my bias exposed! Am I to take the uppy vs downy conversation as tacit approval of going with gut instinct?

 

FWIW, the blurry background shews the MPD in current form:

The loco equivalent of a brew and a biccy, but better'n nowt!

[magmouse]

The story goes that a journalist went to interview the great physicist Niels Bohr at his home. He was surprised to see a horseshoe  over the door, so he said to Bohr, "As a scientist, I didn't think you would believe in such superstitions?"

 

Bohr replied, "Oh, I don't - but I am reliably informed that it works, whether one believes in it or not."

 

Nick.

[MrWolf]

There's one (nailed legs upwards) on my parent's garage and I remember a family friend who had been getting involved with the born again mob asking my father if he really believed in  "all that superstitious nonsense"? 

He replied "No more than anything else, but it can't hurt to cover all of the possibilities can it?"

 

I also remember someone telling me that the legs should face down so that the devil can't sit in the "U". I think that was Beverly, East Riding direction.

 

[chuffinghell]

[AlfaZagato]

American practice is legs-up, as well.   Or to loft them at a stick about 25 feet away.

[MrWolf]

22 minutes ago, AlfaZagato said:

American practice is legs-up, as well.   Or to loft them at a stick about 25 feet away.

 

I have pitched horseshoes, suburban British neighbours think you odd when you're bashing a crowbar into the lawn...

[Worsdell forever]

1 minute ago, MrWolf said:

 

I have pitched horseshoes, suburban British neighbours think you odd when you're bashing a crowbar into the lawn...

 

We've refined it a bit and moved on from 'horseshoes' and we throw them 11 yards at the pin. We do of course enjoy a little refreshment while playing. 

 

 

 

 

[MrWolf]

Well that's almost as civilised as croquet old chap!

[drmditch]

On 14/02/2023 at 23:17, MrWolf said:

Well that's almost as civilised as croquet old chap!

 

Croquet civilised?

The most (elegantly) cruel game there is!

[MrWolf]

24 minutes ago, drmditch said:

 

Croquet civilised?

The most (elegantly) cruel game there is!

 

I thought that was cow tipping?

[MrWolf]

I was hunting about for some details of the old Craven Arms brewery (closed 1928) and found this picture which I thought might be of interest, at least architecturally.

 

Wikipedia 

[lezz01]

35 minutes ago, MrWolf said:

 

I thought that was cow tipping?

Surely you mean Cheese Rolling!?

Regards Lez.

[MrWolf]

1 hour ago, lezz01 said:

Surely you mean Cheese Rolling!?

Regards Lez.

 

Bottle kicking as a matter of fact.

[Schooner]

On 14/02/2023 at 16:39, longchap said:

As a note of interest, unlike in the UK, horseshoes are displayed this way [legs down] for luck here in France

On 14/02/2023 at 22:14, AlfaZagato said:

American practice is legs-up, as well

 

So, my choice is to ape the Seppos or the...the...the French?!

 

Nightmare.

 

I note the keepers of Oakham Castle appear to hold A View:

...if not all their marbles...

 

On 14/02/2023 at 19:01, Annie said:

The horseshoe nailed above my garage door is placed opening to the bottom and it was there and like that when I purchased my house.

But, dear Annie, you're all upside down from here!

Edited March 1, 2023 by Schooner

[Annie]

9 minutes ago, Schooner said:

I note the keepers of Oakham Castle appear to hold A View:

Gosh they've certainly got some BIG horses at Oakham Castle.