ModelRail USTC 0-6-0 Tank Loco Project USA

[Bluebell Model Railway]

Have you tried reading the topic? or tried keeping up to date with developments through the the magazine.

There has been a delay, due to a change in manufacture swapping from Dapol to Bachmann which has put it back considerably which has been covered quite a lot. Hence the delay, it was covered on the last page when they are possibly due. Mid to late Summer 2016.

[TheQ]

Have you tried reading the topic? or tried keeping up to date with developments through the the magazine.

 

There has been a delay, due to a change in manufacture swapping from Dapol to Bachmann which has put it back considerably which has been covered quite a lot. Hence the delay, it was covered on the last page when they are possibly due. Mid to late Summer 2016.

I don't get that magazine, as normally it concentrates on too much modern stuff for me, the number of promised dates that have been and gone seem endless. I wasn't asking for the new expected date, I'm not expecting it to be kept....

[Oldddudders]

I don't get that magazine, as normally it concentrates on too much modern stuff for me, the number of promised dates that have been and gone seem endless. I wasn't asking for the new expected date, I'm not expecting it to be kept....

And, were the model to be delayed again, or even cancelled, would you die in a ditch? I suggest not. We are luckier than ever before in the wide range of cracking RTR models announced on all sides. If some good intentions by their promoters get frustrated by circumstances, patience remains a virtue.

[No Decorum]

I can’t wait … but I shall.

[Bomp]

I'm pretty sure I saw one of these locos in GWR livery on the Cambrian Coast at some exchange sidings with a narrow gauge slate line.  Just have to pin the photo down.  I'm pretty sure there were a couple of NCB Austerities there as well.

[cctransuk]

.... one of these locos in GWR livery ....

 

Now THAT I'd like to see !!!

 

Regards,

John Isherwood.

[Wickham Green]

Well, if Chris is wondering what livery to put on the next batch, Great Western is bound to sell ........... complete with copper-capped stovepipes, of course !!?!

[dibber25]

Well, if Chris is wondering what livery to put on the next batch, Great Western is bound to sell ........... complete with copper-capped stovepipes, of course !!?!

We're doing black, green, blue and brown. Really need one in LMS red! (CJL)

[Trains&armour]

I'm pretty sure I saw one of these locos in GWR livery on the Cambrian Coast at some exchange sidings with a narrow gauge slate line.  Just have to pin the photo down.  I'm pretty sure there were a couple of NCB Austerities there as well.

I think I know which photo you mean. But, as I recall, and my memory seldom fails me, the caption said the loco was moved from Newport In 1944 still in USTAC livery. It wasn't repainted until after the war. The only thing missing now is the actual model to make my planned Cambrian Coast  layout even more realistic...

[Fireline]

We're doing black, green, blue and brown. Really need one in LMS red! (CJL)

 

The Hogwarts Depot shunter....?

[ExPatBrit]

I pre-ordered the SR version 2 weeks ago and I'm out of pocket already, with the amateur way Kernow insist on entering pre-orders. Being outside the UK, I pay a foreign currency transaction fee, which is fair enough, some cards do, some don't. But then when Kernow credit back the payment, because it's a pre-order, I then pay another foreign currency transaction fee and I also get hit with the difference in buying and selling exchange rates and they manage this all in one day! And, of course, I'll be hit with another foreign currency transaction fee when the model is despatched and my card charged. Well done Kernow, fantastic system you've got there and well done MR for approving it, highly unimpressed. Hornby, by contrast, manage to charge my card once, when the model is ready to ship, pre-order or no and I don't get hit with a foreign currency transaction fee either, (yes, same card).

 

Now, I know it's not vast amounts of money we are talking here, but money is money and it also happens to be mine! I find it hard to believe a major UK retailer can't handle pre-orders to destinations outside the UK better than this rubbish method, they'd get laughed at if they tried that crap in the US. I know now there's one UK retailer I won't be bothering with again for anything on pre-order, it's 2016 for heck's sake not 1916.

[cctransuk]

I pre-ordered the SR version 2 weeks ago and I'm out of pocket already, with the amateur way Kernow insist on entering pre-orders. Being outside the UK, I pay a foreign currency transaction fee, which is fair enough, some cards do, some don't. But then when Kernow credit back the payment, because it's a pre-order, I then pay another foreign currency transaction fee and I also get hit with the difference in buying and selling exchange rates and they manage this all in one day! And, of course, I'll be hit with another foreign currency transaction fee when the model is despatched and my card charged. Well done Kernow, fantastic system you've got there and well done MR for approving it, highly unimpressed. Hornby, by contrast, manage to charge my card once, when the model is ready to ship, pre-order or no and I don't get hit with a foreign currency transaction fee either, (yes, same card).

 

Now, I know it's not vast amounts of money we are talking here, but money is money and it also happens to be mine! I find it hard to believe a major UK retailer can't handle pre-orders to destinations outside the UK better than this rubbish method, they'd get laughed at if they tried that crap in the US. I know now there's one UK retailer I won't be bothering with again for anything on pre-order, it's 2016 for heck's sake not 1916.

 

Kernow, like me, are based down here in the Duchy of Cornwall - (the clue's in the name).

 

We're none too sure here which century we are living in - nor do we care much.

 

All this foreign currency transaction fee business seems to smack of government  / big business interference in free trade - no such problems in the old smuggling and wrecking days !!

 

But - and here's the important bit - don't get too worked up about it; as you say, it's not vast amounts of money.

 

The USA tank will arrive dre'ckly, and you'll forget all about these minor hassles.

 

On the other hand, you could always switch to modelling USA prototypes - problem gone !!

 

Regards,

John Isherwood - (on Padstow 'Obby 'Oss day).

Edited May 2, 2016 by cctransuk

[9402 Fredrick]

I'll probably pre-order one when I get my next two paychecks as by then I can afford it, of course I use a USA credit union so working out international purchases is more than difficult for me because of that.

[PhilH]

I pre-ordered the SR version 2 weeks ago and I'm out of pocket already, with the amateur way Kernow insist on entering pre-orders. Being outside the UK, I pay a foreign currency transaction fee, which is fair enough, some cards do, some don't. But then when Kernow credit back the payment, because it's a pre-order, I then pay another foreign currency transaction fee and I also get hit with the difference in buying and selling exchange rates and they manage this all in one day! And, of course, I'll be hit with another foreign currency transaction fee when the model is despatched and my card charged. Well done Kernow, fantastic system you've got there and well done MR for approving it, highly unimpressed. Hornby, by contrast, manage to charge my card once, when the model is ready to ship, pre-order or no and I don't get hit with a foreign currency transaction fee either, (yes, same card).

Now, I know it's not vast amounts of money we are talking here, but money is money and it also happens to be mine! I find it hard to believe a major UK retailer can't handle pre-orders to destinations outside the UK better than this rubbish method, they'd get laughed at if they tried that crap in the US. I know now there's one UK retailer I won't be bothering with again for anything on pre-order, it's 2016 for heck's sake not 1916.

First world problems....

[SRman]

I pre-ordered the SR version 2 weeks ago and I'm out of pocket already, with the amateur way Kernow insist on entering pre-orders. Being outside the UK, I pay a foreign currency transaction fee, which is fair enough, some cards do, some don't. But then when Kernow credit back the payment, because it's a pre-order, I then pay another foreign currency transaction fee and I also get hit with the difference in buying and selling exchange rates and they manage this all in one day! And, of course, I'll be hit with another foreign currency transaction fee when the model is despatched and my card charged. Well done Kernow, fantastic system you've got there and well done MR for approving it, highly unimpressed. Hornby, by contrast, manage to charge my card once, when the model is ready to ship, pre-order or no and I don't get hit with a foreign currency transaction fee either, (yes, same card).

 

Now, I know it's not vast amounts of money we are talking here, but money is money and it also happens to be mine! I find it hard to believe a major UK retailer can't handle pre-orders to destinations outside the UK better than this rubbish method, they'd get laughed at if they tried that crap in the US. I know now there's one UK retailer I won't be bothering with again for anything on pre-order, it's 2016 for heck's sake not 1916.

 

I agree it's a pain for we 'furriners', but there is a way around it: Kernow Model Railway Centre have actually said in the past, if you wish to avoid all those hassles and extra expenses, phone them up instead to place a pre-order.

[Wickham Green]

Kernow, like me, are based down here in the Duchy of Cornwall - (the clue's in the name).

 

We're none too sure here which century we are living in - nor do we care much.

 

All this foreign currency transaction fee business seems to smack of government  / big business interference in free trade - no such problems in the old smuggling and wrecking days !!

 

But - and here's the important bit - don't get too worked up about it; as you say, it's not vast amounts of money.

 

The USA tank will arrive dre'ckly, and you'll forget all about these minor hassles.

 

On the other hand, you could always switch to modelling USA prototypes - problem gone !!

 

Regards,

John Isherwood - (on Padstow 'Obby 'Oss day).

........ erm .............. isn't it a USA Tank prototype this thread's all about ??!?

[dibber25]

I pre-ordered the SR version 2 weeks ago and I'm out of pocket already, with the amateur way Kernow insist on entering pre-orders. Being outside the UK, I pay a foreign currency transaction fee, which is fair enough, some cards do, some don't. But then when Kernow credit back the payment, because it's a pre-order, I then pay another foreign currency transaction fee and I also get hit with the difference in buying and selling exchange rates and they manage this all in one day! And, of course, I'll be hit with another foreign currency transaction fee when the model is despatched and my card charged. Well done Kernow, fantastic system you've got there and well done MR for approving it, highly unimpressed. Hornby, by contrast, manage to charge my card once, when the model is ready to ship, pre-order or no and I don't get hit with a foreign currency transaction fee either, (yes, same card).

 

Now, I know it's not vast amounts of money we are talking here, but money is money and it also happens to be mine! I find it hard to believe a major UK retailer can't handle pre-orders to destinations outside the UK better than this rubbish method, they'd get laughed at if they tried that crap in the US. I know now there's one UK retailer I won't be bothering with again for anything on pre-order, it's 2016 for heck's sake not 1916.

Perhaps you would like to PM with the full details as we don't actually understand what this is all about and we have never been involved in 'approving' Kernow's business systems. Now that we are aware of an issue, we can look into it but since deposits are not taken for pre-orders, I'm unclear as to what you've actually been charged and credited for. As always - and this is a suggestion for all RMwebbers - you'll find a PM works in getting our help without an angry posting on a public forum. (CJL)

[SRman]

Perhaps you would like to PM with the full details as we don't actually understand what this is all about and we have never been involved in 'approving' Kernow's business systems. Now that we are aware of an issue, we can look into it but since deposits are not taken for pre-orders, I'm unclear as to what you've actually been charged and credited for. As always - and this is a suggestion for all RMwebbers - you'll find a PM works in getting our help without an angry posting on a public forum. (CJL)

 

It's the way the new(er) web shop works. It charges the credit card automatically when an order is placed, then Kernow refund it if the item isn't yet available. Unfortunately, that penalises those of us from overseas as the banks charge us for each international transaction, on top of the normal credit card charges (as ExPatBrit said). The old web shopping site could deal with the pre-order without debiting the card.

Edited May 3, 2016 by SRman

[ExPatBrit]

Perhaps you would like to PM with the full details as we don't actually understand what this is all about and we have never been involved in 'approving' Kernow's business systems. Now that we are aware of an issue, we can look into it but since deposits are not taken for pre-orders, I'm unclear as to what you've actually been charged and credited for. As always - and this is a suggestion for all RMwebbers - you'll find a PM works in getting our help without an angry posting on a public forum. (CJL)

Why the assumption I'm angry, because it's negative? More puzzled that in 2016 someone would be running such an antiquated pre-order entry system and I have to accept it because, "well we are in Cornwall, that makes us special", or "that's a first world problem", the implication being, "that makes it OK", or other such nonsensical twaddle.

 

I don't know how I could be any clearer than my previous post, Kernow's pre-order entry system requires them to make a charge on the customers credit card and then immediately credit back the charge. Whether you are aware of it or not Kernow are, in fact, taking a pre-order deposit, however temporary, the CC get's charged. For a UK customer, this is no problem, the net effect is zero, but outside the £ currency area that means the customer gets hit with the buying, (order entry) and selling, (credit back to the card), exchange rate difference and if the credit card is so minded, foreign currency transaction fees. And another foreign currency transaction fee when the model ships. So, 3 transaction fees and the exhange rate difference, all for one transaction. That's the best that Kernow can manage?. The amounts are relatively small, but that's hardly the point, other retailers and manufacturers, all over the world, including the UK, get it right and have done from at least the last century, it's only software. If I couldn't write a database or spreadsheet app in a couple of hours, that didn't require prior CC charges, I'd need my bumps read and I'm no software engineer.

 

The fact that you are using Kernow, means, by implication, that you have indeed "approved" Kernow's business systems, like it or not. "We didn't know" is hardly a defense, they are your business partner, not mine. And as a subsequent post, (SRMan, post #367, thanks SRMan) has explained, Kernow have a way to avoid this, so why isn't it an automatic procedure, without me having to phone them? Why have an internet pre-order system if you have to phone anyway? Lessons from Fred Karno's Circus maybe?

 

But full marks to you for at least showing some concern, other posters attitudes show they don't have a clue about retailer/customer relations, but they must be very satisfied that Kernow have lost a sale and that's the real test that all is not right.

[dibber25]

Your post reads as angry, as does your latest post, that's why the assumption. The move to Kernow followed a very difficult time with a fulfilment house whose service fell short of our requirements and our primary requirement was to find a company with subject knowledge . At that time we had not used a pre-order arrangement as we had not then contemplated producing 'exclusives' like the Sentinel and the USA. I doubt that such arrangements were discussed as we were not aware we would need them. As a UK retailer and mail order supplier Kernow MRC are highly regarded and that was why we placed our business with them. I suspect that they/we do not receive many pre-orders from overseas and that is why this matter has taken several years to come to light. I am not a retailer and have no idea how credit card software operates but I will pass your comments on to the manager at Kernow and ask him for a response. (CJL)

[ExPatBrit]

Your post reads as angry, as does your latest post, that's why the assumption. The move to Kernow followed a very difficult time with a fulfilment house whose service fell short of our requirements and our primary requirement was to find a company with subject knowledge . At that time we had not used a pre-order arrangement as we had not then contemplated producing 'exclusives' like the Sentinel and the USA. I doubt that such arrangements were discussed as we were not aware we would need them. As a UK retailer and mail order supplier Kernow MRC are highly regarded and that was why we placed our business with them. I suspect that they/we do not receive many pre-orders from overseas and that is why this matter has taken several years to come to light. I am not a retailer and have no idea how credit card software operates but I will pass your comments on to the manager at Kernow and ask him for a response. (CJL)

Thanks for your concern and kudos to you for getting involved, like I've already said, I'm puzzled, not angry, (not sure how anybody could tell from printed words). I'm quite happy for you to publish what Kernow say, on here, if you think that's the best approach, would think it would be, as it's in the interest of the wider, non UK residents. I'm sure none of them are the slightest bit interested in enriching the CC companies any more than they already are, it's not like Kernow recieve a brass farthing for trading this way. It's only their overseas customers who suffer and customers are such a pain for retailers and manufacturers, their business would be so much easier without them!!

[rembrow]

Chris, this problem with pre-orders only goes back a couple of years, when Kernow introduced a new website, which they also use for the Model Rail items. The old website had been used for Model Rail for some years prior to the new system. It was discussed at the time on this forum, and as I understand from their response at the time, any pre orders have to go through a manual clearance by Kernow staff, who arrange refunds of the charge made. I assume a similar problem could occur to a UK based customer who uses a card that is near its limit, and the charge takes them over, with the possibility of a penalty charge. I thought that they were going to try and rectify the issue as part of a future system upgrade.

 

Your post reads as angry, as does your latest post, that's why the assumption. The move to Kernow followed a very difficult time with a fulfilment house whose service fell short of our requirements and our primary requirement was to find a company with subject knowledge . At that time we had not used a pre-order arrangement as we had not then contemplated producing 'exclusives' like the Sentinel and the USA. I doubt that such arrangements were discussed as we were not aware we would need them. As a UK retailer and mail order supplier Kernow MRC are highly regarded and that was why we placed our business with them. I suspect that they/we do not receive many pre-orders from overseas and that is why this matter has taken several years to come to light. I am not a retailer and have no idea how credit card software operates but I will pass your comments on to the manager at Kernow and ask him for a response. (CJL)

Edited May 3, 2016 by rembrow

[JSpencer]

Me too, I am overseas. In my case I gained a euro from the one day difference in exchange rate.

 

So what I need to do is calculate when it will be in favor and place a massive order accordingly.

 

As the number of Modelrail exclusives are small and the difference is not much, I'm not too bothered by it considering the excellent service at Kernow.

[dibber25]

Thanks for your concern and kudos to you for getting involved, like I've already said, I'm puzzled, not angry, (not sure how anybody could tell from printed words). I'm quite happy for you to publish what Kernow say, on here, if you think that's the best approach, would think it would be, as it's in the interest of the wider, non UK residents. I'm sure none of them are the slightest bit interested in enriching the CC companies any more than they already are, it's not like Kernow recieve a brass farthing for trading this way. It's only their overseas customers who suffer and customers are such a pain for retailers and manufacturers, their business would be so much easier without them!!

I would like to assure you that customers are not 'a pain' for either Model Rail or Kernow. We value everyone's custom - it pays our wages - and we would like all our customers to be happy with the service they receive. Unfortunately, there are many reasons why that is a tall order. Here, in a nutshell is the response from Kernow to my enquiry:

 

 

Unfortunately this is the way that the Sagepay system works.  We were forced into this just over a year ago to comply with the latest regulations on Payment Card Industry regulations.

They don't take account of business taking orders way in advance of when the models actually arrive, as this is a scenario pretty much unique to the model railway world!  Almost everywhere else you go takes the money the second you place the order (theatre tickets, airline or rail fares, etc etc) and the situation of ordering a long time ahead just does not exist.

Ironically the lower tech website could handle all this fine, but it is likely to become more of a problem as people are upgraded to the newer higher security systems.

 

As I said previously, we do not receive many pre-orders from overseas, so this issue does not arise very often, hence the fact that I was unaware f it. (CJL)

Edited May 3, 2016 by dibber25

[brushman47544]

Just to add that for overseas internet orders that you can include a specific comment (there's a comments box) on the (pre-)order page saying that you do not want Kernow to reimburse you immediately for items that are not in stock. Ok they have your money for a potentially indefinite period but it means you avoid the currency transaction charges.