The Engine Shed

[TomScrut]

52 minutes ago, spamcan61 said:

This must make it particularly baffling for newcomers to the hobby / casual buyers who purchase a Hornby catalogue then wander into a Hornby stockist with money to spend only to find that:-

 

1) A good chunk of the Hornby items (hopefully) in the shop aren't in that year's catalogue (being earlier releases).

 

2) Many of the items in the catalogue won't be available for another year or two, if ever.

 

Which is the exact opposite of what I recall it being like in the early to mid 90s, although I was only primary school age so might not be accurate.

[TomScrut]

1 hour ago, No Decorum said:

It might. On the other hand, if Bachmann did as everyone else does, it would be easier to plan. I know why Bachy does it this way – it’s because of the many complaints about delays. From my point of view, it’s a case of, “Be careful what you wish for”.

 

I suppose the main thing is if you buy a desirable but not essential item one month which prevents you getting your hands on a must have item announced the next then that will be pretty disappointing.

[Dunsignalling]

3 hours ago, No Decorum said:

I thought I would ask Mr. Kohler, who checked and confirmed that the bottom of the chassis will be 2mm clear of the flange. My thanks to him. There are all sorts of things which might be tried in order to get flanged trailing wheels to go round tight curves. For example, just making the frames out of brass rather than thick plastic. Most though, will add to the cost but ensuring that the wheels will turn shouldn’t cost much if incorporated at the design stage.

Some though definitely not all of the locos with rigid trucks can be modified (without too much difficulty) to give enough movement to go round 24" curves with flanged wheels fitted.

 

TBF to Hornby, though, with the flangeless ones in place, they don't look any sillier on train-set curves than anything else.

 

Just a different kind of silly!

 

I don't have to deal with curves tighter than 36", which rigid trucks and flanged wheels can handle,  so I prefer the look of them.

 

John

Edited August 30, 2022 by Dunsignalling

[Dunsignalling]

2 hours ago, No Decorum said:

It might. On the other hand, if Bachmann did as everyone else does, it would be easier to plan. I know why Bachy does it this way – it’s because of the many complaints about delays. From my point of view, it’s a case of, “Be careful what you wish for”.

TBH, extended delivery timescales don't bother me in principle, so long as things arrive roughly when promised. 

 

The thing that got people's goat (mine certainly) with Bachmann was announcing things for two years hence that eventually took four or five to turn up.

 

John

Edited August 30, 2022 by Dunsignalling

[melmerby]

Amongst the various photos in Signal Box, I noticed Hornby had slipped in a picture of the first EP for "Lion":

 

Mmmm.😮

[Oldddudders]

7 hours ago, Wickham Green too said:

I'm intrigued by "the Southern style railway station building, typical of the kind that would be found all the way from Kent through to Penzance." ... what sort of screwed-up history are they trying to peddle there ? - I'm sure someone will recognise the actual inspiration for this model but there's no way the same building, in the same stone, would have been typical of those erected by the L.C.D.R. or S.E.R. and the L.S.W.R. ..... assuming they mean Padstow rather than Penzance anyway ! ( The only feature which would have appeared from one end of the Southern to t'other is the green paint detailing.)

Perhaps someone confused Tress and Tite?

[The Stationmaster]

4 hours ago, SteamingWales said:

 

How about all of the new 2022 new tooling announcements?

 

Out of the Turbomotive, Black 5, multiple unit thing, "Beavertail" Obs coach and LNER Coronation coaches only the Turbomotive has reached EP1 (as far as we know). Unless someone is hiding livery samples of all the other I would expect most to be delivered back end of 2023 or early 2024 TBH

According to 'one of my sources' (a. very reliable one usually) the Coronation coaches were originally sufficiently advanced for them to be announced in the 2021 rogramme but they were delayed a year because there was so many other new announcements for that year.

 

As i've long been saying - even before the current Chinese factory problems and transport difficulties - I think the any annual announcement big bang and an accompanying catalogue of promised dates has really had its day in the UK model railway market.  In many respects because the competitors for our money are far more fleet of foot with their announcements.

 

Whether or not we can afford something when we have not had a year (or, nowadays, several) to save for it is a very different argument.  If it takes, say, a t year to save for a particular loco it also means that we will have had a year to put away cash for whatever might come along at shorter notice to take our fancy.  In both cases the money has to be saved from whatever disposable income we might have so there's no real difference in simply saving it compared with saving it for a particular target.   However I do agree that there might be a problem if an irresistible 'nice to have' comes along and skims off the savings - but that surely comes back to trying hard to resist the 'nice to haves' and concentrating on waiting for any 'much needed' models.

 

PS Yes I know saving is not only a bit old fashioned (assuming you can do it in the first place) and that interest rates on savings are a sick joke of the very worst kind as my sole NSI savings certificate reminds me every year.

[Covkid]

4 hours ago, MikeParkin65 said:

By accident or design Hornby are now for me in a different category (a tier if you like!) than any of the other manufacturers in terms of my buying policy. Basically I dont care when or even if they make a particular model - I'll only be interested if its available from a retailer at a reasonable price compared to other products from their competitors.

 

Other manufacturers still have my loyalty and I'll mix and match pre ordering and impulse purchases as finances allow. I rather like Bachmanns current announcement policy whilst Accurascale have earned my loyalty. Rapido also likely to secure pre orders from me.

 

Hornby have pretty much exhausted my goodwill so whilst good to see they have made progress with the Turbo I'm definitely not going to pre order.  

 

I am with you on that Mike and fortunately for me my bag is mostly transition era freight on the border of LMR and a bit of BR(W). I have a Hall, Grange and Castle, 61xx and a 28xx, but that is really all Hornby can supply apart from Pecketts. So I am generally happy with Hornby's announcements each year.  Not sure how I would cope with a Midland 2F or an LNWR radial or an LNWR Caulflower, but I know Hornby wouldn't entertain them because their wheels aren't big enough and not enough lining for them 😀    

[Steamport Southport]

1 hour ago, Covkid said:

 

I am with you on that Mike and fortunately for me my bag is mostly transition era freight on the border of LMR and a bit of BR(W). I have a Hall, Grange and Castle, 61xx and a 28xx, but that is really all Hornby can supply apart from Pecketts. So I am generally happy with Hornby's announcements each year.  Not sure how I would cope with a Midland 2F or an LNWR radial or an LNWR Caulflower, but I know Hornby wouldn't entertain them because their wheels aren't big enough and not enough lining for them 😀    

 

What? 

 

The manufacturer that made the O1, J15, J36, Q6, 700 and Q1s, to name a few don't do small wheeled, unlined goods engines?!

 

A bit of a bizarre thing to say when most of the opposition have none at all in their ranges.

 

 

Jason

[MikeParkin65]

13 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

What? 

 

The manufacturer that made the O1, J15, J36, Q6, 700 and Q1s, to name a few don't do small wheeled, unlined goods engines?!

 

A bit of a bizarre thing to say when most of the opposition have none at all in their ranges.

 

 

Jason

Which is equally bizarre to reply with as the main established competitor has myriad similar freight types whilst the newer players are still building their ranges

[Steamport Southport]

2 hours ago, MikeParkin65 said:

Which is equally bizarre to reply with as the main established competitor has myriad similar freight types whilst the newer players are still building their ranges

 

So are irrelevant in the conversation until they have a few hundred items in their catalogue. 

 

The poster was saying Hornby doesn't make any. Which is blatently untrue. 

 

 

I'm sorry, I take it as just another swipe at Hornby whilst other manufacturers get away with the same things, and in some cases far worse, without comment.

 

I could make a long list of errors, poor mechanisms and compromises on recent models from "the new boys". But half the people praising them probably haven't even bought anything from them and are just looking for excuses to knock a manufacturer they have an agenda against for a different reason.

 

 

 

Jason

[Phil Parker]

3 minutes ago, Steamport Southport said:

I'm sorry, I take it as just another swipe at Hornby whilst other manufacturers get away with the same things, and in some cases far worse, without comment.

 

Because there is never any criticism of other manufacturers in their threads. That's going to make the mods job easier then...

[jjb1970]

I suspect the reason it can seem like there's an unduly negative attitude to Hornby is the level of interest in them as a company. Model railways is a hobby like any other, there are fashions and trends and people have favourites. I think it probably true that mistakes or questionable stuff from Hornby gets more attention than for other suppliers, probably because some suppliers can be on trend but it's probably more the aggregate level of interest in Hornby. And in fairness the negativity tends to be more about things like their ability to supply retailers and non-model stuff (Hornby is almost like the soap opera of the hobby). The only time I remember them having a break from that privileged position was when DJM replaced them as the scale EastEnders for a while.

Edited August 31, 2022 by jjb1970

[Hroth]

In general The Engine Shed is veering further from its glory days than before. Marketing really have torn the heart and soul out of the blog.  Yes, its nice to see the progress being made with "Turbomotive" but the rest of the content is, dare I say, boring.

 

The teaser on the Dorset Steam Fair* was all road vehicles, even though some were steam powered.  I hope some of the visitors to the Hornby tent got a bargain or two...

 

* We're promised twice as much next time. Oh Joy!

 

[jjb1970]

18 minutes ago, R. Knowles said:

I wasn't involved in modelling when DJM came and went, so I don't really know the story there. Only recently got back into the hobby.

 

When it comes Hornby itself however, as you say, I think there are some criticisms that are valid. Amongst other recent things, the way they have chosen to treat retailers is of course one obvious but prime example. I'm afraid my embargo still stands - preowned/or heavily-discounted items via retailer (such as some of their HAAs I've purchased, as well as a preowned top-tier Class 56, which I was lucky enough to pick up for only £95) being the exceptions.

 

The only thing Hornby seem to be doing right now is entertaining us all with one shenanigan after the other!  

 

DJM really did take the biscuit, in the end it was actually rather sad and disturbing to see a company and an individuals dreams and aspirations crash in the way it did. I know it's a cliché but it really was a case of watching a crash in slow motion.

[No Decorum]

19 hours ago, jjb1970 said:

I suspect the reason it can seem like there's an unduly negative attitude to Hornby is the level of interest in them as a company. Model railways is a hobby like any other, there are fashions and trends and people have favourites. I think it probably true that mistakes or questionable stuff from Hornby gets more attention than for other suppliers, probably because some suppliers can be on trend but it's probably more the aggregate level of interest in Hornby. And in fairness the negativity tends to be more about things like their ability to supply retailers and non-model stuff (Hornby is almost like the soap opera of the hobby). The only time I remember them having a break from that privileged position was when DJM replaced them as the scale EastEnders for a while.

I have been very critical of Hornby but I don’t think unduly so.  I can’t say I like the way Hornby is treating its retailers but I won’t let that stop me getting a model I want. What has stopped me on several occasions recently is the problems reported with Hornby models. Every manufacturer produces problematical models from time to time but Hornby seems to be the worst. The derailing 91, the giant capacitors in the APT, the light bleed in the LNER IETs and the paint finishes on GW and BR steamers. Hornby badly needs to get a grip on QC.

[Guest]

10 minutes ago, jjb1970 said:

 

DJM really did take the biscuit, in the end it was actually rather sad and disturbing to see a company and an individuals dreams and aspirations crash in the way it did. I know it's a cliché but it really was a case of watching a crash in slow motion.

 

Sounds pretty grim. I know there's a whole page and several threads on here that I'll have to look into. It'll be a lengthy read.

[HExpressD]

24 minutes ago, R. Knowles said:

I remember once, when I was still a little native and only coming back into hobby, purchasing a recently-released Class 60 (no: 60015 "Bow Fell") via Amazon - something else which I would now avoid! The model in question had bodyside cracks. Needlessly to say I sent it back and got myself a refund, careful never to make that mistake again!

 

One model I'm glad never to have owned, since they were first released around the time I was out of the hobby, was the "top-tier" Class 31. Because of all the horror stories I have heard regarding Mazak rot.     

Only a very small number of specific mid 2000's R number Class 31s had Mazak Rot, which is a shame as it appear to have tarred a very good model with a rather soiled brush.

[Guest]

I know it wasn't the product to have suffered this, I understand that quite a few of the steamers such as the T9s and 9Fs had the same problem.

 

Also, to be fair, I understand that Hornby themselves weren't only ones with this issue, as there have been some cases regarding products from Heljan and even Bachmann.

Edited September 1, 2022 by Guest

[Hroth]

At least there is a comprehensive list of models affected by mazak rot/zinc pest maintained on RMweb.

 

it includes ALL manufacturers, not just Hornby!

 

[Neal Ball]

Well that was an "interesting" catch up by reading the last two pages.... Some of which I agree with and the rest is... different peoples opinions 😄

 

I do though think the "Engine shed" blog has lost it's edge.... but to be honest, its a few years since it was an interesting read. In those days, you felt you might get an insight into what's going on, maybe a surprise or two.

 

Today though Hornby are being out-marketed by Rapido @rapidoandy, whose monthly newsletters are always entertaining / illuminating and generally followed by a raft of emails as everyone announces the new items.

 

But of course for Hornby, the enthusiast market is a small proportion of their sales. They still produce models, but a lot are sold into "Toy shops".

 

It would be interesting to see how Hornby view themselves alongside such new companies as Rapido and Accurascale @McC, both of which are clearly aiming for a more niche market. They are not producing Train sets 😄

 

Whether Hornby will ditch the Annual catalogue, I doubt it, as I am given to believe that Simon Kohler likes the annual launch. We keep saying that this year the new additions will be smaller... but it doesn't seem to be the way.

 

I just wish they would do..... Oh! Its September - way too early for wish-listing 😎

 

It's a time of change in the business as new companies take their market share, which means for the likes of Hornby and Bachmann it's a period of adjustment. The next few years will see if both companies can rise to that challenge.

 

We will all have our own views on that.....

[Dunsignalling]

Easy solution if the annual "big bang" announcements persist.

 

Print 2024 on the cover of the next catalogue, and cover it with a removable sticker with 2023 printed on it.😀

 

John

Edited September 2, 2022 by Dunsignalling

[Black 5 Bear]

The September edition of the Engine Shed is now available to view, featuring articles on Lion and Evening Star.

https://uk.Hornby.com/community/blog-and-news/engine-shed/head-pride

[Johan DC]

Excuse me my ignorance, who is John Hawley they refer to?

[Skinnylinny]

11 minutes ago, Johan DC said:

Excuse me my ignorance, who is John Hawley they refer to?

He's a member of the Old Locomotive Committee, and he is responsible for having produced technical drawings of the locomotive.