Collett 'Bow Ended' Standard 57' Corridor Stock Coaches for 2016

[coachmann]

Do they have the correct rectangular shanks though?

 

Chris

Comet's cast GWR coach buffers do, which is where I get mine.

Edited February 9, 2016 by coachmann

[PUASHP]

Just purchased a pair of these great coaches.

 

Looking to convert to EM gauge. Does anyone have experience of this, is it just a case of fitting Gibson wheelsets?

 

Any advice would be gratefully received before I start attacking the coaches.

 

Paul

[Re6/6]

On a visit to Gaugemaster yesterday couldn't resist buying one.

 

It is indeed a rather fine model. 

[Bulwell Hall]

I managed to see a couple of these at the local BS4 meeting yesterday evening.  They really are very, very good indeed!  With a few minor tweeks and alterations they will be even better and are the most significant addition to the range of GWR coaches for years.  I look forward to mine arriving at some point with considerable anticipation but unfortunately they are stuck in Cornwall waiting for the All 3rds and Compos to arrive.  I may have to order another All 3rd though as I am sure they will have disappeared from the market within weeks and you can never have too many C54s!

 

Gerry

[Dunsignalling]

Do they have the correct rectangular shanks though?

 

Chris

No, they don't. I must admit that the vehicles I used them on aren't of GWR origin!

[57xx]

They do look a little undersize - they should be 18" diameter and are an essential part in giving the correct look to the end elevation.  The Hornby Hawksworth stock had the same error and it does make a difference once corrected.

Measured mine up - 5.2mm. I'm not going to quibble about 0.8mm, a lick of black paint to dull them down and I'm not going to notice once they are whizzing around.

[HowardGWR]

Looking at my new D95, comparing with the old 'railroad' version I have been recently savaging, I am pondering why Hornby did not originally just get it right.  I would have been easier to have done so, IMO.  Just the side tumble and the roof* being correct would have meant that this new release would never have been needed (again IMO) as the other detail would have been easily modified, in the same way that some of that modifying will take place with these.

 

BTW the buffer shanks are rectangular on the new model, but they should be slightly tapered.  So perhaps buffer replacement is advised.   Not only Comet can supply cast buffers but Dart Castings (MJT) do the full range of buffers, unsprung or sprung, and you can choose 18 " heads.  Usual disclaimers.

 

One final Q.  Has anyone found out how to extricate these new models from the fancy plastic protection innards without either damaging the said innards, or the model?  Thinking of the collectors.     

 

*I may do a 'blow by blow' on the railroad conversion attempt on the GWR Rolling Stock: model and prototype thread.

[chrisf]

Another reminder that the sprung GW coach buffers made by Dart Castings and Hubert Carr have round shanks - that's the slidy bit between the head and the stock - though it seems that many do not let a detail like this bother them.  David Geen sells cast brass ones.

 

Chris

[gwrrob]

  David Geen sells cast brass ones.

 

Chris

 

At a price.

[Craigw]

At a price.

 

Well yes.

 

They cost money to produce, should he give them away?

 

Everyone appears to be saying how cheap the models are, gives a few dollars to put towards the aftermarket people.

 

Craig W

[gwrrob]

Well yes.

 

They cost money to produce, should he give them away?

 

Everyone appears to be saying how cheap the models are, gives a few dollars to put towards the aftermarket people.

 

Craig W

Absolutely Craig but I was thinking of doing half a dozen but remembered them as being a tenner a set that's all.Quite right to support the aftermarket as I do at shows.

[57xx]

One final Q.  Has anyone found out how to extricate these new models from the fancy plastic protection innards without either damaging the said innards, or the model?  

 

It couldn't be easier. Open the box, slide plastic innard out, grip the centre section on the opening end and pull. It unlatches and the plastic innard folds open, remove undamaged coach.

[sp1]

Received mine at the weekend from Hereford Models - fantastic service from them - and about £5 cheaper than my favourite Cornish retailer (shouldn't have said that as seriously considering two more....)

My wallet is going to complain when the rest appear!

 

Now, how about a full brake etc.....

[Coach bogie]

Like a kid, I bought an extra Hornby Collett to take apart. Why? I have many unbuilt/part built BSL/Phoenix Colletts that I do not want to throw into recycling. Hornby designers, bless them, have produced a virtually flat underframe that can be easily adapted to suit the BSL kits, even part built ones. It took only 10 minutes of minor cutting to remove the buffer beams from the BSL ends so the Hornby underframe would fit

 

 

In addition, it is not that big a job to reside the Hornby Brake with D94 3 compartment brake sides, which I will attempt next.

 

So do not throw those old kits away just yet, as it is not clear how many different 1925 diagrams Hornby will eventually produce.

 

Mike Wiltshire

[rovex]

Still waiting for mine 

 

Unfortunately the shop I've pre-ordered through still hasn't had they delivery from Hornby

[57xx]

 

 

 

 

 

Buffers looking a bit better for a lick of matt black and blob of "grease".

[Torn-on-the-platform]

I don't know too much about GW coaching formations further than B-sets and autocoaches!

 

I'm only really in the market for 3 of these in GWR livery as a branch set. I'm guessing that the most appropriate formation would therefore be 2 brakes and a composite in the middle (as the brakes offer no first class accommodation)? Would they even have been used in branch formations in pre-nationalisation days?

 

Many thanks in advance.

[chrisf]

 Would they even have been used in branch formations in pre-nationalisation days?

 

It depends on the branch!  A simple explanation of GWR operating policy as far as coaches are concerned is probably beyond most of us mere mortals but, as I understand it [term used loosely] some coaches were built to run in sets and others were for "general service".  The most prestigious trains, eg the Cornish Riviera, had new sets every few years and were cascaded to lesser duties once replaced.  Example: the Centenary stock of 1935, built for the Riviera, reappeared after the war in a semi-fast from Paddington to Weston-super-Mare.  later still the coaches were dispersed and could be found in many unlikely places.  The Centenary coaches were tubby and therefore prohibited from many routes not originally built to broad gauge but the principle holds good.  B sets were used on some branches and other secondary stopping services but not all.  Other branches were served by elderly coaches which had once enjoyed more glamorous lives, such as decommissioned slip coaches which were too good to scrap just yet.

 

The important aspect of providing a train was that the number and proportion of first and third class seats should match demand as closely as possible.  The four 1st class compartments in a corridor composite might have been far too many for one branch and not quite enough for another.  The typical corridor brake composite had two or three first class compartments and this might have been more suitable depending on the branch and its traffic.  Most trains on the Princetown branch in its later days comprised just one of these.  In those happy days, too, there were spare coaches at strategic places to augment formations if necessary - an unfamiliar concept to the unit-led railway of today.  Some lines would only need one brake, often in the middle of the formation, so if you must have matching vehicles you might go for third, brake third and composite.

 

Best advice  - look at photographs!

 

Chris

[HowardGWR]

@

Torn-on-the-platform

As ChrisF said look at the photos, there are thousands for just about every branch (or so it seems!) but also take note of when the photo was taken.  I am assuming you have a date or era in mind. 

 

If you are modelling a typical branch line, you really have to be looking at B sets (already available RTR) unless you are modelling a line that took portions off trains that continued westward, such as Kingswear or Kingsbridge.  Of course, in the case of Kingswear, you can have the whole works with a 60xx on the front!  I just looked on the net, and there are loads of sites that give useful info.

 

Here's one.

http://www.cornwallrailwaysociety.org.uk/newton-abbot-to-kingswear-also-brixham-branch.html 

 

Thanks to ChrisF for reminding us about oblong buffers. 

[PMP99]

Buffers looking a bit better for a lick of matt black and blob of "grease".

RIMG0144.JPG

 

Can I ask how you did the grease mark. Looks very effective

[Torn-on-the-platform]

Thanks chaps.

 

My plan is to model locations on the Moretonhampstead branch as if preserved. I didn't want to say initially as the mention of preservation often leads to claims that you can do as you please etc. The intention is to be operationally similar, but by no means identical to, the South Devon Railway. It seems to be a little less clear cut at the moment, but about 5 years ago, the SDR had 2 Mk1-based 'mainline' sets, supplemented by the odd GWR prototype. At galas, a branch line train would run as well, usually an auto-train but occasionally a couple of colletts in BR livery. The auto train would also run alongside one of the main sets on quieter days. Whilst I am quite happy in the SDR's BR(W) haven, I do think that it is missing a vintage GWR set, especially considering the pride associated with the GWR.

 

I already have my Mk1 sets, with some supplementary Hawksworths. I have no GWR liveried coaching stock and feel that a very smart 3 coach Collett set would fill the gap perfectly, and it is a realistic proposition that a railway of this size could have a set like this running in the present day. Of course a preserved railway would take whatever it could get its hands on and a neat book-ended set wouldn't necessarily be possible - take the Bluebell's Maunsells for example. Lovely to have a train of Maunsells but even the two SOs have significant detail differences.

 

Another consideration is that having 2 brakes in a 3 coach train means a significant reduction in capacity. It seems to me that the WR were less religious about having a brake at each end than their SR rivals, so perhaps a 3rd, comp, 3rd brake would be a better set.

 

I realise that the the modeller's licence associated with preservation makes my question a little moot, but I would like to seek RMWeb's opinion as to what they would consider to be the most realistic combination in this scenario.

Edited February 20, 2016 by Torn-on-the-platform

[57xx]

Can I ask how you did the grease mark. Looks very effective

 

Sure, it's Humbrol metal cote (27003 Polished Steel) applied with a small brush to get the initial blob. This paint gives quite a shiny finish, so the trick then is to apply a dark wash over the top to darken it up.

[Budgie]

Here's one.

http://www.cornwallrailwaysociety.org.uk/newton-abbot-to-kingswear-also-brixham-branch.html 

I got 404 not found when following that link.

[melmerby]

I got 404 not found when following that link.

No problem here.

 

Keith

[HowardGWR]

Thanks chaps.

 

My plan is to model locations on the Moretonhampstead branch as if preserved. I didn't want to say initially as the mention of preservation often leads to claims that you can do as you please etc. 

 

I realise that the the modeller's licence associated with preservation makes my question a little moot, but I would like to seek RMWeb's opinion as to what they would consider to be the most realistic combination in this scenario.

 

 

 

Well, your modelling licence is huge, since what you will be modelling doesn't exist and never existed anyway, 

 

I looked up what Hornby call a B set, and they call it a 'GWR Suburban B' if that helps you to look up on eBay, etc, for examples.  However, now I know that you are to model a preserved example line, the non-corridors are not usually brought out (if the line has any, that is) because the guard cannot get through to clip tickets, etc.  Also, I was at Didcot last Wednesday and rode in a Collett gangwayed sunshine compo, but the toilets were locked out for sanitary reasons, of course.  Didcot can run non-corridors very happily, as the rides are free, once you are in the centre, so no need for ticket clipping.

 

One final point on the Hornby gangwayed bow enders in a preservation setting.  Sadly, the C54s, D95s and E127s are not noted by their presence, as most of them are hulks, dreaming of their eventual restoration, in the sidings.  They were mundane when they were created and clearly are thought so now, the effort going into exotic super saloons and the like.  In fairmess, for  lines like the SDR, WSR and Didcot, they will want to run dining specials, so I think that is the reason for the B-E standard coaches' place in the restoration queue.  

Edited February 21, 2016 by HowardGWR