Level crossing stupidity...

[boxbrownie]

13 hours ago, rab said:

One of the main roads in Plymouth was reduced to 30

a few years back; its now being raised back to 40.

i wont go into the reasons, as that would be against

forum rules.

Don’t know which one you mean but I am always doubly careful in Plymouth as some of the roads change without seemingly any reason and it’s sometimes a challenge to know!

 

So far so good though

 

Taken that back…..just in case 

[boxbrownie]

12 hours ago, newbryford said:

 

Round my way, a number of 20mph signs have been removed in favour of the previous 30.

Partly because they were erected without proper paperwork and it's also difficult to do even 20mph because the road is so narrow/full of parked cars.

 

That’s odd, around here it’s 20 mph for that very reason…..and it seems to work, everyone does 25 mph 

[boxbrownie]

12 hours ago, newbryford said:

 

On a similar theme, this is a view from a 20mph road. 

https://goo.gl/maps/2ZPsooYULKJZZyF67

It looks daft but I would imagine their reasoning is there is no exit from the school onto that particular road and it is otherwise a normal urban town road.

 

Still seems daft though.

[alastairq]

Anyone travelling to Bridlington from a southerly direction would have found, a few years back, that a quite long village-&-rural environment main road, had a quite long 40 mph limit. This reverted back to a split of 50 & 30 limits [within the confines of a village]....

 

The route twixt Beverley & Hull [not the bypass], when I drove buses for a living, once had a 50 & 60 mph limit [50 for the bus]...which was reduced to 40 & 30 limits.....then 30 all the way, now back up to 40 for a short stretch.

Seems one cannot prevent car drivers from crashing into each other with the higher limits..so they get reduced.

So don't blame local authorities, blame car & van drivers, lower limits are all their faults.

[KingEdwardII]

2 minutes ago, alastairq said:

lower limits are all their faults.

Plus, particularly on busy roads, significant pressure from local residents. We had a campaign in our own village for a 30MPH limit on the main road, heavily used by runners, cyclists, horse riders (etc). Neighbouring villages had more vociferous campaigns for their own limits, including events where they blocked the road in rush hour simply by having a chain of people continually walking across it. Such pressure does have it effects since local councillors get to feel the heat.

 

All the villages now have 30MPH limits through their centres.

 

Yours, Mike.

[alastairq]

As an aside.....reasons for imposition of speed limits sometimes are down to car & van drivers being unable to avoid crashing into each other.

At my last marital home, a small rural ''community'' just off a main road...the limit was the rural NSL. {60 or 50 depending on category of vehicle]

 

There are a number of road junctions either side of this main road along its length....including a small school.

There are also long, uninterrupted [almost] lengths.

 

The most frequent type of collision that occurred [especially at the crossroads where I lived, but common enough at other road junctions further along]...was the rear-ender, into a vehicle stopped, & waiting to turn right.

Drivers got into what I would have referred to as 'motorway' syndrome....a NSL road, main route, they cease to expect someone to stop to turn right.

How dare anyone stop to turn right? [Giving way to oncoming traffic being the reason for stopping]

It became a fortnightly occurance for us to call out the three nines to a collison.

Inevitably, the LA did it's due process, and emplaced a 50 mph limit for the length of road that had the major village junctions off it.

Oddly, subsequently, the collision rate fell dramatically, as folk gradually complied.  At 50 mph, [rather than the 60-plus mph of a NSL]...drivers found they had a little more time to respond to other vehicles turning off, and onto, the main route.

 

 

With reduced speed limits, what drivers & riders seem totally  unable to grasp is, a speed limit isn't aimed specifically at them....at spoiling their fun.

Speed limits are mainly there to help and assist other road users to cope with the traffic on that road. Road users intending to join a route, or cross it, may have, for various reasons, a very limited view up & down that major route....from the side.

By reducing traffic speed via limits [cannot rely on drivers voluntarily taking notice of road signage, and adjusting their speeds...care & attention, etc] this gives the rest of the world of road users a half decent chance of emerging, or crossing, without worrying overly much about vehicles travelling at high speeds, suddenly appearing into their line of sight, as they pull out.

It helps other road users cope with what would normally have been race track speeds [closing speed especially]....when going about their normal road-user business.

 

edit...KingEdward beat me to the general gist....

Edited March 10, 2022 by alastairq

[Mark Saunders]

There are lots of drivers on the roads who don’t know that van speeds are different on duel carriageways and other roads to the car speeds! 

[rab]

4 hours ago, boxbrownie said:

Don’t know which one you mean but I am always doubly careful in Plymouth as some of the roads change without seemingly any reason and it’s sometimes a challenge to know!

 

So far so good though

 

Taken that back…..just in case 

https://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/news/plymouth-news/plans-underway-return-tavistock-road-6201994

 

Seems like it's only a partial increase to 40.

Still a couple of 30 sections to catch us out 

[alastairq]

1 hour ago, Mark Saunders said:

There are lots of drivers on the roads who don’t know that van speeds are different on duel carriageways and other roads to the car speeds! 

 More to the point, despite much confusion over definitions, the 'van' mentioned by Mark above applies to a goods vehicle with an all-up laden weight over 2 tonnes.

Those under 2 tonnes when fully loaded [to manufacturer's weight specs]...are known as 'car-derived vans.'

 

Not all vans derived from cars remain under the 2 tonne laden weight limit.

Not all vans that cannot immediately relate to a car, have a laden weight over 2 tonnes.

An example of the latter is the Suzuki Carry range.

[Michael Hodgson]

Yeah, but these vans all come in white.

[Nick C]

54 minutes ago, alastairq said:

 More to the point, despite much confusion over definitions, the 'van' mentioned by Mark above applies to a goods vehicle with an all-up laden weight over 2 tonnes.

Those under 2 tonnes when fully loaded [to manufacturer's weight specs]...are known as 'car-derived vans.'

 

Not all vans derived from cars remain under the 2 tonne laden weight limit.

Not all vans that cannot immediately relate to a car, have a laden weight over 2 tonnes.

An example of the latter is the Suzuki Carry range.

And then of course, some motorhomes come under the car limits, and some under the goods one!

[boxbrownie]

3 hours ago, Mark Saunders said:

There are lots of drivers on the roads who don’t know that van speeds are different on duel carriageways and other roads to the car speeds! 

Hopefully the drivers of those actual vehicles do know!

 

But I fear that may not be the case, I can understand hire vehicle drivers not realising but hopefully those specific vehicles will have clear and obvious stickers warning of the limits which apply to that vehicle, but once again I would imagine those drivers couldn’t give a f——-fig.

[boxbrownie]

2 hours ago, rab said:

https://www.plymouthherald.co.uk/news/plymouth-news/plans-underway-return-tavistock-road-6201994

 

Seems like it's only a partial increase to 40.

Still a couple of 30 sections to catch us out 

Aha that one, we use it very often (Derriford) and TBH I find the 30 mph works well, almost everyone actually sticks to it and not just because of the cameras (only a couple though) but because everyone else sticks to it….a very odd situation indeed.   
 

It is almost always a very busy road and the 30 mph seems to keep it flowing fairly well, although TBF we obviously avoid it at all costs during times when even an anti tank missile couldn’t clear it.

[corneliuslundie]

"duel carriageways"

So that's what they are.

Hat, coat

Jonathan

Sorry, I couldn't resist it.

[Titan]

15 minutes ago, corneliuslundie said:

"duel carriageways"

So that's what they are.

Hat, coat

Jonathan

Sorry, I couldn't resist it.

Just be careful of rusty old tankers labelled "FLAMMABLE"

 

https://youtu.be/hMgCg6SaS6U

 

Back on topic?

Edited March 10, 2022 by Titan

[newbryford]

6 hours ago, boxbrownie said:

Hopefully the drivers of those actual vehicles do know!

 

But I fear that may not be the case, I can understand hire vehicle drivers not realising but hopefully those specific vehicles will have clear and obvious stickers warning of the limits which apply to that vehicle, but once again I would imagine those drivers couldn’t give a f——-fig.

 

I've never seen speed limit information inside or outside for that matter on the many vans I've hired over the years.

Edited March 10, 2022 by newbryford

[kevinlms]

Should we combine the 'Level Crossing Stupidity', with the 'Driving Standards' forum? We seem to be getting confused!

 

It seems that road signs cannot be read/understood, nor can topic headings!

Edited March 11, 2022 by kevinlms
More info

[boxbrownie]

10 hours ago, newbryford said:

 

I've never seen speed limit information inside or outside for that matter on the many vans I've hired over the years.

If they were the type that are restricted then that was a poor oversight on the part of the hire company, but TBH it doesn’t surprise me unfortunately.

 

What about height information?

Edited March 11, 2022 by boxbrownie

[PhilJ W]

I've driven a Transit 18 seater and the governor kicked in at 63mph (100kph). It wasn't a hire vehicle as such but Fords Dunton community bus. Its quite likely that hire vans are also governed.

[newbryford]

1 hour ago, boxbrownie said:

If they were the type that are restricted then that was a poor oversight on the part of the hire company, but TBH it doesn’t surprise me unfortunately.

 

What about height information?

 

The standard Transit/VW Transporters didn't - only the high roof or Luton type carry height info of the ones I've driven.

 

50 minutes ago, PhilJ W said:

I've driven a Transit 18 seater and the governor kicked in at 63mph (100kph). It wasn't a hire vehicle as such but Fords Dunton community bus. Its quite likely that hire vans are also governed.

 

Never hired a restricted van yet. Or one that I know was restricted. I've had some with trackers that report back to the hire company any excess speeding/aggressive driving. (Or so I was told by the hire company agent and I wasn't going to try and prove them wrong)

I used to volunteer drive a minibus for a local charity that had a speed limiter at 60 - that wasn't indicated anywhere inside or out.

 

Got to prolong the thread drift as we haven't - thankfully - had anything to get us back on topic.

Edited March 11, 2022 by newbryford

[Siberian Snooper]

The only vehicles that I have hired that were speed restricted are 7.5 tonnes and minibuses, everything else was 70+. I don't remember seeing the overall height marked either, but on the larger vehicles the hire agreement stated that I was responsible for any damage over 11ft.

 

 

[alastairq]

14 hours ago, kevinlms said:

Should we combine the 'Level Crossing Stupidity', with the 'Driving Standards' forum? We seem to be getting confused!

 

It seems that road signs cannot be read/understood, nor can topic headings!

 At least folk are looking, hopefully, at the thread?

But  it must be a quiet time out there on the world's level crossings?

Still, a bit of drift helps the world go round, eh?

[caradoc]

Getting back on topic, four fatalities in this US incident: 

 

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/chicago-four-people-killed-after-train-hits-car-on-railway-crossing/ar-AAUT7cr?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531

[Dunsignalling]

6 minutes ago, caradoc said:

Getting back on topic, four fatalities in this US incident: 

 

https://www.msn.com/en-gb/news/world/chicago-four-people-killed-after-train-hits-car-on-railway-crossing/ar-AAUT7cr?ocid=msedgdhp&pc=U531

Interesting that the headline is "train hits car" when the report clearly states that the SUV hit the moving train.

 

John

Edited March 11, 2022 by Dunsignalling

[rab]

16 hours ago, kevinlms said:

Should we combine the 'Level Crossing Stupidity', with the 'Driving Standards' forum? We seem to be getting confused!

 

It seems that road signs cannot be read/understood, nor can topic headings!

I guess drifting off thread is safer

than drifting off lane.