reevesthecat Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 According to the Bachmann site, collectors club mags (and I assume catalogues) will be sent out march 12th. mark Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium spamcan61 Posted March 10, 2010 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 10, 2010 Sort of on topic, I noticed this comment from Pat over on http://www.mremag.com this morning, talking about the NRM/Bachmann City of Truro:- "Moreover, the tooling, after an agreed period, comes into general use. As a result of the City of Truro initiative by the NRM, by 2011 the tooling will be available to Bachmann to produce other members of the class and, with minor alterations, other similar early GWR classes. Now, to me, that's very exciting - Ed." Sounds like good news for the GWR fans. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Mikkel Posted March 10, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 10, 2010 Sounds like good news for the GWR fans. Indeed it is. Some of us are already saving up for it . We'll all celebrate GWR 176! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
pinza Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 An excellent range (again) from Bachmann, I would estimate my spending well be 80:20 in favour of Bachmann to Hornby for the next 18 months, there appears to be a much more balanced approach to their range, and a factor I that I dont think should be overlooked is cost wise Bachmann are consistently cheaper when it comes to high quality rolling stock. I must admit for me its the scenecraft range which is the most exciting, who would have thought five years ago so much interest would come from buildings not just the rolling stock? A layout idea is definitely forming with the old steam MPD at one end and the new fangled diesel depot all shiny and new at the other. With tongue very slightly in cheek can I start the 2011 wishlist and ask Bachmann to produce the 70ft turntable from Carnforth to complete the full set of steam MPD equipment? On a serious note I do hope they stagger the release of the loco shed/ash plant/coal tower, thats a lot of money to spend on something that doesn't move Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Barry Rhys Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Can anyone say approximately how far back in time it would be possible to run the planned 3F given the boiler, firebox etc? Or do we need more details about the specs of the model before this can be established? (Sadly I know next to nothing about Midland locos. I checked the web for info but it's still not quite clear to me.) Hi Mikkel, 2 nights ago I got home and somewhat unwisely decided to check up a few details about the 3F's while consuming a mug of coffee, prior to some enjoyable modelling. 3 hours later I finally put down my copy of Essery and Jenkinson's Midland Locomotives Vol.4 Goods Tender Classes, washed my mug, took 2 aspirin and went to bed - Unwashed and Somewhat Slightly Dazed. But to save you reading further, assuming that the planned 3F is indeed the one(s) described and shown in Andy's OP, the answer is... 1916 (notwithstanding minor variations such as Stanier chimney replacement in LMS days). However, to paraphrase Essery and Jenkinson, the story of the goods tender classes is "the most complex part of the MR locos story", and the 'Midland 3F' tag can be misleading. I'm not sure if the info and photo in Andy's OP were supplied by Bachmann or obtained from another source (yeh, I know, why don't I ask him?), but it's a bit misleading and some of it is wrong. First of all, very few 3F's were ever built as 3F's, and those that were built as 3F (namely, only 70 locos) had a roundtopped firebox and a cab very unlike that shown in the photo. What later became the classic Belpaire-boilered 'Midland 3F' were some of an immense quantity (865) of various Johnson 2F locos and some of the aforementioned 70 roundtopped firebox 3F locos. So the "935 locomotives in existence at one time" refers only to the total number of locos available for rebuilding as Belpaire 3F's - there were never 935 3F's! Indeed, of the 935 locos, only 362 (only 362 - am I allowed to say that?) ever became Belpaire-boilered 3F's, the first of which was outshopped in 1916. (Hope nobody objects to me saying "Belpaire-boilered" - I know it's the firebox that's a Belpaire, not the boiler). Luckily, nearly all of these 362 Belpaire 3F's were almost identical, hence Bachmann have got a hell of a lot of numbers to choose from! At this point I should say that there appears very little rationale to which of the 935 became Belpaire 3F's. Very many of the 935 were rebuilt with other boilers, some becoming Belpaire 2F's, others roundtopped 3F's - some of which were then rebuilt to Belpaire 2F's!! - and some were never rebuilt, and retained their gorgeous Johnson 2F curves with roundtopped fireboxes all through their LMS days, and some even into British Railways days. In particular, the statement "the subject of the Bachmann model is the Midland Railway Class M" is misleading because the M class of 345 (not 335) Johnson 2F's were also rebuilt apparently without rationale (to a 21st Century observer!) in all of the different variants, so that actually 200 of this class became Belpaire 3F's. Of the Bachmann models listed, LMS No.3502 and BR late-crest No.43586 are both Class M's that became Belpaire 3F's (incidentally, the final Belpaire 3F from Class M was withdrawn in 1964 - though I don't know if it was 43586). Unfortunately there is a slight problem with the listed BR early-crest No.43186. This is not from Class M at all, but from an earlier class (Class 1698), but was nevertheless rebuilt as a Belpaire 3F. However, this earlier class had a notable difference to the later classes - it had 4'11" dia. wheels instead of the later 5'3" wheels (OK, that's only 1mm in 4mm scale) but also all the brake rods ran outside the wheels - which is quite noticeable (in fact there is a photo of this very loco in BR early-crest livery on p.150 of said book, on which the difference is very visible). Of the 362 Belpaire 3F's, only 11 had this feature, so unless Bachmann are actually intending to model this (admittedly interesting) variant, they may prefer to choose another of the 351 more common style for their BR early-crest model. I'm certain Bachmann would anyway have found this out themselves, but I think maybe I should write to them anyway, just in case they want to change their press data or anything. I hope all that are totally disinterested in these details about the 3F's (and I realise it's pretty superfluous to most) stopped reading after the first couple of sentences, all the info is straight out of the aforementioned book anyway, but it may help a few people (yes Mikkel, if you're still here, that means you too!!) decide that they need one of these lovely locos. Or two. Or three... All credit to Bachmann for deciding to produce this model. Neil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ron Ron Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 According to the Bachmann site, collectors club mags (and I assume catalogues) will be sent out march 12th. mark Yes I saw that too, however my "free" Branchline 2010 catalogue fell through my letterbox not 30 minutes ago. Unusually, the magazine must be coming separately. Lots of re-issued wagons with new running numbers and some very interesting new Scenecraft models, including more low relief buildings, the bus depot and a wagon loading tower. As mentioned earlier, very few D&E locos with "DCC On-Board" this year. Most of those are from last year if I'm not mistaken, suggesting that Bachmann recognise that there's a larger demand for better quality fitted decoders or a preference for self-fitting instead. What's the chances of them bringing out their own equivalent to the Hornby Sapphire in the near future? Having done a quick count, I think there are 10 DCC Sound fitted locos, but only 5 non-sound "DCC On-Board" in the D&E section (not counting train-sets). It's a reverse situation in the Steam loco section where there are 7 locos with "DCC On-Board" and only 2 sound-fitted examples. At a guess, this probably reflects the current state of play with steam sounds and relative difficulty in fitting decoders into some steam models. Another expensive year...again ! . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
bmg Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Yes I saw that too, however my "free" Branchline 2010 catalogue fell through my letterbox not 30 minutes ago. Unusually, the magazine must be coming separately. Mine landed with a thump a few moments ago. Congratulations Bachmann. You have a great range with lots to tempt me. I have warned the moths in my wallet to beware. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Ron Ron Ron Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 .... I have warned the moths in my wallet to beware. I think the ones in my wallet are packing their bags as we speak. . Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium brushman47544 Posted March 10, 2010 RMweb Premium Share Posted March 10, 2010 The opportunity to purchase club members only models - locos and wagons - although I'm not sure this is a perk or advantage, or just an excuse to talk oneself into spending even more money on toy trains ! As someone else has already mentioned, if Bachmann produces a S&DJR 7F in prussian blue as a club members LE I'll be happy. Sort of on topic, I noticed this comment from Pat over on http://www.mremag.com this morning, talking about the NRM/Bachmann City of Truro:- "Moreover, the tooling, after an agreed period, comes into general use. As a result of the City of Truro initiative by the NRM, by 2011 the tooling will be available to Bachmann to produce other members of the class and, with minor alterations, other similar early GWR classes. Now, to me, that's very exciting - Ed." Sounds like good news for the GWR fans. What intrigues me is Pat's earlier comment that the NRM is already working on the next model. Now what could that be...??? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Unknown Warrior Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Sort of on topic, I noticed this comment from Pat over on http://www.mremag.com this morning, talking about the NRM/Bachmann City of Truro:- "Moreover, the tooling, after an agreed period, comes into general use. As a result of the City of Truro initiative by the NRM, by 2011 the tooling will be available to Bachmann to produce other members of the class and, with minor alterations, other similar early GWR classes. Now, to me, that's very exciting - Ed." Sounds like good news for the GWR fans. So we might see a Dukedog in 2011 or 2012?! At least it will give my wallet a breathing space after the 7F, the 3F and the Derby Lightwieght, not to mention Blue Peter and the Robinson O4 plus one or two items from Hornby's 2009 programme which have not yet arrived! Hopefull Bachmann have a copy of Bob Essery and David Jenkinson's book. There do happen to be photos of at least two of Bachmann's proposed locos in it, so perhaps they have! To say that the Midland 3F's are a minefield for modellers is a glorious understatement! As I live out "in the sticks" I am still waiting for the post to arrive and the big thump on the mat as the catalogue arrives! I understand that the magazine will be dispatched on Friday. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Black Hat Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 One thing that has me surprised is the absence of more class 47s. I know theres a group of them being released at the moment, but I would have thought more would be around later in the year, or early next year. The news that there are no modern liveried class 47s being announced was a bit surprising. I think that Bachmann certainly have the better machine and livery application, so would have thought they would have pressed ahead with locomotives in Intericty Swallow, Res, Virgin, Freightliner or EWS. A shame really.... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
The Black Hat Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 As someone else has already mentioned, if Bachmann produces a S&DJR 7F in prussian blue as a club members LE I'll be happy. What intrigues me is Pat's earlier comment that the NRM is already working on the next model. Now what could that be...??? Yes they are... and I think have been for some time. I know the NRM person who knows... but he isnt telling me! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Mikkel Posted March 10, 2010 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 10, 2010 Hi Mikkel, 2 nights ago I got home and somewhat unwisely decided to check up a few details about the 3F's while consuming a mug of coffee, prior to some enjoyable modelling. 3 hours later I finally put down my copy of Essery and Jenkinson's Midland Locomotives Vol.4 Goods Tender Classes, washed my mug, took 2 aspirin and went to bed - Unwashed and Somewhat Slightly Dazed. But to save you reading further, assuming that the planned 3F is indeed the one(s) described and shown in Andy's OP, the answer is... 1916 (notwithstanding minor variations such as Stanier chimney replacement in LMS days) [.....] Neil, a huge word of thanks for taking the time (and the aspirins!) to delve into this. Sorry to have put you through that! Fortunately I see that a number of other RMwebbers have already thanked you via the +1 button, so your effort has benefitted a number of us. (1916 is a little late for my period, but not that much, and I've always fancied a GWR/MR joint layout. Of course, there may also be an option of replacing the Belpaire firebox with some Plastikard bent to shape in boiling water, giving us a round-topped version. Hmmm....) Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest jim s-w Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 Yes they are... and I think have been for some time. I know the NRM person who knows... but he isnt telling me! Well the NRM is about balance isnt it? They have done steam and Deisel and 87001 is in the collection... (Although read on and you will see why I am praying that's not the case!) Normally what Pat says is true but it all depends on who actually owns the tools. I wouldn't expect the NRM limited editions tools to belong to Bachmann if I am honest. Does Pat have any proof of what he says or is he just basing his opinion on the normal practice. Cheers Jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sc59401 Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 An excellent list of new items. The "cathedral front" Derby Lightweight is a highlight for me and I also hope to capture one of these elusive but essential blue/grey Mark I BGs. Another penny has dropped for me, presumably with the motor chassis, and a clever body tooling mix, Bachmann may be able to do the single car Derby lightweight unit too. Now I'm just wondering if the seeds of this idea (and the battery electric unit mentioned earlier by Hammer) have already been sown. Far be it from me to claim credit but here's an extract from a note I sent to Bachmann's suggestions page in July 2001, suggesting that the company should consider producing a First Generation DMU: "For a type with wide appeal, may I suggest the Derby Lightweight design, later examples of which became Class 108? The same basic body style was built for many years (with two distinct cab and inner end designs - perhaps model tooling could be adapted to produce both types) and these units saw service in most parts of the country. Many Class 108 vehicles are preserved, in addition to a single car and two-car unit of the earlier type. The unique BR battery electric unit (now preserved) used the same body style as the early Derby Lightweight DMU. I believe that this DMU would be a very popular model, not least because it has never been offered by any of the other major ready-to-run manufacturers." Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
298 Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 What intrigues me is Pat's earlier comment that the NRM is already working on the next model. Now what could that be...??? An 87 in Electric blue, with white cab roofs...... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 What intrigues me is Pat's earlier comment that the NRM is already working on the next model. Now what could that be...??? If I were feeling cynical I would say a class 84. On a serious note, what other locos are displayed at the NRM? I have lost track. Perhaps a class 76 given that Bachmann seem to have got over their allergy to anything that runs on electricity. The perennial popularity of Wodhead layouts suggests it could be a good seller. "Moreover, the tooling, after an agreed period, comes into general use. As a result of the City of Truro initiative by the NRM, by 2011 the tooling will be available to Bachmann to produce other members of the class and, with minor alterations, other similar early GWR classes. Now, to me, that's very exciting - Ed." Sounds like good news for the GWR fans. It will be very good news if CoT goes through the N gauge shrinking machine. So far N gauge modellers do not seem to have much to celebrate the GWR 175 with. Still I live in hope. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Trains4U Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 ...and I also hope to capture one of these elusive but essential blue/grey Mark I BGs. they aren't that elusive, we still have several of the last variant in stock. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
edward66 Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 The Midland compound's at the NRM, now wouldn't that be nice! Edward Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixoh8sixoh Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 If I were feeling cynical I would say a class 84. On a serious note, what other locos are displayed at the NRM? I have lost track. APT-P? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Karhedron Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 APT-P? APT-E I think you will find. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
298 Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 APT-E I think you will find. There is an APT-P power car at Shildon, but I think the OP meant the Gas Turbine. Anyway, they've done Steam & Diesel loco's, so the natural progression would be..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sweeps Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 With tongue very slightly in cheek can I start the 2011 wishlist and ask Bachmann to produce the 70ft turntable from Carnforth to complete the full set of steam MPD equipment? On a serious note I do hope they stagger the release of the loco shed/ash plant/coal tower, thats a lot of money to spend on something that doesn't move I find it hard to see how the shed would justify such a price tag, it's very nice but is only a plastic box with a roof, it's not got any working parts - or is it complete with 4 locos? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
sixoh8sixoh Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 There is an APT-P power car at Shildon, but I think the OP meant the Gas Turbine. Anyway, they've done Steam & Diesel loco's, so the natural progression would be..... No, definitely thinking of the APT-P. Much prettier! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Kempenfelt Posted March 10, 2010 Share Posted March 10, 2010 The Midland compound's at the NRM, now wouldn't that be nice! Edward Now that's not a bad shout! There are several similarities between the 7f and the compound as I believe it, especially the batch that Bachmann are modelling. As I understand it, when the latter batch of 7f's were re-boilered, the boiler's were actually refurbished boilers from compounds. Also Bachmann could make use of sharinging the same tender, asuming the one from the crab isn't suitable/up to standard, there's bound to be other similarities too! Unfortunately if the next NRM model is the compound I won't be interested, however I will take a handfull of 7f's!!! I must take this chance to say that i'm eternally grateful to Bachmann for announcing the 7F! Throwing a 3f in for good measure is beeing just too kind! This is the best new model anouncement of my lifetime! Now Hornby, you're unlikely to be seeing very muh of my money this year unless you get round to finally producing the correct Maunsell's for the S&D sets 390-399. However the much anticipated and awaited announcement of Crimson and Cream Stanier's is much appreciated! Paul Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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