Class 37, by Accurascale

[AY Mod]

31 minutes ago, Bloodnok said:

Sadly, it's a fact of the modern world, that if you want a problem fixed, you have to air it somewhere it can impact future sales.

 

That is a stance which really, really, really irritates. Using the site for personal leverage/attention, especially when you don't value the site enough to be a paying member, is a no-no and then to go and crow about it is just crass.

 

RMweb is not TripAdvisor.

[Bryn_Bach_Railway]

5 minutes ago, Bloodnok said:

 

That's why I'd prefer to refer to the actual socket pin, not the AUX function number -- a number of manufacturers use different assignments of number to pin.

But if Accurascale want to use the ESU naming, that's fine too. I can go get ESU's documentation (which I did), so I can find out that their AUX11 is on pin 6, which is my decoder's FO8, and I can adapt my setup accordingly. That's all fine.

I understand what you’re saying, in effect esu have re-labeled aux 8 to be aux 11 on their chips then. But the point still stands that all head/tail light functionality should be on the 10 (12 including directional lighting) functions accessible from the 21 pin interface.

 

8 minutes ago, Bloodnok said:

won't work if you don't buy their pre-configured decoder. Sorry, that's not acceptable.

And that’s completely agreeable, there’s a standard for a reason

[adb968008]

I knew there was a reason I stick with DC.

 

🤩

[Francis deWeck]

15 minutes ago, adb968008 said:

I knew there was a reason I stick with DC.

 

🤩

Nope, can't agree. But, each to his own. I have three areas which have polarity changes, handled beautifully by dcc. It depends just where and how you want to get there.

[Kaput]

In short: The PCB has circuits on it that can somehow combine multiple functions into one Aux output on the 21pin socket. This combination is seemingly understood only by ESU decoders (bets on it only being understood on V5's as well).

Probably should be listed for future models in the specification that some functions flat out won't work on DCC with non ESU decoders if this is the desired path.

 

Fully agree that all headlights/tail lights should be on normal functions and the fancy stuff like desk lights and engine room should be on the ESU only functions, would make so much more sense.

If I'm reading the Lokprogrammer correctly the top lights are on Aux11 and 12 while the desk lights are on 3 and 4, they really should be reversed since I imagine more people will care about the top lights than the desk lights.

 

 

Good thing DCC has all these NMRA and NEM standards to standardise everything....oh wait.

Edited February 1 by Kaput

[rob D2]

Yes. This is getting tiresome .

You have some DCC issues - start a new thread or private message them .

 

It won’t stop my getting one . I’m a train fan not Elon musk designing a CB for space X 

[adb968008]

9 minutes ago, rob D2 said:

Yes. This is getting tiresome .

You have some DCC issues - start a new thread or private message them .

 

It won’t stop my getting one . I’m a train fan not Elon musk designing a CB for space X 

its a matter of time before TV remote control tech that is DCC is replaced by a more friendly 802.11 based solution.

i’m happy to wait it out, Might even design it myself at this rate.

[Bryn_Bach_Railway]

16 minutes ago, rob D2 said:

Yes. This is getting tiresome .

You have some DCC issues - start a new thread or private message them .

This I don’t agree with. If a new thread is started, then there’s no garentee that the accurascale guys will see it, or if they do, there’s no garentee it will be remembered if they decide to reference it for future update etc. (not that this thread garentee’s that either, but it increases the odds by a fair bit)

 

private messaging means all the information is not easily available for others who might have the same issue. 
 

bloodnok has already stated that they have not had much luck with the support services, and so this thread is the next port of call. After all this is a general thread for all comments and queries about the model, if there’s some comments that don’t interest you then just skip over them. But having the discussion here keeps everything to do with the model in one place, and provides the most support from the manufacturers active members. 

Edited February 1 by Bryn_Bach_Railway

[SulzerPeak]

To think having working marker lights made us smile a few years ago! I for one am a massive fan of esu chips, also like zimo, thats just preference. Im going to just enjoy the golden age of model trains we are enjoying without picking the bones out of it and becoming a coding type geek!

[Krieghoff]

Anyways

 

back on to topic of our fantastic 37's. Can i make a few observations and another 'wish list' locomotive. Ive just come across this lovely beastie which i MAY 🤣🤣🤣 have mentioned before and had lots of support i might add 👍👍😉😉. One of these would look lovely as an Accurascale exclusive 👍😉😉.  Also a few other observations. 1. Current AC packaging is superb -dont change it. 2. The chip and sound files are spot on -dont change those either........in fact, dont change ANYTHING at all Patrick, Fran et all. You lads are doing alright. Everything is fine in the AS world and long may it be so.  That 37 below does look the dogs gonads though😍😍😜😜. Just saying 🙏👍👍 

[Bucoops]

1 minute ago, Krieghoff said:

Anyways

 

back on to topic of our fantastic 37's. Can i make a few observations and another 'wish list' locomotive. Ive just come across this lovely beastie which i MAY 🤣🤣🤣 have mentioned before and had lots of support i might add 👍👍😉😉. One of these would look lovely as an Accurascale exclusive 👍😉😉.  Also a few other observations. 1. Current AC packaging is superb -dont change it. 2. The chip and sound files are spot on -dont change those either........in fact, dont change ANYTHING at all Patrick, Fran et all. You lads are doing alright. Everything is fine in the AS world and long may it be so.  That 37 below does look the dogs gonads though😍😍😜😜. Just saying 🙏👍👍 

 

 

Wot 'e said.

 

Although those lamps are minging! Fortunately the livery distracts.

[55020]

2 hours ago, Bryn_Bach_Railway said:

bloodnok has already stated that they have not had much luck with the support services, and so this thread is the next port of call.

 

Did he actually say this, as that wasn't my impression?  Please feel free to quote from Bloodnok's post to support your statement!

Edited February 1 by 55020

[ruggedpeak]

 

2 hours ago, Bryn_Bach_Railway said:

This I don’t agree with. If a new thread is started, then there’s no garentee that the accurascale guys will see it, or if they do, there’s no garentee it will be remembered if they decide to reference it for future update etc. (not that this thread garentee’s that either, but it increases the odds by a fair bit)

 

private messaging means all the information is not easily available for others who might have the same issue. 
 

bloodnok has already stated that they have not had much luck with the support services, and so this thread is the next port of call. After all this is a general thread for all comments and queries about the model, if there’s some comments that don’t interest you then just skip over them. But having the discussion here keeps everything to do with the model in one place, and provides the most support from the manufacturers active members. 

This thread is already 328 pages long, and no one in a few weeks, let alone a few months or years, is going to trawl through hundreds more pages of stuff about CV's, paint colours, warranties, deliveries, liveries, the position of an ETH cable, and all the other stuff to try and locate the answer.

 

And there are DCC experts over there who haven't bought an AS 37 so won't be on this thread but may be able to assist. You can then just link the DCC thread in here so the AS team can see it.

 

12 minutes ago, 55020 said:

 

Did he actually say this, as that wasn't my impression?  Please feel free to quote from Bloodnok's post to support your statement!

"I'm getting concerned with the lack of information on this loco. I really don't want to have to take the loco apart, pull the PCB out and reverse engineer it ... purely to find out how to actually make it work properly."

 

"our decoders. Two months with open support tickets."

 

"The people manning the support email know less about the loco than the Accurascale representatives in this thread, and are a lot less active than the Accurascale representatives in this thread, too."

 

"Sadly, it's an unfortunate fact (that I wish were not true) of the modern world, that if you want a problem fixed, you have to air it somewhere it can impact future sales."

Edited February 1 by ruggedpeak
delete spaces

[Bloodnok]

18 minutes ago, 55020 said:

Did he actually say this, as that wasn't my impression?  Please feel free to quote from Bloodnok's post to support your statement!

I did say that.

It was gone a while, but is now back (check the previous page).

For the record, I have been contacting support regarding both a class 37 and a class 92 on and off since November. Many functions on both do not work on either loco. I've tried multiple Zimo chips -- both MX634s and MN340s.

Support are asking the correct questions for basic troubleshooting ("can you try it on DC please with the DC plug in", "Can you send me a photo of the switches", "can you try your decoder in another model" and so on). They have come to the conclusion that the locos I have are not faulty, and are working as intended. I agree with them in that based on what they say, I don't think swapping the loco with a different one would improve matters.

The decoders are also working properly and have been tested in other models.

Support have not been able to offer any suggestions to make more things work than currently do, nor any explanation as to why some features don't work.

Edited February 1 by Bloodnok
Apparently (most of) my posts are now restored?

[55020]

8 minutes ago, Bloodnok said:

I did say that.

 

Fantastic, this isn't a support thread.

 

9 minutes ago, Bloodnok said:

It was gone a while, but is now back (check the previous page).

 

Sorry, I've no idea what that means.  Perhaps it doesn't matter.

 

9 minutes ago, Bloodnok said:

Many functions on both do not work on either loco.

 

10 minutes ago, Bloodnok said:

more things work than currently do, nor any explanation as to why some features don't work.

 

Go on, give us more to work with.  What specifically doesn't work with the Zimo decoders?

 

 

Steve

 

[Bloodnok]

Just now, 55020 said:

Sorry, I've no idea what that means.  Perhaps it doesn't matter.

 

A lot of my posts were deleted. I originally wrote that message believing them to be still gone. Most of them have since been ... undeleted, so what I wrote was not correct. Upon noticing the error, I edited it to reflect the current state.

 

Just now, 55020 said:

Go on, give us more to work with.  What specifically doesn't work with the Zimo decoders?

 

Class 37:
Works:

White marker lights on F0f and F0r
Red tail lights on AUX1/FO1 and AUX2/FO2 (full power)
Dashboard lights on AUX3/FO3 and AUX4/FO4 (logic level)

No function higher than that works.
For the avoidance of doubt, I am aware not all functions are present on every model -- a lot of the listed functions in the next batch are only relevant to those with later modified 'group standard' lighting. But AFAIK the AUX numbering is universal.

Class 92:

Works:
Day headlights (Lower two lights only) on F0f and F0r
Night headlights (Lower two lights only) on AUX1/FO1 and AUX1/FO1+AUX6/FO6
Tail lights on AUX2/FO2 and AUX2/FO2+AUX6/FO6
Front Pantograph servo on AUX11/FO8
Rear Pantograph servo on AUX12/FO7

Does not work:
Top headlight (AUX3/FO3)
Depot Lights (AUX4/FO4)
Cab interior lights (AUX5/FO5)
I see no obvious change from AUX7(FO9) or AUX10(FO10) either.

The one that bugs me the most is "Top Headlight" on the Class 92, as I can see that LED working when the DC blanking plug is installed.

[AY Mod]

3 minutes ago, Bloodnok said:

A lot of my posts were deleted. I originally wrote that message believing them to be still gone. Most of them have since been ... undeleted

 

 No-one has touched any of your posts.

[Bloodnok]

13 minutes ago, AY Mod said:

No-one has touched any of your posts.

Your previous post initially appeared high up on Page 328 when I first saw it. Next time I got a notification for this thread and looked at it, the latest page was not 328, but 327. For some time this afternoon, page 327 appeared as the latest, featuring all the people I remember replying to, and the people quoting me. But ... only the first two of my posts today, none after that.

Given it was only my posts that were gone, and I had just attracted mod attention, I think my interpretation that I'd been moderated was a reasonable one?
If you are telling me that's not the case, then ... perhaps instead it was a software bug in the forum which caused only my posts to not appear when I was looking at this thread?

[Pmorgancym]

On this being a monster thread, I still think there should be a 'pre release froth thread' which generates significant traffic pouring over cads engineering samples etc., which pretty much becomes irrelevant and a 'post release' thread, for when the locos are actually in everyone's sweaty paws and the merits/demerits/issues can be discussed.

[spamcan61]

7 minutes ago, Pmorgancym said:

On this being a monster thread, I still think there should be a 'pre release froth thread' which generates significant traffic pouring over cads engineering samples etc., which pretty much becomes irrelevant and a 'post release' thread, for when the locos are actually in everyone's sweaty paws and the merits/demerits/issues can be discussed.

100% agree, but can't see it happening as some poor sod would have to curate them and keep the delivery reports out.

 

Edited February 2 by spamcan61

[Pmorgancym]

4 minutes ago, spamcan61 said:

100% agree, but can't see it happening as some poor sod would have to curate them and keep the delivery reports out.

 

On the simplest level lock the pre release thread on release day, maybe a day or twos grace to let people finish discussions?  It might naturally conclude once the 'ownership' thread starts, at the very least you woukdn't have to take a guess at what page to start at if you wanted to read what the loco was actually like..

[Ajax50046]

9 hours ago, AY Mod said:

 

You jumped straight to a conclusion and inferred your content had been removed. It had not at any stage.

 

 

The logs do not indicate any problems. Maybe there was a browser caching issue on your system.

 

My points still stand that I feel you tried to inappropriately use the site to leverage an issue. An understanding of that with an apology would be more appropriate than deflecting tactics.

 

[E100]

I think it's quite understandable that as a new manufacturer they would outsource the electronics to ESU as this removes so much hard work and I don't think anyone would deny they along with Zimo are the two major players nowadays. It's also a dammed if they do dammed if they don't situation as the number of lighting combinations and other features is rapidly exceeding what most medium to high end decoders can handle i.e. more than 6 functions but they still want to push the boundaries of what's possible. I don't think they should be shot down for that.

 

However, I do wonder aloud if a bit more oversight of future projects for which features go on which functions by Accurascale (and indeed other manufacturers in a similar position) to enable the best compatibility for the expected core features on future projects would be a prudent step. This is especially in light of some more advanced features being exclusive to a certain brand or for example ABC performance. This also does help to better future proof the model against one manufacturer going under and taking their IP with them since with the lifetime warranty extension I hope to be running my stock well beyond the 2050's!

[55020]

@Bloodnok  As you have some lighting functions that are working, my guess is that your issue is nothing to do with AUX13 (which is what seems to have triggered you to post) as SRman stated that by removing AUX13 from the function mapping it stopped all lights from working.

I have no detailed knowledge of Zimo decoders and how their mapping works, so perhaps a post in the DCC section might bring you into contact with someone that has successfully fitted a Zimo decoder to the AS 37 and/or 92?

 

I also suggest keeping the correspondence going with AS support, as has been mentioned many times before on this thread to other users having issues with a model.

As E100 states above, new models are stretching the capability of decoders to the limit.  I have an SLW "Scottish" 24 on pre-order and I would be pleasently surprised if I could take out the OEM supplied Zimo decoder, throw in an ESU one and have everything work the same!  Accurascale have even gone the extra mile and provide a very cost effective "plug n' play" solution by offering both LokPilot and LokSound pre-configured decoders for sale on their website.

 

Good luck!

 

 

Steve

Edited February 2 by 55020

[ruggedpeak]

1 hour ago, Pmorgancym said:

On the simplest level lock the pre release thread on release day, maybe a day or twos grace to let people finish discussions?  It might naturally conclude once the 'ownership' thread starts, at the very least you woukdn't have to take a guess at what page to start at if you wanted to read what the loco was actually like..

So the Mods have to do extra work to compensate for those who can't be bothered to start a new thread in a more suitable place on the forum, who feel their personal wants and lack of understanding and/or competence needs one to one attention, and who won't contribute towards the costs of the forum?