Hornby 2023 - New tooling - DELTIC prototype - Hornby Dublo

[RedgateModels]

Plus the makers plates and the ones under the dummy headlight on the nose

[The Stationmaster]

19 hours ago, Brit70053 said:

As a content owner of a Bachmann version of this loco, I've paid but casual attention to this topic, but I do have a question arising from ZR2498's post on 28th June, which has just taken my attention.

The last 'feature' listed on the advertisement reproduced in that post is 'Etched Nameplates'. As I've never knowingly seen nameplates on either the real locomotive or on any photograph of it, I'm wondering if I've missed something of its history or whether this is not an authentic detail being offered on the Hornby Dublo model.

              I photographed the painted name on DELTIC the other day just to reassure myself of the situation as in preservation and hopefully that *picture is attached.

               Can anyone say if the prototype has ever had separate name plates attached please ?

                Thanks in anticipation of any informative replies.

 

               Regards,

 

                              John

 

Ps I see that the photo has downloaded rotated from the original despite my efforts to alter the original to prevent this. My apologies.

 

  

 

.

 

Here you go -

 

 

[Porcy Mane]

20 hours ago, RedgateModels said:

Plus the makers plates and the ones under the dummy headlight on the nose

 

And the large circular cast Ee  plate at the opposite end to the builders plate.

Edited July 30, 2023 by Porcy Mane

[Brit70053]

Many thanks to cctransuk, , Redgate Models and Porcy Mane for pointing out those embellishments which could be realistically represented by etched replicas and by implication confirming my thought that DELTIC has never had separate nameplates.

Additional thanks too to The Stationmaster for rotating my photo to a much more natural position, it looks so much better.

 

Regards to All

 

John

[MikeParkin65]

6 hours ago, Brit70053 said:

Many thanks to cctransuk, , Redgate Models and Porcy Mane for pointing out those embellishments which could be realistically represented by etched replicas and by implication confirming my thought that DELTIC has never had separate nameplates.

Additional thanks too to The Stationmaster for rotating my photo to a much more natural position, it looks so much better.

 

Regards to All

 

John

Fox make a lovely etch of all of the appropriate plates for ‘Deltic’ - got a set for fitting to my Bachmann version 

[RedgateModels]

10 hours ago, MikeParkin65 said:

Fox make a lovely etch of all of the appropriate plates for ‘Deltic’ - got a set for fitting to my Bachmann version 

 

Indeed, that's what I used on my own Dapol kit based version

 

The nose plates were a bit too wide for the Dapol kit nose though.

 

[Porcy Mane]

For the Bachmann model, I found both the Fox and the Modelmaster  (not much chance in getting hold of those at the mo) etched builder plates and Ee roundels too small. The tampo printed plates compared to the prototype for size were OK.

I wonder what the Hornby representations will be like for size? 

 

 

Edited July 31, 2023 by Porcy Mane

[Vistisen]

18 minutes ago, Porcy Mane said:

For the Bachmann model, I found both the Fox and the Modelmaster  (not much chance in getting hold of those at the mo) etched builder plates and Ee roundels too small. The tampo printed plates compared to the prototype for size were OK.

I wonder what the Hornby representations will be like for size? 

 

 

One thing that strikes me about the bottom photo is that you can see how uneven the bodywork is by the reflections of the light. Particularly under the grill, there almost seems to be a horizontal crease sloping upwards towards the door. If Hornby reproduced it, would people complain about the model being damaged in transit?

[Brit70053]

 

1 hour ago, Vistisen said:

One thing that strikes me about the bottom photo is that you can see how uneven the bodywork is by the reflections of the light. Particularly under the grill, there almost seems to be a horizontal crease sloping upwards towards the door. 

Could that be the legacy of conflict with Newcastle Central's platform ?

 

John

[adb968008]

8 hours ago, Porcy Mane said:

For the Bachmann model, I found both the Fox and the Modelmaster  (not much chance in getting hold of those at the mo) etched builder plates and Ee roundels too small. The tampo printed plates compared to the prototype for size were OK.

I wonder what the Hornby representations will be like for size? 

 

 

interesting..

 

the model is more accurate that the real thing…

 

the real thing is missing its bogie steps to the cab.

[adb968008]

I also just noticed Deltics bogie frame, is that a piece of rail (upside down) running across the front of the bogie at the very bottom ?

 

was that a kind of primitive wheel guard ?

Edited August 5, 2023 by adb968008

[cctransuk]

4 hours ago, adb968008 said:

I also just noticed Deltics bogie frame, is that a piece of bull head rail (upside down) running across the front of the bogie at the very bottom ?

 

was that a kind of primitive wheel guard ?

 

Looks flat-bottomed to me!

 

Perhaps intended to ensure that damage to the track and loco was minimised in the event of a derailment?

 

CJI.

[RedgateModels]

A few close ups I took years ago at Shildon ...

 

 

[palmsticks]

5 hours ago, adb968008 said:

I also just noticed Deltics bogie frame, is that a piece of bull head rail (upside down) running across the front of the bogie at the very bottom ?

 

was that a kind of primitive wheel guard ?

 

33 minutes ago, cctransuk said:

 

Looks flat-bottomed to me!

 

Perhaps intended to ensure that damage to the track and loco was minimised in the event of a derailment?

 

CJI.

 

9 minutes ago, RedgateModels said:

A few close ups I took years ago at Shildon ...

 

 

 

Made for the railway, made out of railway!

[RedgateModels]

Also modelled in the Kitmaster/Dapol kit 🙂

 

[adb968008]

So the next question, aside of being a cheap wheel guard… is who’s railway is it made out of ?

LMS ? nCB ? Something out the back of the yard ?

 

looks like it had it from day 1..

 

http://www.napier-chronicles.co.uk/0221.htm

 

Deltic MacGyver

Edited August 2, 2023 by adb968008

[cctransuk]

5 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

So the next question, aside of being a cheap wheel guard… is who’s railway is it made out of ?

LMS ? nCB ? Something out the back of the yard ?

 

looks like it had it from day 1..

 

http://www.napier-chronicles.co.uk/0221.htm

 

Deltic McGyver

 

Interesting use of red paint above the fuel tanks and below the outside - I presume that is part of the mainframe?

 

CJI.

[Bulleidboy100]

On 31/07/2023 at 16:11, Brit70053 said:

 

Could that be the legacy of conflict with Newcastle Central's platform ?

 

John

 Back in the day there were rumours that Deltic also helped remodel the edge of a platform at Finsbury Park?

[The Stationmaster]

1 hour ago, Bulleidboy100 said:

 Back in the day there were rumours that Deltic also helped remodel the edge of a platform at Finsbury Park?

It reportedly remodelled the edge of several platforms when it first arrived on the ECML although I don't know if Finsbury Park was among them.

 

On 02/08/2023 at 12:46, cctransuk said:

 

Looks flat-bottomed to me!

 

Perhaps intended to ensure that damage to the track and loco was minimised in the event of a derailment?

 

CJI.

It looks, among other things,  to have served as providing lower down support at the back of the life guards (aka 'guard irons' in model railway usage).  It certainly wouldn't have prevented track damage in the event of a simple derailment but depending on the way they were arranged it might have helped reduce damage to the bottom of traction motor/gear housings.

 

Equally it might just have been added to stiffen the bogie frames?  The bogie design has a number of similarities to the layout of the bogies  on LMS 10000 and that appears to have a round steel bar mounted higher than the 'rail' on the Deltic bogie (where the frames drop down lower at the outer ends than they did on 10000.  And the bar is not present on the rather different design of bogie used on the production Deltics - which statistically were far more likely to suffer a simple derailment than the prototype.

[atom3624]

This has got to be one project to keep an eye on.

I'm wondering how much extra detail and additional drivetrain modifications (cf what we're accustomed to with Hornby) they'll be bringing to the table.

Al.

[E100]

 

There's mention at 20:19 that the design is complete and effectively confirmation that working fans are included.

Edited October 10, 2023 by E100

[woodenhead]

That was an interesting podcast, much more detailed and from someone who understand the mechanics of designing a product, the class 50 looks and sounds good too.  With a HST along soon you could see the beginnings of a nice little BR period Western Region layout coming along, though from what I heard the Large Logo 50 is in as preserved livery not 1980s livery, is that right?

[MikeParkin65]

This in the cabinet at Warley. Clearly an early development model so unfair to criticise. I didn’t get chance to talk to anyone at Hornby about it.  

[Dunsignalling]

On 29/06/2023 at 17:37, rogerzilla said:

So it's exactly like the purple WC - makes more money for Hornby, but shafts the buyers of the first batch, who presumably looked at the high price and decided its limited run would make it worthwhile in terms of future value.

Unless it comes with a Certificate stating it's a limited edition, such statements only apply to the initial release. AIUI, the new "Hornby Dublo" locos are customarily made in batches of only 500, but they're not described as "Limited Editions". 

 

In any event, most old model trains only become valuable because the majority get worn or broken over time. I suspect that (for instance) purple WC's bought as "investments", will survive in abnormally large numbers, having never been out of their boxes, which will lessen any appreciation. 

 

The law of Supply and Demand always applies. More collectors of  (original) Hornby Dublo have been leaving the marketplace than entering it in recent years. The stuff that is truly "mint and boxed" still makes good money, but the value of anything less nowadays drops off rather more steeply than in the past.

 

I went to a swap-meet on Saturday and, had I been so inclined, could have purchased a fair selection of near mint HD items, with imperfect, missing, or replica boxes, for 35-40% of what they would have fetched five or ten years ago; e.g. a flawless but unboxed Signal cabin with an asking price of just £6.

 

John 

Edited November 26, 2023 by Dunsignalling

[adb968008]

1 hour ago, Dunsignalling said:

Unless it comes with a Certificate stating it's a limited edition, such statements only apply to the initial release. AIUI, the new "Hornby Dublo" locos are customarily made in batches of only 500, but they're not described as "Limited Editions". 

 

In any event, most old model trains only become valuable because the majority get worn or broken over time. I suspect that (for instance) purple WC's bought as "investments", will survive in abnormally large numbers, having never been out of their boxes, which will lessen any appreciation. 

 

The law of Supply and Demand always applies. More collectors of  (original) Hornby Dublo have been leaving the marketplace than entering it in recent years. The stuff that is truly "mint and boxed" still makes good money, but the value of anything less nowadays drops off rather more steeply than in the past.

 

I went to a swap-meet on Saturday and, had I been so inclined, could have purchased a fair selection of near mint HD items, with imperfect, missing, or replica boxes, for 35-40% of what they would have fetched five or ten years ago; e.g. a flawless but unboxed Signal cabin with an asking price of just £6.

 

John 

1970’s /80’s Hornby/ Mainline is junk food too.

 

Were rapidly entering an age were 1st Gen Chinese toolings are being replaced…

When the rebuilt MN is inevitably retooled, thousands of Hornby ones are rapidly going on ebay.

it will be inflation alone that dictates their bottom line value.

 

We saw this with the Bachmann 66, though after the Hattons ones came, that reverted a little, though the deckine may resume on the Bachmann one as the Accurascale one arrives.

Edited November 26, 2023 by adb968008