Hornby 2022 Black 5 new tooling

[farren]

1 hour ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

Remove the "S" on the HTTPS code and it works. It's a HTTP. Seems to be a fault when coming from some search engines.

 

 

http://www.247developments.co.uk/

 

Parts for Black Fives. Comet all day long I'm afraid.

 

https://www.wizardmodels.ltd/

 

But why would you need them for the new Hornby version seeing as according to the TV programme they can make every version built including 44767?

 

Why not wait until they are made before wanting to replace parts. I don't think they've even got to the Engineering Prototype stage yet!

 

 

Jason

Good point I forgot about comet, mind 247 is useful for the Red5’s.

I’ve done all the chopping of black5s I am ever going to do myself. The only new Hornby black5 I’m interested in is Caprotti. 

[Jub45565]

Brassmasters are also worth considering for black 5 bits (or even the all bells & whistles kit if people want to go all the way to town!)

[wappinghigh]

I couldn't get access to the illusive Hornby Black5 new tooling "TV programme". Has anybody got a youtube link to it? Thanks

[wappinghigh]

7 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

 

 

But why would you need them for the new Hornby version seeing as according to the TV programme they can make every version built including 44767?

 

 

This hobby can get way too serious and what better than to poke a bit of fun at the myriad of different Black5's and the current preserved railways "attempts" at an iconic version. So might lighten up a bit with "Glasgow Highlander"45147  aka  45407 and run it as both - 2 locos in one. I won't be able to do much about the firebox (artistic license required) but needs a dome running (in disguise) currently. Can't afford several model variations of Hornby Black5's right now... Heck with inflation running at 10% who knows what the prices will be in 2025! If I cave in to Hornby and eventually get a second (and who knows when it might become available!) I'll get a 5025 in LMS livery with riveted tender. 😀

Edited April 21, 2023 by wappinghigh

[TravisM]

I saw 44932 on Saturday and I'd like to model it if possible, are any of the Black 5's announced in 2022, a close representation of this loco?

[MikeParkin65]

11 hours ago, jools1959 said:

I saw 44932 on Saturday and I'd like to model it if possible, are any of the Black 5's announced in 2022, a close representation of this loco?

Hornby have a decent model of 44932 as preserved (though with the late crest it then ran with) in the current tooling. Was offerred as part of  a 'Northern Belle' train pack I believe.

[wappinghigh]

^The real locomotive looks a Nice example of a preserved Black5.

2011 tooling? 8 pin DCC. Part of West Coast railways pullman?? 

What will be the specific differences between the 2011 and this new 2023 tooling? 

[Hilux5972]

6 hours ago, wappinghigh said:

^The real locomotive looks a Nice example of a preserved Black5.

2011 tooling? 8 pin DCC. Part of West Coast railways pullman?? 

What will be the specific differences between the 2011 and this new 2023 tooling? 

The 2011 release is based on tooling from 2002. Nothing more needs saying really. 21 years of progress in detail. 

[Covkid]

8 hours ago, wappinghigh said:

What will be the specific differences between the 2011 and this new 2023 tooling? 

 

Hopefully the area below the smokebox will look considerably more realistic, amongst other stuff. 

[farren]

On 26/04/2023 at 12:50, wappinghigh said:

^The real locomotive looks a Nice example of a preserved Black5.

2011 tooling? 8 pin DCC. Part of West Coast railways pullman?? 

What will be the specific differences between the 2011 and this new 2023 tooling? 

The older tooling isn’t that bad really, the main areas that need attention can all be done with some modelling. Under the smoke box between the frame extensions needs cutting out, a plastic card piece glueing inside the body will sort that out. There is a small pipe that needs fixing on the right looking at the front too. The tender needs the coal bunker cutting out and rebuilding adding a tool tunnel helps. The lip at the top of the tender chassis needs cutting of the gap filled and some brackets added. Markits bogies really help finish it off. 
 

extra mile detail Comet front bogie and drop in a set of drive wheels. Which are a straight swap if they are designed the same as the Stanier rebuilds Scot/pats. (I haven’t done the drive wheels) 
 

I’ve done 5 out my six black 5s and have no interest of buying the new ones. The detail will be refined I am sure but it’s not going to be massive other than the wheels which will help. I am expecting the difference on the body to be the same as the new vs the older Princess Coronations with not a lot in it from the point of the body other then the lack of needing to take a knife to your new model. 
 

Personally I don’t see the point of replacing my black 5s 5 of which probably cost less than a new model from eBay when bargains could be had. 
 

the Caprotti is the exception. 

amendment 

I mentioned the drivers thinking that they were the Hornby ones missing the Stanier taper wheel but looking at a photo of one of mine the driver wheels don’t look too bad. Old image missing the Markits bogie wheels. 

Edited April 27, 2023 by farren

[wappinghigh]

^ Fascinating. I had no idea there was such interest in upgrading Black5 models. 😀 Is there social media group or some other link where this is discussed in more detail? Is there a secondary market for these out there?

Cheers. W

Edited April 27, 2023 by wappinghigh

[farren]

3 hours ago, wappinghigh said:

^ Fascinating. I had no idea there was such interest in upgrading Black5 models. 😀 Is there social media group or some other link where this is discussed in more detail? Is there a secondary market for these out there?

Cheers. W

I haven’t come across one, I learned from other peoples posts. My own attempts and the Locomotives profile books on the black 5s. But you could always start one. People are bond to add ideas, a link would be useful and would save this topic for the new model. 

[MikeParkin65]

9 hours ago, wappinghigh said:

^ Fascinating. I had no idea there was such interest in upgrading Black5 models. 😀 Is there social media group or some other link where this is discussed in more detail? Is there a secondary market for these out there?

Cheers. W

Dormant for a couple of years but I got a lot of inspiration from this thread - 

 

[Wheatley]

11 hours ago, wappinghigh said:

^ Is there social media group or some other link where this is discussed in more detail?

 

You're on it. 

 

Not all the photos are toast - https://www.rmweb.co.uk/topic/19802-detailing-a-Hornby-black-5/#comment-193168

 

[scots region]

Well despite the fact that you would be forgiven for forgetting that Hornby has an ongoing new Black 5 project, we finally have physical evidence of it. 
 

 

https://uk.Hornby.com/community/blog-and-news/engine-shed/view-p2

 

Sarcasm aside do actually look very good, though whether they’ll be good enough to warrant any fleet replacements is going to be a matter of personal preference and economy measures. I suspect we’ll need to see how they look painted up

 

ScR

[Steamport Southport]

I would think more "fleet adding" than replacements. You can't have enough Black Fives!

 

 

 

Jason

[G-BOAF]

It does look rather good.

I'm not a fan of the huge loco-tender connector though, especially given that its much lower than the actual location of the drawbar.

Cosmetically I think I prefer the old method of think connector and a few wires that could pass for the hose connections of the prototype.

 

If course the Hornby Britannia and the new 9F (among others) had things spot on, with a drawbar that comes out of the slot where the prototype drawbar would be.

[Wheatley]

1 hour ago, Steamport Southport said:

I would think more "fleet adding" than replacements. You can't have enough Black Fives!

 

Yes ! I think I've got 8 ...

 

They still can't do bogie wheels on that evidence. Be delighted to stand corrected on that one when they show up.  

[GreatWesternFan220]

I do hope those lamps are supplied in a detailing bag rather than being factory fitted; just my personal preference. If not then I have no problem with removing them and forming the brackets (or are they irons? I've seen them described both ways) using after market items. Other than that, it looks superb. The running board and tender frames appear to be die-cast. Much rather have the "plug n play" connection than the wires if I'm honest, even if it does spoil the gap ever so slightly. The valve gear is an improvement over the previous version in my opinion; much more prototypical. Will be interesting to see if Hornby depict the bearing on the eccentric rod in future models, where appropriate of course (examples being 44871, 44932 and others).

[Steamport Southport]

4 minutes ago, GreatWesternFan220 said:

I do hope those lamps are supplied in a detailing bag rather than being factory fitted; just my personal preference. If not then I have no problem with removing them and forming the brackets (or are they irons? I've seen them described both ways) using after market items. Other than that, it looks superb. The running board and tender frames appear to be die-cast. Much rather have the "plug n play" connection than the wires if I'm honest, even if it does spoil the gap ever so slightly. The valve gear is an improvement over the previous version in my opinion; much more prototypical. Will be interesting to see if Hornby depict the bearing on the eccentric rod in future models, where appropriate of course (examples being 44871, 44932 and others).

 

I have a feeling that is the one with the lights, sound and smoke.

 

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/br-stanier-5mt-black-5-4-6-0-44726-steam-generator-era-5-r30225ss

 

I don't think the normal version comes with fitted lamps.

 

 

 

Jason

[atom3624]

A lot has obviously changed - diecast running plate and tender chassis frames by the looks of it.

A lot of 'details' look identical to existing Super Detail 5's - I've got 3 of them.

Al.

[26power]

In the "side on" shot there looks to be an awful lot going on behind the arched holes between the axleboxes.  Should there be more daylight there?

[Steamport Southport]

6 minutes ago, 26power said:

In the "side on" shot there looks to be an awful lot going on behind the arched holes between the axleboxes.  Should there be more daylight there?

 

You mean the tender?

 

Water scoop and apparatus.

Brakes and brake gear. 

Sieve Box.

 

Quite a lot going on under there. Click on the diagrams here.

 

https://www.brassmasters.co.uk/StaniertenderInstns.htm

 

 

 

 

Jason

[26power]

4 hours ago, Steamport Southport said:

 

You mean the tender?

 

Water scoop and apparatus.

Brakes and brake gear. 

Sieve Box.

 

Quite a lot going on under there. Click on the diagrams here.

 

https://www.brassmasters.co.uk/StaniertenderInstns.htm

 

 

 

 

Jason

Sorry, yes missed out the important tender word!  
 

I appreciate that there is the water scoop and brake gear behind the frames but it all looks rather “solid”, appreciating it is in shadow.  I wondered if it was a sort of continuation of the electrical connection with the locomotive, as that is at that sort of underfloor level.  Anyway, just idle thoughts!

[Hilux5972]

16 hours ago, GreatWesternFan220 said:

I do hope those lamps are supplied in a detailing bag rather than being factory fitted; 

Given that the lamps are going to be lit, I’d say they won’t be removable unless you’re happy to lose the light feature