Dapol 'Western'

[DapolDave]

Yes it's the N gauge one

2D at the start of the code signifies 2mm ( yes I know) and Diesel.

 

2S is steam etc

 

Cheers

Dave

[Enterprisingwestern]

 The Western seemed quite happy spending the day with Brian and Mike but I managed to get it back at the end of the day!

 

Not if it had been left up to me you wouldn't

 

Mike.

[Jon020]

Not if it had been left up to me you wouldn't

 

Mike.

You'd have to re-gauge it a bit Mike 

[Enterprisingwestern]

You'd have to re-gauge it a bit Mike 

 

I got me a hammer.

 

Mike.

[Gwiwer]

The first of a quintet of Dapol Westerns on order for Penhayle Bay has arrived down under.   The maroon FYE "Sultan" is the only one of the mainstream pristine releases I'm taking - the others will be the Kernow editions.

 

Out of the box the model runs very well.  Control across the speed range is superb and while the loco draws significant current (more than similar Bachmann locos) it isn't quite as thirsty as Heljan's recent releases and responds to gently-applied power with a smooth start.  Mine has just a tiny hint of "waddle" at one end which shows up more in one direction than the other and is not so bad that I feel inclined to re-wheel the beast.  It looks like a Western and is a significant improvement on the Heljan one in terms of shape and capture of those curves.  I am slightly less than convinced by the shades of both maroon and yellow in the livery but we can argue details like that forever without achieving consensus.  It's also 40+ years since I saw a maroon Western in traffic (other than preserved D1015 in its allegedly unauthentic shade) and those that I saw on the main line were painted (not tinted plastic), mostly work-stained and seen in natural, not artificial light.

 

The kit of parts requires an Optivisor or similar device to be on hand; so many bits and in some cases so small.  One brake rod was snapped in two in its pack but has been fitted and hopefully secured in position with a dab of adhesive at the break.  I haven't got as far as the lugs yet!  

 

On my model one of the four body fixing screws has been significantly over-tightened resulting in its cross-head being rounded out.  It is consequently impossible to remove and will require drilling out before I can get inside.  The others came out easily.  I confess to feeling a little let down by stick-on headcodes after the comments they attracted on the class 22 but bear in mind that this model was developed at much the same time, not afterwards, and as such the occasionally negative feedback given for the 22s could not have been taken on board for the 52s.  Once I can get inside I hope to be able to fit internal headcodes in addition to a crew and also switch off or cover the over-bright cab light such that it shows only a dim glow.

 

Overall this is a superb model.  The representation and level of detail surpasses just about anything we have seen in RtR items.   The input of RMwebbers is acknowledged in the paperwork which is a nice touch.  I look forward to having the weathered ones in due course.  My only and rather modest negatives are as above with the added note that while most of us here were aware of the need to fit name and number plates, which might be a surprise to some other purchasers, there is no instruction included on how best to do this and only a fairly basic drawing to show where any of the parts are supposed to go.  In that respect Heljan and Bachmann do rather better.

 

9.7 out of 10 overall.  And many thanks to Dave and the Dapol team, plus those RMwebbers whose specialised knowledge has helped the project along, for delivering something so superbly detailed and yet still affordable.

[the penguin of doom]

A very concise and to the point review Gwiwer.

 

Some very fair points from personal experience which is, (in my opinion), how reviews, both good and bad should be.

 

Cheers.

 

Sean.

[jjnewitt]

Not if it had been left up to me you wouldn't

 

Mike.

I'll have to make sure I thank Brian next time I see him then!

 

Justin

[Gwiwer]

A very concise and to the point review Gwiwer.

 

 

 

You're most welcome.  Anything which has travelled from China to the UK to Australia (in my case) has done well to survive the inevitable knocks and bumps of the shipping process.  I am happy to speak as I find and if something is a real fruit of the citrus variety then I would constructively say why I felt that was so.  When it's worthy of praise as in this case those responsible are due an electronic pat on the back.

 

We choose to pay increasing sums of money to obtain models of choice and I consider it fair and reasonable to provide both first-hand opinion and feedback having spent that money so that manufacturers, retailers and customers are able to make informed decisions not only on the item in question but on others and upon future projects as well.

[47137]

I ordered up a blue 'Western Venturer' from Dapol's online shop. The package arrived yesterday, but inside was a maroon 'Western Sultan' in a box for a blue 'Venturer'. Swapped box lids I guess. I phoned Dapol and the lady there told me "we have one blue one left in stock, I will post it out to you. Please could you send the maroon one back to our Freepost address". It seemed so nice to meet such a feeling of trust. The blue one was arrived today, just before I made it to the Post Office with the maroon one. This is surely the best "customer service" (without a name) you could imagine (the lady was in Accounts) ... Dapol full marks for service as well as this incredible model. And, if you are reading this thread pondering whether to actually buy one (as I was), do it soon.

[darren01]

Hi

I do hope more are made,please make more!

[Trainshed Terry]

Hi

I do hope more are made,please make more!

 

In Desert Sand Livery

 

Terry

[Horsetan]

I looked at Justin Newitt's souped-up all-sprung example and wondered whether the motor could be replaced by a coreless one.....

[Gwiwer]

D1056 has safely arrived and now sports its brake rigging, name, number and works plates though not the lifting lugs which I found to be too small for my skill and dexterity levels.  She's also been given a light dusting of grime mostly below solebar level so as not to appear too plastic.

 

I then took some comparison shots with Heljan and Hornby Westerns :

 

In all of the images below the Dapol loco is on the left, the centre one is a Heljan item and that on the right is from Hornby.

First a comparison of front ends:






Dapol fits a moulded valence with pipework in place at one end (shown); Heljan supplies a user-fitted flat valence with user-fitted pipes; Hornby does not offer a valence.

Dapol fits a slotted valence at the other end which accepts an NMRA coupler (two hooks supplied) and with the option to use the supplied blank valence instead or to fit slotted ones with couplers at both ends.  Heljan supplies hook couplers but if these are fitted the valence and some pipes cannot be used.  Hornby fits a large hook coupler with no other detail offered.

Dapol fits lamp irons, Heljan offers them as user-fitted parts and Hornby represents them crudely in the moulding.  The white "electrification" warning flashes seem compressed top to bottom on both Dapol and Hornby with the Heljan one best representing what I believe to be the correct proportions.

Dapol supplies glossy stick-on headcode characters for use outside the glazed panels; Heljan supplies printed paper ones for use inside the glazing while Hornby glues paper panels to the front of the loco with no glazing in use.

The hand rail beneath the windows looks good on both Dapol and Heljan but is grossly overscale on Hornby.  Window frames have been the subject of much debate during the development process.  Dapol does not represent the rivets as Heljan does; after lengthy debate (refer to earlier pages of this topic) it was determined that as these rivets are so small and are fitted flush to the frames they are overscale on the Heljan loco.  Hornby simply paints the window frames on.

Wipers are fitted by Dapol, supplied for user-fitting by Heljan and painted on by Hornby.
The distinctive hood over the cab windows is very well captured by Dapol.  Heljan famously represent this wrongly; it has been described as a baseball-cap look.  Hornby represent it better than Heljan but overall the cross section of their loco is too skinny making the hood too tightly curved.







Side and cab profile views which allow comparisons of shape and livery.  These were taken indoors under fluorescent light and render the colours different to those perceived outside in daylight.

Dapol includes extensive bogie detail including moulded on speedo cables and user-fitted brake rodding.  Wheels are blackened.  Heljan moulds good bogie detail but not as extensive as Dapol nor are brake rods supplied for use on operating models. Blackened wheels have a wider bare metal rim than Dapol.  Hornby includes basic detail with cheap wheels of the "pizza cutter" style.

Livery on the Dapol appears slightly less convincing than on Heljan with Hornby trailing in third.  The size of the BR logo is smaller on Dapol than the other two.

Overall Dapol comes in ahead of Heljan though the livery on the Heljan is slightly richer and to my mind more representative of BR diesel maroon and of the "warning yellow" used.  Both Dapol and Hornby look a little pale in daylight but all are perfectly acceptable as versions which could have been seen at times on the main line allowing for fade and the vagaries of colour perception.

Kernow MRC has posted images suggesting their commissioned ones will b supplied with ready-fitted nameplates and lifting lugs.  I'm happy to fit the plates (though even happier if it's done for me) though have abandoned all attempts to fit lugs to "Sultan".

Edited May 31, 2013 by Gwiwer

[SRman]

I like the comparisons, Rick. The Heljan model is not bad at all and the dreaded 'peak' is easily fixed with a file and some paint. The Hornby one looks a bit like a caricature when placed side by side with the others. I do like the Dapol model but not sufficiently to replace my Heljan maroon 'Western Talisman'.

 

Kernow have just posted on Facebook some pics of their weathered maroon Dapol version, which looks very good to me.

[Gwiwer]

The images Kernow MRC have posted look very nice indeed.  No Heljan Westerns will be replaced here either (the fleet stands at maroon SYP, maroon FYE and two blue) as they are superb locos if you get rid of that baseball cap.  The new ones will take the fleet up to nine and replace a pair of Hornby ones into the bargain.

[Andy1963]

The images Kernow MRC have posted look very nice indeed.  No Heljan Westerns will be replaced here either (the fleet stands at maroon SYP, maroon FYE and two blue) as they are superb locos if you get rid of that baseball cap.  The new ones will take the fleet up to nine and replace a pair of Hornby ones into the bargain.

I would like to get rid of the "peak" on my two Heljan Westerns, especially now I have a Dapol Western to sit along side them, but I am nervous about making a mess of it. Would be great if someone has a set of instructions with photo's, or knows of a link to a post of how to do this without spoiling what is otherwise a nice model.

[Gwiwer]

I simply took a mapping pen to one of mine (not the one used in the photos above) and turned the yellow black over the worst of the peak.

[Coppercap]

Dapol fits a moulded valence with pipework in place at one end (shown); Heljan supplies a user-fitted flat valence with user-fitted pipes; Hornby does not offer a valence.

 

Hornby Westerns did have a valance - of sorts. They clipped under the couplings, and moved with the bogie. Yours is (are) missing.

Edited May 31, 2013 by Coppercap

[Gwiwer]

None fitted or supplied with the three Hornby Westerns I have owned, two from new.  Maybe they only came with certain batches.  Either way the Dapol model offers the best valence option by far.  Not only in terms of moulding and having the delicate pipework ready-fitted on one end but by taking a thoughtful approach the coupler is taken through a slot in the valence rather than requiring in to be absent altogether.

[frobisher]

Gwiwer, on 31 May 2013 - 12:29, said:

 

Dapol fits a moulded valence with pipework in place at one end (shown); Heljan supplies a user-fitted flat valence with user-fitted pipes; Hornby does not offer a valence.

The Hornby ones did come with a valance I seem to recall, it was clipped to the bogie and coupling though (shudder).

 

We had both a Lima and a Hornby Western when we were growing up, and the Lima one always look better overall (Hornby's paint application was better though (early '80s)).

Edited May 31, 2013 by frobisher

[darren01]

Hi

looking at all three lined up one thing stand out is,Why has the Hornby one have the strange lines around the front end and the other two do not have this?.

Darren01

Edited May 31, 2013 by darren01

[DapolDave]

Hi Darren,

 

This is old school moulding that allows for the printing / painting process to follow the raised ridge of plastic. In this case the small yellow warning panel.

 

It was also used on their early 37 & 47 and probably more.

 

As printing etc has improved the need for these guide lines has all but disappeared. Thank heavens. :-)

Cheers

Dave

[Horsetan]

The Brassmasters kit may be of interest. Although intended for the Lima and Hornby 52s, who's to say you can't use it on a Heljan?

[the penguin of doom]

The Brassmasters kit may be of interest. Although intended for the Lima and Hornby 52s, who's to say you can't use it on a Heljan?

I intend to.....

[winterbournecm]

I would like to get rid of the "peak" on my two Heljan Westerns, especially now I have a Dapol Western to sit along side them, but I am nervous about making a mess of it. Would be great if someone has a set of instructions with photo's, or knows of a link to a post of how to do this without spoiling what is otherwise a nice model.

 

If you use weathering powders, it's possible to darken out the yellow under the peak. They regulary were heavily dirty under there. This takes away the "Glare" as it were.