Warley 2012

[34theletterbetweenB&D]

I have seen Lime Street before and been very impressed. It seems a little unfair to criticise it as being not much of a spectacle and say in the same breath that you couldn't get near it. Clearly a lot of people thought it a spectacle!

Never having seen it before in the flesh I was very favourably impressed; and on the subject of spectacle it was the end on view that did it for me. There was always space to view from the concourse end on the three times I stopped by on Saturday, and the views down the platforms and away was very evocative. Real ground contouring as in any large space, the structural detail of a Victorian cathedral of trains, enough distance that the tracks disappeared believably into the gloom beyond. (How about a little vapour curling lazily up to an overall roof fug?) And then a train moved, and it was near perfect.

[artisan100]

>that nice man at Comet Models

 

Geoff

Comet Models

[john new]

Maybe they should consider adding Friday as well if the attendance is still climbing?

 

Keith

 

Extra day suggested for Warley - a big no from me as our Society Promotions Officer and therefore an attendee at the NEC. Concur with everything the Stafford Show Manager Eltel says. Also don't forget this show probably draws in a higher % of long-haul exhibitors than any other as it is the national showcase event.

 

It already effectively takes up five days before you add any pre-event content preparation. Why five days, load car Thursday afternoon - set off after breakfast on Friday - Lunch time arrive then through to early evening to set up - Sat/Sun at show - too late in the year to safely predict the weather months in advance when booking the hotels as for me it would be a getting on for midnight home on the Sunday so stay over - Monday morning drive back then have the car to unload again into store. Most, probably all, other exhibitors/traders/Societies will have the same or similar issues before even considering human resources to crew the stand.

 

If the Show opened Friday night everyone would have to leave home earlier, the halls open earlier for measuring up, exhibitor set up etc. and then everyone would be be too knackered for say a 5:00 to 9pm opening so everything would shunt forward 24 hours and add costs to all concerned.

 

I can see why it was suggested from a visitor perspective but from the viewpoint of those involved in any aspect of the supply side of the event I think you'll get a resounding no-no-no-NO!

[robertcwp]

I thought this year's show was rather a mixed bag. There were a few too many layouts for my liking that were either train sets or where the stock or operation let them down but on the other hand there were some very impressive layouts. I liked the Blue Tram and Aberbeeg in particular. I seemed to put a curse on Lime Street as most times when I looked at it there was little if any movement though the layout itself looks good. Bath Green Park is a very impressive layout but would benefit from some better stock and more prototypical train formations (eg The Pines Express). A Tri-ang/Hornby Mark I BG (wrong length) is never a good thing to have on a layout. Neither is a Class 44 Peak numbered as a 45 (D12).

 

I was surprised at the amount of Bachmann stock on sale very cheaply includng some very recent releases (eg Class 85s).

 

I went on Sunday along with some friends. We parked in the station car park. I paid at the ticket office on the way out with no problem.

 

As a regular operator of an exhibition layout, I think two days is the optimum show length. We won't take Harton Gill to a one-day show and a three-day one means an extra day off for those of the crew who work (currently 2 out of 5). Three days of three-link couplings can be a bit much too.

[ELTEL]

 

 

You can't just have your say and expect everyone else to shut up! This THREAD (which is a very small part of RMWeb) is about the Warley show, which is probably the most important on the calendar, and where the issues you list are particularly apposite.

 

Ed

 

It was my say, and I am intitled to my opion as much as are you.

 

All I was trying to point out we're what the extra costs were both in monetary and people's time and effort and I stand by the facts I listed.

 

And Warley is the most important show on the calendar (not probably) and I have attended every one since the mid eighties

 

End off......

 

[arran]

HI All

 

Have been to the show in many ways over the years, with layouts and lately as a trader if the Saturday is to Busy and Sunday is not so,why not make the Sat more expensive and the Sunday cheaper at the door.

 

I know this would cause bother with the sale of advanced tickets but its worth a thought.

 

As for 3 day show they tend to have a historical reason for this but i would say i cant imagine Glasgow getting crammed into two days.

 

Regards Arran

[Barry O]

just as an aside,

 

I set of for Warley on Thursday - stayed over Thursday and got to the hall at 06:30 Friday. Floor marking was well under way, locos ( large 1' to the foot scale) were being delivered. Lorries were being loaded at the Warley Club. We set up the tables ( 600+) and managed to grab breakfast part way through this. I helped to set up a layout, and others went on to set out chairs etc.

 

I set up the demo table and then set up the Leeds MRS Picture display before leaving the building at about 5:30 (and people from the club who had been there at 5am where still there) Wash, change and off for some food - early night and then 06:30 Saturday off to the show ..... And it was a good show with increased attendance

 

BUT to go to 3 days - em no - not just for cost but for health reasons.....

 

Leeds used to Open on a Friday evening ( indeed it used to be Thursday/Friday/Saturday in the 1970s and 80s) - we stopped due to cost and also the availability of layouts and traders who could/would attend - Attendance on Friday was good as a lot of modellers visited then - but times change

[t-b-g]

As a seasoned exhibitor I reckon that two days is right for a show. One day shows are hard work as the loading/setting up and journeys are the hard bit and having a Saturday of just "playing trains" in between two "hard work" days gives the body a bit of recovery time and for me the Saturday is usually the most enjoyable day.

 

Three day and more shows (I have done Glasgow and York when it spread over four days with a half day on the Sunday) just take two much out of me and many of my friends. Getting a crew together is hard enough as people have families and real lives but asking them to commit to 4 and 5 days unpaid hard work is a lot to ask.

 

A day preparing the layout and servicing locos etc. A day breaking the layout down and loading up and transporting to the show, plus setting up. 3 or 4 days operating, then packing up and driving home, perhaps getting back very late in the evening then a further day unpacking, that requires another couple of days to recover!

 

I recall that there used to be a show in London that ran for a week, around 25 or so years ago. Round these parts, that would have ended friendships/marriages etc!

 

So, Warley and all the other two day shows are just right as far as I am concerned!

 

Tony

[Michael Delamar]

I was actually referring to the fact that the barriers were too far back rather than any crowds around it, managed to walk up to see it no problem but left disappointed I couldnt get nearer to appreciate the work that had gone into it.

 

I know exactly where you are coming from and it would annoy me too, i tried to get the barriers close but because the layout is a lot wider at one end and no 45degree barrier pieces it means the narrow end is far away. also because its operated at the front we need a bit of space to get past, at small shows with no barriers its not a problem you can get right in and have a look.

unofficially you can always make yourself known to me or ask one of the lads not operating at the closing stages of the show if you can come under the barrier and have a better look, did that with a few rmwebbers, the Dutch lads where doing that at the closing stages when Chris was showing him some of his perspective buildings.

[jamie92208]

Wakefield does the Friday evening and we get very good attendances on the Friday. Yes it is hard work but most of us are there all day Friday (And Thursday evening) anyway. Most of the layouts are in the same position and at the moment we have no plans to change. However as Tony says above times change and these things need to be looked at. Warley for me was a full day loading the layout bits, getting there and setting up on the Friday. 2 days standing answering questions which were hard on the feet then an evening taking down and getting home. I didn't get all the stuff put away and the car unpacked till Monday afternoon and was tired Monday night. So I agree the 2, 2 1/2 day show is about right. It is getting harder to get teams for longer shows and layouts tend to operate better with settled teams who know each other and how the layout operates.

 

Jamie

[t-b-g]

I know exactly where you are coming from and it would annoy me too, i tried to get the barriers close but because the layout is a lot wider at one end and no 45degree barrier pieces it means the narrow end is far away. also because its operated at the front we need a bit of space to get past, at small shows with no barriers its not a problem you can get right in and have a look.

unofficially you can always make yourself known to me or ask one of the lads not operating at the closing stages of the show if you can come under the barrier and have a better look, did that with a few rmwebbers, the Dutch lads where doing that at the closing stages when Chris was showing him some of his perspective buildings.

 

I got a similar impression at Ally Pally last year. It can be a problem with odd shaped layouts and "standard" barriers.

 

Perhaps it might be a case where John might consider making his own "layout shape hugging" barriers.

 

As if you guys don't have enough on your plates!!!!

 

Tony

[melmerby]

Come on chaps don't get too elevated about my (light hearted actually) suggestion that we could have a Friday.

I was commenting because I found, and no doubt some others would agree, that the period about 1200-1400 on Saturday was a bit of a crush, I left early because it was becoming difficult to see anything (I had a two day ticket).

 

A more practical suggestion could be a few more square metres of hall and widen the gangways.

I know it would mean more costs but could improve it no end.

 

I used to go to the BBC Good Food show and that started to get overcrowded.

They took more space, without any extra stands and it improved it immensely.

 

Again I realise that Warley and the Good Food show are not in the same league as regards the type of Exhibitors, so the extra costs have different impact on each show's viability

 

Keith

[Dukedog]

Come on chaps don't get too elevated about my (light hearted actually) suggestion that we could have a Friday.

I was commenting because I found, and no doubt some others would agree, that the period about 1200-1400 on Saturday was a bit of a crush, I left early because it was becoming difficult to see anything (I had a two day ticket).

 

A more practical suggestion could be a few more square metres of hall and widen the gangways.

I know it would mean more costs but could improve it no end.

 

I used to go to the BBC Good Food show and that started to get overcrowded.

They took more space, without any extra stands and it improved it immensely.

 

Again I realise that Warley and the Good Food show are not in the same league as regards the type of Exhibitors, so the extra costs have different impact on each show's viability

 

Keith

 

I too was wondering about this.

I noticed that although hall 5 is big, a lot of the space was "fenced off" and not used. Is there a reason for this?

 

I might be wrong but, surely if Warley club had paid the NEC for the hire of Hall 5 surely that would mean ALL of it(?)

I don't have all the facts so may be barking up the wrong tree but,maybe some one could throw some light on the reason for the unused spaces.

 

Cheers

Frank

[lmsforever]

Could do with more room but as said costs go up,extra day also increases costs not a new problem ,thirty years ago I had same problem but decided to reduce by two the layouts and stick to one day.The shape of the venue can cause problems ,my one was octagonal so had to be careful with lenght of layouts,but I would not want to organise a show now especialy Warley the strain must be tremendous.Thought that the show was pretty good although busy(a must for the accountants) liked the grouping of layouts under themes this made for easy location of interests .One last thing,when I arrived a chap was being attended to by Para medics,was he one of our lot , he looked very unwell. if he is a modeler or a biker hope he he is okay.

[pirouets]

I am sure I read some where in the past that thge reason for the fenced off area's is that the NEC charge by the area, rather than for the hall. Daft I know and will see if I can find the article that said that.

[James]

If the Show opened Friday night everyone would have to leave home earlier, the halls open earlier for measuring up, exhibitor set up etc. and then everyone would be be too knackered for say a 5:00 to 9pm opening

 

You should try playing with the big train set - sounds like a twelve hour shift would finish off most modellers!

[Barry O]

I am sure I read some where in the past that thge reason for the fenced off area's is that the NEC charge by the area, rather than for the hall. Daft I know and will see if I can find the article that said that.

 

Yes they pay by the floor space used - any additional space used put the costs up.

[RJS1977]

I think one of the Warley members posted that in a previous year's discussion.

 

I suspect that what's probably happened is that because Warley has to be fitted in around other, much bigger shows, the NEC sometimes offer them a bigger hall because it's the only one they've got available, and just charge them for what they use.Looking at a plan of the NEC, Hall 5's about the biggest hall there - Hall 4 for example seems more of a "fit" to the size of the show (and I think has been used in the past), but if Warley had used that this year, it would have been slap bang in the middle of the bike show! If the NEC said "Sorry, we've only got Hall 5 - you'll have to pay extra for it", the show might not have happened at all and the NEC would have lost a booking.

 

That said, I don't think there was as much "empty space" around the outside as in previous years.

[298]

Possibly (and only that particular bunch of capitalists would think of that idea), but isnt that area used on the sunday evening as dry and fairly hassle free loading....?

[Dublodad]

The Big Dublo train set took 6 hour and 11 people to set-up, who were all held up for 2 hours on the M40 by a tired car transporter that threww new Range Rovers over the motorway.

 

We were supposed to have access between 11:00 and 12:00, by the one person who wasn't held up wasn't allowed in at 11:00. I got there at about 1:00 PM and started the build up with my 3 passengers..

 

We needed to finish by 7:00 PM on Friday to get dinner in the hotel at Tamworth.

 

The layout and 11 "staff" were carried in 4 vehicles, A Voyager, a SAAB estate, a Laguna estate and a Focus estate. The layout was 30 ft x 24 ft on 30 tables.

 

Terry

[George Woodcock]

Hello

 

A good many modellers I know, including myself till last week, work more than twelve hour shifts including being out in all weathers.

Keeping the thread on track I and my friends had a great time at Warley last weekend with Brixworth Station. Seemed to be a good number of people who had been born there, lived there or came from the surrouding area. Look forward to next year when we will be there with Georgemas Jct.

 

Cheers

 

George

[Grasslands]

Great bit of video and decent sound track for a change!

 

BTW you can just see my blue MRG polo shirt behind the back scene on "Four Corners" at 25 seconds into the film!

Not my layout though! I was just helping out fellow Cradley Heath MRC member Doug Brazier with some operating.

 

 

Hi Frank,

 

I did think I recognised your face from somewhere. My Dad was the one pointing out the derailment of the Santa Fe loco at 1:32 in the video. He was particularly insistent about the points being the cause . I was the young one, trying to pretend I didn't know him . Granted that description probably doesn't narrow it down.

 

Tom

[Dave777]

I recall that there used to be a show in London that ran for a week, around 25 or so years ago.

 

I think that was IMREX? A 5 day show. I only know this from a single line about it in the first BRM annual.

[southern42]

>that nice man at Comet Models

 

Geoff

Comet Models

 

Very nice man

Ray picked up chassis kit for my 43xx

Polly

[Mike J]

Well, although I enjoyed my first ever Warley show, both as an exhibitor or customer, the whole weekend seemed to involve a lot of hassle, from being stopped by the police on the way down for using a mobile phone whilst driving the van, (which I wasn't, I hasten to add!) to the set up which revealed a broken control panel switch and four loose wires on the layout which took an eternity to trace. I know these things are nothing to do with Warley show itself, but I found that I didn't relax at all during the weekend, and had no time at all to take in the rest of the show. Several of our locos performed at less than acceptable levels, prompting the big hand from the sky, and we then had a point tie bar snap. Not one of The North of England Lines better shows. (On the other hand, our other attending layout, Haymarket Cross seemed to perform well)

I must however praise the stewards on duty, who were helpful and courteous at all stages and did a great job in guiding us Warley virgins to where we needed to be. Thank you to you all.

Will I do Warley again if invited? The jury is still out. The smaller shows are my preference, but I'm glad I finally got round to doing Warley.