57xx Pannier Tank Family, By Accurascale

[Fair Oak Junction]

22 minutes ago, Pteremy said:

With Hornby including a 57xx in phase 4 of their TT120 schedule do you think that they were also intending to do a new 00 version? I know the design issues are different - but there would be some benefit in spreading the costs of research etc across 2 scales, and (I assume) using the same sound recordings.

 

Considering Hornby's pricing of late I imagine a new tooled Pannier would cost at least £200.

But at least then they could do an "inspired by" GNSR Ochre one 😄

[Steve Purves]

49 minutes ago, BVMR21 said:

Will ask if the Accurascale lads could clarify if the artwork will be updated to show the correct route circles on the pre-1950 liveries? (i.e. blue not yellow)

 

Absolutely! They have in fact already been changed since the files were published. It was spotted in the abyss between finalising launch media and the actual announcement being made.

 

The same can be said for the roof handrail, this is purely an EP/drawing combination issue. We have the correct bits but not necessarily in the right order on the EP

[Metr0Land]

11 hours ago, The Johnster said:

 

 

 

The problem is that, if you want a specific loco by renumbering in this way, you need dated and verified photographic evidence.  It needs to be dated because the topfeeds were attached to the boilers (no sh*t, Sherlock) and the boilers moved around between engines, and sometimes between classes.  This is because it took about three weeks to overhaul the loco, but five to overhaul, test, and certify the boiler, and there was always demand for erecting shop bays, not to mention that the beancounters wanted the loco back in traffic earning money as quickly as possible.  So, when the loco arrived at works for main overhaul, the boiler was taken out and sent to the boiler shop, and when it was time for a boiler to be put back in the frames, the boiler shop would send the next available overhauled and tested boiler to get the loco back into traffic.

 

This means that it is difficult to trace which boiler was fitted to any individual loco at any given time.  A loco built with a topfeed boiler might emerge from an overhaul with a plain boiler, and vice-versa, and then revert to topfeed at it's next works visit.  Overhauls were based on mileage not time in service, so it is difficult to extrapolate forward or backwards from a known photograph with any degree of reliability.  We can assert generalisations; a loco photographed ex-works is going to keep that boiiler for some time, and over time as more topfeed boilers were built ther was a general tendency for topfeeds to become more common, but this sort of generalising is a sure route to inaccuracy.

 

 

 

I use the excellent Red Panniers book for my LT research.  Without doing a detailed survey this morning, a couple of examples:

L98 was without topfeed in summer 67 and with topfeed in winter 98 (assuming dates are correct)

There were two L90's.  The first had topfeed until scrapping, whilst the second was without in Sept69 and with in June 71 (suggesting a late boiler change or incorrect date for the earlier pic?)

 

I'm sure there are other examples which I haven't documented and this is within a small class over a relatively short time frame.

[Miss Prism]

1 hour ago, Wickham Green too said:

... or is a bolted-on beam a preservation thing p'raps ?

 

No. The hex heads existed in early BR days. (I'm trying to track back further.)

 

[Steve Purves]

1 hour ago, BVMR21 said:

Will ask if the Accurascale lads could clarify if the artwork will be updated to show the correct route circles on the pre-1950 liveries? (i.e. blue not yellow)

 

Duplicate - Deleted

Edited November 24, 2023 by Steve Purves

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

19 hours ago, StuartGWR said:

Will it have spring(s) and down/up travel on the centre axle? This makes a fantastic difference to slow running, as on Rapido 15xx......  Many reviewers ignore this vital point on 3-axle chassis.

This feature remains a strong point of the early Bachmann conventional chassis mechanism 0-6-0T: 57xx, 3F, 08 and 56xx, (the latter only requiring 30 seconds sawing to make it an 0-6-0) also the Dapol/Hornby J94 and Airfix GMR/Mainline/Hornby N2; and, though done a little differently, Oxford Rail N7.

(There may well be more, these are the items I have purchased.)

 

As above, this is really effective in ensuring dependably reliable pick up.

[The Stationmaster]

16 hours ago, Captain Kernow said:

Admittedly what we can see of the pre-production 57XX on the AS website seems to have nice, fine grilles on the rear cab windows but I've not seen any photos of how they will treat the 8750, which I think is much harder to get convincingly right.

 

So much so that I always leave the Bachmann mouldings in place as I have yet to see an etched replacement that convinces, even if it has been applied neatly.

 

I did once apply individual lengths of 5 amp fuse wire to the rear of a Hornby 8750, carefully shaped like the prototype and each one individually glued in and the glue allowed to fully dry before the next one was put in. I did the same with my K's 1451. It all took ages to do....

 

I did the rear cab windows on two Hornby ones using fine florists wire - b nor t quite so thin (not quite to scale as 5 amp fuse wire but still pretty effective).  Great fun dtilling the holes to sink it  into in order  to get a secure fit.  I used the same stuff beaten flat to make the lamp irons and forthe bracket for the tools  on the bunker back - work hardened it is very strong and doesn't damage or bend easily.  And beating it one plane at a time and then bending a round part before flattening it to create the other plane needed for some lamp irons gots excellent results, plus leaving a round shank to glue into a drilled hole.  I think we used to call it modelling.

 

14 hours ago, Miss Prism said:

 

Some pannier wheels  (from Leaky Finders' own 9629)

 

Link doesn't seem to open?

[The Stationmaster]

16 hours ago, gwrrob said:

 

According to PP2 the power class was blue C changing to yellow from 1950 all except 9700-10.

Not the Power Class but the Route Availability Rob. ( although 9700 - 9710 were always Blue RA   GWR Poewer Group was C,   BR power Group was 3F  - which was slightly daft as they did a lot of passenger work - but they only ever carried the Western Power Group letter even in BR days.

[The Stationmaster]

4 hours ago, Miss Prism said:

Bufferbeam fixings style
(can of worms factor: medium)

Ummm [wriggles uncomfortably], it seems bufferbeam fixings could be either domehead or hexhead. I have yet to work out why or when or if changes took place.
 

 

 

I wouldn't worry - it would have been deoendent on the bolts used and when the buffers were fitted to the engine.  Easier to get behind a buffer plank on an erecting pit that it would be at a running shed, or preservation site, and possibly easier to use different types of bolt.  So it could vary on the same engine at different stagestes in its life and possibly even between individual buffers on the same engine if one had been damaged. and had to be replaced at a running shed..

[melmerby]

3 hours ago, Miss Prism said:

 

No. The hex heads existed in early BR days. (I'm trying to track back further.)

 

Not on 57XX but looking in Russells loco books hex heads seem to be quite common

e.g. 5400 (the renewed 2080) has them, the brand new 7400 has them, however the brand new 5600 has domed heads as does 2251.

 

This picture sums up the problems with using preservation locos as a source

Both are from North British 1930ish

7752 & 7760 at Tyseley, showing numerous variations:

 

Both are from North British 1930ish

Edited November 24, 2023 by melmerby

[57xx]

3 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

I wouldn't worry - it would have been deoendent on the bolts used and when the buffers were fitted to the engine.  Easier to get behind a buffer plank on an erecting pit that it would be at a running shed, or preservation site, and possibly easier to use different types of bolt.  So it could vary on the same engine at different stagestes in its life and possibly even between individual buffers on the same engine if one had been damaged. and had to be replaced at a running shed..

 

I believe Russ is referring to the bufferbeam itself, not the buffer fixings. (Or both)

Edited November 24, 2023 by 57xx

[AY Mod]

@Phil Parker is a ducking thief.

 

[NHY 581]

3 hours ago, AY Mod said:

@Phil Parker is a ducking thief.

 

 

Rank has it's privileges.......and if that fails....possession is 9 points of the law....

 

Rob

 

Edited November 24, 2023 by NHY 581
Correction to sheer idiocy

[The Stationmaster]

3 hours ago, 57xx said:

 

I believe Russ is referring to the bufferbeam itself, not the buffer fixings. (Or both)

Then same sort of thiplus manufacturing variations to save money.  If the buffer plank is damaged and repaired locally it wouldn't necessarily be reattached in the same way it was in an erecting shop (and different works could well use different methods when themselves making repairs.  

 

But never use 'preserved' engines as a guide to something like that unless they are what you are modelling in that condition.  you'd need a complete history of teh work carried out on the engine to establish when that method was used and don't overlook the fact that the area in question is one of those prone to damage in everyday working.

[Wickham Green too]

2 hours ago, AY Mod said:

@Phil Parker is a ducking thief.

 

I trust the firebox glow won't be a regular on-off flash like that !

[melmerby]

20 minutes ago, Wickham Green too said:

I trust the firebox glow won't be a regular on-off flash like that !

And an eye piercing bright white

[AY Mod]

31 minutes ago, Wickham Green too said:

I trust the firebox glow won't be a regular on-off flash like that !

 

You know when you unlock your car in a big car park to see if the lights flash; hoping someone's not nicked it?

[AY Mod]

12 minutes ago, melmerby said:

And an eye piercing bright white

 

See above.

[melmerby]

So on a layout full of panniers you will spot the A/S ones flashing their presence.......😁

[Philou]

2 hours ago, NHY 581 said:

possesion is 9/10ths of the law....

 

Ahem - nine points of the law ............. apparently ;) .

 

[NHY 581]

3 minutes ago, Philou said:

 

Ahem - nine points of the law ............. apparently ;) .

 

 

You'd think I'd remember that.....

 

 

Edit- suitable correction made.

 

Edited November 24, 2023 by NHY 581

[Wickham Green too]

32 minutes ago, melmerby said:

And an eye piercing bright white

Well, it'll be a while before they get round to livery samples ! 😎

[Pteremy]

11 hours ago, Pteremy said:

On a point of detail, was the 1948 batch 9662 to 9672 identical to the 1949 batch 9673-82? If they were then I can preorder 9681 with the intention to renumber to 9670.

 

So amongst all you pannier rivet counters no one knows? My guess is that they were the same - i could live the fact that they were not, assuming the differences, if any, were minor. It would just be nice to know, one way or the other.

[Steve Purves]

Don't panic about the firebox glow. It was a "placeholder" LED, inserted to check the function ahead of configuring it! 

[Steve Purves]

22 minutes ago, Pteremy said:

 

So amongst all you pannier rivet counters no one knows? My guess is that they were the same - i could live the fact that they were not, assuming the differences, if any, were minor. It would just be nice to know, one way or the other.

 

I would have to check on the computer after the weekend but I think you are ok