Wright writes.....

[gr.king]

Tom: If you're J3 is going to have the Stirling class D tender, more typical for the class than the more modern Ivatt tenders, the five or six pages of waffle staring here may be of use:

http://www.lner.info/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2443&start=4275

 

Tony: Lovely loco, though I can see the evidence of the poor fit of some parts of the valve gear. Even with the slidebars well inclined, their bottom edge at the rear is still above the foot of the motion bracket. Presumably none of Morgan's  partial Thompson A2 valve gear etch turned out to be of any help in the struggle?

 

Before long, I MUST get the two Hornby conversions finished off properly....

 

Edited November 25, 2016 by gr.king

[CUTLER2579]

At risk of sounding like an advertisement for Warner's / Key Publishing or the Tony Wright Appreciation Society, The DVD of Biggleswade is available until Tuesday for £8.50 from  Key Publishing as part of their "Black Friday" sale.I have had a copy for years and I think it's superb, especially at the price.

 

Regards,Derek

 

PS. It would seem they may already have sold out since yesterday evening.Sorry if that's the case Guys.

Edited November 25, 2016 by CUTLER2579

[jwealleans]

Tom: If you're J3...

If Sir sees that before he sets off, Mr. King, you're in for 6 of the best at Warley.

[micklner]

P2 20 painted.jpg

 

For some reason the lower picture in the post above got scrambled.

 

Here it is again. 

 

My apologies. 

 

Lovely Loco, but a slight pedant mode comment, Handrails Green on Tender and Silver on Loco ? She needs some Gibson much better Wheels on the Tender too IMHO .

[grob1234]

Tom: If you're J3 is going to have the Stirling class D tender, more typical for the class than the more modern Ivatt tenders, the five or six pages of waffle staring here may be of use:

http://www.lner.info/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2443&start=4275

 

Tony: Lovely loco, though I can see the evidence of the poor fit of some parts of the valve gear. Even with the slidebars well inclined, their bottom edge at the rear is still above the foot of the motion bracket. Presumably none of Morgan's  partial Thompson A2 valve gear etch turned out to be of any help in the struggle?

 

Before long, I MUST get the two Hornby conversions finished off properly....

 

STA79758rmw.jpgSTA79808rmw.jpg

 

Thanks Graeme, just in the R&D phase at the moment, I'll have a peruse of that thread you link to.

 

If Sir sees that before he sets off, Mr. King, you're in for 6 of the best at Warley.

 

is all I can say to that ^^^ !!

[t-b-g]

A query from a non expert in P2 matters here. Did 2002 run in service without the extra smoke deflectors? I know it was built without them but from what I recall reading, wind tunnel tests showed up a problem and the extra deflectors were added very early.

 

What I don't know is if the wind tunnel tests and the modification were carried out before the loco went into traffic It doesn't make the model wrong, just that it is modelled "as built".

 

I know that there have been books on the class but I don't happen to have them!

[Tony Wright]

Tom: If you're J3 is going to have the Stirling class D tender, more typical for the class than the more modern Ivatt tenders, the five or six pages of waffle staring here may be of use:

http://www.lner.info/forums/viewtopic.php?f=3&t=2443&start=4275

 

Tony: Lovely loco, though I can see the evidence of the poor fit of some parts of the valve gear. Even with the slidebars well inclined, their bottom edge at the rear is still above the foot of the motion bracket. Presumably none of Morgan's  partial Thompson A2 valve gear etch turned out to be of any help in the struggle?

 

Before long, I MUST get the two Hornby conversions finished off properly....

 

STA79758rmw.jpgSTA79808rmw.jpg

Thanks Graham,

 

Not really with regard to Morgan's etched bits. I'm keeping those for another A2/3 conversion - this time of a DJH kit. 

[jrg1]

A query from a non expert in P2 matters here. Did 2002 run in service without the extra smoke deflectors? I know it was built without them but from what I recall reading, wind tunnel tests showed up a problem and the extra deflectors were added very early.

 

What I don't know is if the wind tunnel tests and the modification were carried out before the loco went into traffic It doesn't make the model wrong, just that it is modelled "as built".

 

I know that there have been books on the class but I don't happen to have them!

RCTS Green Bible:  2002 built 10/34 extra deflectors fitted 4/35.  Working from Doncaster shed until sent to Scotland 5/35.

When the extra deflectors were fitted, the original casing was cut back 1' 0" at the front end and the beading removed from its edge.  The nameplates were refitted 7.25" lower down to clear the curved portion. Extra curved plates were fitted between the original casing and outer deflectors to aid smoke clearance.

[Tony Wright]

Mick,

 

If you're at Warley, ask Ian about the colour of the handrails. 

 

 

Now, I'm in pedant mode. 

 

With regard to the tender wheels, they're almost invisible from general viewing distance. Though the Gibson ones might be finer, it's my experience that the Jackson/Romford/Markits ones are always concentric, do not shift on their axles and the tyres never come off. That way the P2 can bomb round LB without fuss or failure. And, if you want a better looking bogie wheels, why do you stick with Hornby and Bachmann ones on your conversions? Difficult to paint, I suppose. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

 

[Tony Wright]

If Sir sees that before he sets off, Mr. King, you're in for 6 of the best at Warley.

I did see it!!!!!

[Tony Wright]

A query from a non expert in P2 matters here. Did 2002 run in service without the extra smoke deflectors? I know it was built without them but from what I recall reading, wind tunnel tests showed up a problem and the extra deflectors were added very early.

 

What I don't know is if the wind tunnel tests and the modification were carried out before the loco went into traffic It doesn't make the model wrong, just that it is modelled "as built".

 

I know that there have been books on the class but I don't happen to have them!

Tony,

 

As someone else has already mentioned, EARL MARISCHAL ran in its original form for six months. The owner (or he will be the owner on Saturday) wanted the loco as-built, because he thinks the extra deflectors looked ugly. 

[Headstock]

P2 20 painted.jpg

 

For some reason the lower picture in the post above got scrambled.

 

Here it is again. 

 

My apologies. 

 

Earl Marischal at last!

 

Cock of the North was a handsome looking locomotive, however,  2002 was definitely the prettier and more curvaceous younger sister, a beautiful looking piece of modeling teamwork. I have to agree with the comments made by GR King as regards the valve gear. Could the motion bracket be formed into a gull wing shape to allow it to be tucked neatly up under the platform? I'm certain this would allow the relocation of the slide bars.

 

With the proliferation of P2 locomotives on East coast mainline layouts (some in BR green), the Aberdeen road must have been running short of motive power in model railway land, has this route ever been modeled?. I would be interested in knowing how many runs were made by these beasties on the southern end of the east coast mainline. There is some film of 2002 thrashing along on an East coast express before the disfiguring smoke deflectors were added. The train looks pretty big so it may have been some sort of test run.

[Tony Wright]

Earl Marischal at last!

 

Cock of the North was a handsome looking locomotive, however,  2002 was definitely the prettier and more curvaceous younger sister, a beautiful looking piece of modeling teamwork. I have to agree with the comments made by GR King as regards the valve gear. Could the motion bracket be formed into a gull wing shape to allow it to be tucked neatly up under the platform? I'm certain this would allow the relocation of the slide bars.

 

With the proliferation of P2 locomotives on East coast mainline layouts (some in BR green), the Aberdeen road must have been running short of motive power in model railway land, has this route ever been modeled?. I would be interested in knowing how many runs were made by these beasties on the southern end of the east coast mainline. There is some film of 2002 thrashing along on an East coast express before the disfiguring smoke deflectors were added. The train looks pretty big so it may have been some sort of test run.

Thanks Andrew,

 

The slidebars are in the right place - it's the motion-support bracket which is a bit too long at its base. I'll try bending it inwards at the bottom. That said, I don't think it's too far out. 

[t-b-g]

Tony,

 

As someone else has already mentioned, EARL MARISCHAL ran in its original form for six months. The owner (or he will be the owner on Saturday) wanted the loco as-built, because he thinks the extra deflectors looked ugly. 

 

Thanks Tony. I would agree about the appearance with the second set of deflectors. They did look a bit like the afterthought that they were!

 

When you look at the piston rod on the model, it does look as if it is pointing at the centre of the driven axle, which is where it should be. Is there a small gap between the motion bracket and the bottom of the footplate? Perhaps a tweak there (as in a double bend to lift the outermost section) might raise the bracket enough so that the back end of the slidebars lines up with it.

 

In any event, it is nitpicking in the extreme over what is a lovely model!

Edited November 25, 2016 by t-b-g

[micklner]

Mick,

 

If you're at Warley, ask Ian about the colour of the handrails. 

 

P2 21 in service.jpg

 

Now, I'm in pedant mode. 

 

With regard to the tender wheels, they're almost invisible from general viewing distance. Though the Gibson ones might be finer, it's my experience that the Jackson/Romford/Markits ones are always concentric, do not shift on their axles and the tyres never come off. That way the P2 can bomb round LB without fuss or failure. And, if you want a better looking bogie wheels, why do you stick with Hornby and Bachmann ones on your conversions? Difficult to paint, I suppose. 

 

Regards,

 

Tony. 

 

Gibson Tender and Bogie wheels never had the latest one lose a tread or wobble, occasionally wagon/coach wheels run out of true , perhaps the newer/later moulds have ended the problem. You hit the nail on the head re bogie wheels I cannot paint the lining on wheels and would never try to !! therefore I suffer the thick flanges .

 

Never been a fan of Jacksons they look very old fashioned and are totally wrong looking . At one time I think you could get a casting to fill the void between tread and axle, no idea if still available.

 

As to Warley , never been and never will thanks. Perhaps someone who is going, would like to query the handrails if they speak to him, as I have never seen a LNER Loco in such condition.

 

I have just looked at RCTS 6B and its vague as she started normal running. Regarding the  very ugly additional defectors it states April 1935 for the fitting.   She did trial runs in as modelled condition in Dec 1934 Kings Cross to Doncaster and return with upto 400 tons on at times  !!.  

Edited November 25, 2016 by micklner

[Killybegs]

Gibson Tender and Bogie wheels never had the latest one lose a tread or wobble, occasionally wagon/coach wheels run out of true , perhaps the newer/later moulds have ended the problem. 

 

I think Gibson wheels have definitely improved. The old ones that I have in stock and are certainly not concentric, the off centre axle hole in the boss is clearly visible with the naked eye. This does nothing for road holding on P4 pony trucks. I think I will have to order new pony and tender wheels for my 9F.

[Mallard60022]

That P2 looks a real beauty. I know it sounds 'iffy' but if you almost close the eyes and just take a very quick glance from that front 3/4 view, it almost looks like an original 'Packet'.......however I have had a Brandy this lunchtime.

Looking forward to pics of it performing at Grantham.

If I had built that to that standard I wouldn't give a #### about the tender wheels as long as they worked.

Phil

[grob1234]

 

As to Warley , never been and never will thanks.

 

Pourquoi?

[drmditch]

Before long, I MUST get the two Hornby conversions finished off properly....

 

STA79758rmw.jpgSTA79808rmw.jpg

Yes please. I need Mons Meg for hauling heavy loads south from Edinburgh - at night when no-one is supposed to see!

[Headstock]

Thanks Andrew,

 

The slidebars are in the right place - it's the motion-support bracket which is a bit too long at its base. I'll try bending it inwards at the bottom. That said, I don't think it's too far out. 

Hi Tony,

 

Regarding the motion bracket, it is probably only a couple of mill out enough to put the radius rod on an angle rather than straight as it would be if the loco was in mid gear. I was thinking that the right-hand slidebar looks a little high at the cylinder end thus not parallel to the piston rod, it may be an optical illusion. On the painting front, I have never done a full LNER green livery so I'm strictly armchair but shouldn't the smoke-box hinge strapping and dart be polished steel?

[Clearwater]

That P2 looks a real beauty. I know it sounds 'iffy' but if you almost close the eyes and just take a very quick glance from that front 3/4 view, it almost looks like an original 'Packet'.......however I have had a Brandy this lunchtime.

Looking forward to pics of it performing at Grantham.

If I had built that to that standard I wouldn't give a #### about the tender wheels as long as they worked.

Phil

I think in my book of locos that never were, I read OVS first contemplated a2-8-2 before settling on the MN design?

[richard i]

I think in my book of locos that never were, I read OVS first contemplated a2-8-2 before settling on the MN design?

He did, and some have tried to model it. It would have looked great. It was turned down due to fear of the stability of a front pony at speed ...I think.

[Focalplane]

He did, and some have tried to model it. It would have looked great. It was turned down due to fear of the stability of a front pony at speed ...I think.

 

There would be a lot of truth in that given that many North American high speed passenger steam locos from the same era had the Northern wheel arrangement - 4-8-4.  The rear bogie was for supporting a large firebox, but the front bogie must have had the purpose of controlling stability.

[Mallard60022]

I think in my book of locos that never were, I read OVS first contemplated a 2-8-2 before settling on the MN design?

C'était l'influence Française, je crois, and perhaps the USA, however as Bulleid had worked with Gresley then that man's thinking would have been an influence I'm sure.

2.8.2s were popular in Europe for long distance passenger work, but I don't really know a lot about that and if it was before the 2nd great war.

I've driven a Polish Pt47 2.8.2 and it was as rough riding,rather like a rowing boat in a Force 9 when going tender first. Not too bad forwards but at never more than 50mph. Firebox was as big as my car!

 

Phil

[MJI]

He did, and some have tried to model it. It would have looked great. It was turned down due to fear of the stability of a front pony at speed ...I think.

 

 

Riddles locos were OK with a front pony at speed 90mph at least once