Hornby 2021 - 9F new tooling

[MikeParkin65]

The Bachmann 9f remains a fine model. The significant advances of the Hornby model over the Bachmann from my perspective are the easier provision for DCC including sound, all wheel pick up and (I presume) bearings in the chassis. Bachmann scores on the etched smoke deflectors, better finish and for me the more substantial and convincing valve gear and coupling rods. Bachmann has also done some cracking weathered editions. 

[RedgateModels]

2 minutes ago, MikeParkin65 said:

The Bachmann 9f remains a fine model. The significant advances of the Hornby model over the Bachmann from my perspective are the easier provision for DCC including sound, all wheel pick up and (I presume) bearings in the chassis. 

 

Don't forget the lack of visible gear tower down through the weighshaft

[MikeParkin65]

2 minutes ago, RedgateModels said:

 

Don't forget the lack of visible gear tower down through the weighshaft

Ive honestly never noticed any visible mechanism 

[Ian Hargrave]

11 minutes ago, MikeParkin65 said:

The Bachmann 9f remains a fine model. The significant advances of the Hornby model over the Bachmann from my perspective are the easier provision for DCC including sound, all wheel pick up and (I presume) bearings in the chassis. Bachmann scores on the etched smoke deflectors, better finish and for me the more substantial and convincing valve gear and coupling rods. Bachmann has also done some cracking weathered editions. 

Absolutely agree. In fact the Bachmann referred to in my earlier post is a weathered 92189. 

[Ian Hargrave]

37 minutes ago, MikeParkin65 said:

Ive honestly never noticed any visible mechanism 

Just looked at both versions to confirm.In. In neither is it visible.

[RedgateModels]

1 minute ago, Ian Hargrave said:

Just looked at both versions to confirm.In. In neither is it visible.

 

hmm, certainly was there on the chassis I used to build a rebuilt Crosti back in 2014

 

 

 

[Ian Hargrave]

55 minutes ago, RedgateModels said:

 

hmm, certainly was there on the chassis I used to build a rebuilt Crosti back in 2014

 

 

 

 

Ah yes,I see now what you mean.Had you not pointed that out to me I wouldn’t have known it was lurking there.

The Bachmann service sheet isn’t informative about it. It certainly isn’t visible under normal operating circumstances and AFAIC isn’t a game changer . 

[Brian Indge]

On 21/09/2022 at 21:08, MikeParkin65 said:

Alleged poor motor performance  seems to be one of the constants in Sams recent tests. I wonder if it’s a characteristic of his electrics rather than the models?

Having seen him operate his carpet layout using a variac transformer and blowing his mains supply in doing so, I wouldn’t trust this numpty with anything. The way he connects his controller to the track also leaves a lot to be desired. His other constant carp is always about model cost. Frankly, if he objects to the cost, do what many others do and don’t buy it, simples.

[MikeParkin65]

1 hour ago, Ian Hargrave said:

 

Ah yes,I see now what you mean.Had you not pointed that out to me I wouldn’t have known it was lurking there.

The Bachmann service sheet isn’t informative about it. It certainly isn’t visible under normal operating circumstances and AFAIC isn’t a game changer . 

Another thing better than Hornby then - moving parts between the frames 🤣

[ikks]

On 22/09/2022 at 07:08, richard.h said:

Personally I think I will just stick with my Bachmann versions, they have all behaved well and can each haul around 26 wagons with ease which equals a train of about 8ft in total length which is the maximum my layout is set for,. So although the Hornby version seems to be more powerful how many of us are going to run super-long trains in reality.

 

Richard

 

 

that looks brilliant..........just like the prototype

[Black 5 Bear]

Excellent review on the Hornby 9F by BRM.

https://youtu.be/PZjYRxsMIuY

 

[sjp23480]

On 16/09/2022 at 12:08, Ian Hargrave said:

 

Just noticed the box above for Evening Star. Are Hornby actually marketing this model in association with the NRM as has been the case in the past ?

@Ian Hargrave not sure if this has been answered?

 

I noticed that the logo is "Railway Museum", not "National Railway Museum".  So the answer (I guess) is no. 

 

I am quite surprised that Hornby is using this branding (including the two diagonal red stripes across the box).  Is this putting at risk what has (in the past) been quite a lucrative partnership, presumably.   Otherwise why use the branding on this model?

 

For what its worth, I am not anti-Hornby, I received 92167 today and I think its a very impressive model. 

 

Steve

[Ian Hargrave]

5 minutes ago, sjp23480 said:

@Ian Hargrave not sure if this has been answered?

 

I noticed that the logo is "Railway Museum", not "National Railway Museum".  So the answer (I guess) is no. 

 

I am quite surprised that Hornby is using this branding (including the two diagonal red stripes across the box).  Is this putting at risk what has (in the past) been quite a lucrative partnership, presumably.   Otherwise why use the branding on this model?

 

For what its worth, I am not anti-Hornby, I received 92167 today and I think its a very impressive model. 

 

Steve

 
Given Hornby’s recent  awkwardness  over The Titfield Thunderbolt copyright etc. I had wondered that. But I don’t think any bones are broken here. At least,I hope not. 

[Ian Hargrave]

1 minute ago, thetrains said:

? Is this the right link?  Looked like a promo video.

That’s the one. 

[sjp23480]

Just now, Ian Hargrave said:

 
Given Hornby’s recent  awkwardness  over The Titfield Thunderbolt copyright etc. I had wondered that. But I don’t think any bones are broken here. At least,I hope not. 

Moi aussi!

[Black 5 Bear]

33 minutes ago, Ian Hargrave said:

That’s the one. 

 

35 minutes ago, thetrains said:

? Is this the right link?  Looked like a promo video.

Yes, originally part of the World of Railways (BRM) update.

[Black 5 Bear]

8 minutes ago, thetrains said:

Hornby promo then.

No, BRM magazine which has no links to Hornby.

[Ian Hargrave]

Just attempted to shorten the coupling distance between loco and tender. The way forward to the shorter position I found impossible to achieve as it seems blocked by the wiring which appears to need removing in order to do it. I’ve had to admit defeat.IMHO poor design and disappointing on what is essentially a very good model.But it’s not as good as it should be and if some think it’s the ultimate 9F then maybe ponder a while and look to see how our Continental HO opposites manage this without a hitch and with effective working mechanisms..We an do better than this.

[Steamport Southport]

1 hour ago, sjp23480 said:

@Ian Hargrave not sure if this has been answered?

 

I noticed that the logo is "Railway Museum", not "National Railway Museum".  So the answer (I guess) is no. 

 

I am quite surprised that Hornby is using this branding (including the two diagonal red stripes across the box).  Is this putting at risk what has (in the past) been quite a lucrative partnership, presumably.   Otherwise why use the branding on this model?

 

For what its worth, I am not anti-Hornby, I received 92167 today and I think its a very impressive model. 

 

Steve

 

Yes. Railway Museum = NRM.

 

Doesn't necessarily mean it's an NRM exclusive though, the recent LSWR liveried T9 120 has the same logos, etc. and that's a main range model.

 

 

 

Jason

[HExpressD]

12 minutes ago, Ian Hargrave said:

Just attempted to shorten the coupling distance between loco and tender. The way forward to the shorter position I found impossible to achieve as it seems blocked by the wiring which appears to need removing in order to do it. I’ve had to admit defeat.IMHO poor design and disappointing on what is essentially a very good model.But it’s not as good as it should be and if some think it’s the ultimate 9F then maybe ponder a while and look to see how our Continental HO opposites manage this without a hitch and with effective working mechanisms..We an do better than this.

I've noticed this on another Hornby loco with a similar drawbar, try taking it off both the loco and tender and turning it around, then it should be able to close couple 

[GWR-fan]

If as Sam has stated in his 9F review,  that Hornby has used the same or similar motor to the S15 and B12 then alas the 9F is not on my to do list.  I wanted both of the previous models but due numerous reports of faulty motors I have not purchased either model.  Sam's test "sharp" curve is most likely a radius 2 section of track and it seems to catch out many models which according to the literature are radius 2 compliant.  The motor in the 9F slows down considerably in the curve and barely makes it up the adjoining gradient.  From memory he has eight coaches attached which perhaps the majority of today's modellers would not have the ability to do but the 9F is a "powerful" locomotive and surely the model should be able to perform better than it does on Sam's video.

 

As regards his fixation with the cost of a model,  I believe that Sam is a litmus test of a typical model purchaser.  He wants value for money,  something that a MSRP of GBP252.99 does not represent.  There are those who must have the very latest releases for which price is irrelevant.  A comment was made if too expensive then do not buy,  well,  perhaps Sam's monetisation of a video supports the purchase of models to review but simply telling him to not purchase a model because of cost would deprive those who follow his reviews of the chance of seeing a relatively honest appraisal of a model.  I do feel that his reviews are more aimed at a younger age group but then he is successful at what he does so he has found a willing target audience to cater for.  It does seem odd that Sam comes in for a lot of criticism,  whereas from my memory of a few years ago,  a very successful but now dormant You-tube reviewer would post a childish unboxing and would test run his models on a bare floor and yet seemed to attract no criticism.  Fortunately he is now history unless one specifically searches for his channel.

 

What makes a Hornby 9F almost GBP100.00 more expensive than say a Dapol Manor or Accurascale Manor or Deltic?

[Porcy Mane]

5 minutes ago, GWR-fan said:

What makes a Hornby 9F almost GBP100.00 more expensive than say a Dapol Manor or Accurascale Manor or Deltic?

 

Management?

[jjb1970]

4 hours ago, Porcy Mane said:

 

Management?

 Indeed. Not all companies are the same. They have different cost bases, management capabilities, expected return on investment and market positioning. Frankly some companies are much better than others, and ultimately it depends on whether the market is willing to pay a price. Model trains are like a lot of other segments, lots of vendors with their own offering and pricing. Why are watches with the same Selitta and ETA movements (often assembled in Switzerland from parts manufactured in Asia) sold at wildly different price points? Why are Skoda, VW and Audi cars sold at different price points when they're the same cars under the skin? Prices are what they are and we as consumers decide whether or not a product is worth the price.

[RonnieS]

21 hours ago, MikeParkin65 said:

The Bachmann 9f remains a fine model. The significant advances of the Hornby model over the Bachmann from my perspective are the easier provision for DCC including sound, all wheel pick up and (I presume) bearings in the chassis. Bachmann scores on the etched smoke deflectors, better finish and for me the more substantial and convincing valve gear and coupling rods. Bachmann has also done some cracking weathered editions. 

Great Tender pick ups unlike the Duke.

[Legend]

9 hours ago, GWR-fan said:

If as Sam has stated in his 9F review,  that Hornby has used the same or similar motor to the S15 and B12 then alas the 9F is not on my to do list.  I wanted both of the previous models but due numerous reports of faulty motors I have not purchased either model.  Sam's test "sharp" curve is most likely a radius 2 section of track and it seems to catch out many models which according to the literature are radius 2 compliant.  The motor in the 9F slows down considerably in the curve and barely makes it up the adjoining gradient.  From memory he has eight coaches attached which perhaps the majority of today's modellers would not have the ability to do but the 9F is a "powerful" locomotive and surely the model should be able to perform better than it does on Sam's video.

 

As regards his fixation with the cost of a model,  I believe that Sam is a litmus test of a typical model purchaser.  He wants value for money,  something that a MSRP of GBP252.99 does not represent.  There are those who must have the very latest releases for which price is irrelevant.  A comment was made if too expensive then do not buy,  well,  perhaps Sam's monetisation of a video supports the purchase of models to review but simply telling him to not purchase a model because of cost would deprive those who follow his reviews of the chance of seeing a relatively honest appraisal of a model.  I do feel that his reviews are more aimed at a younger age group but then he is successful at what he does so he has found a willing target audience to cater for.  It does seem odd that Sam comes in for a lot of criticism,  whereas from my memory of a few years ago,  a very successful but now dormant You-tube reviewer would post a childish unboxing and would test run his models on a bare floor and yet seemed to attract no criticism.  Fortunately he is now history unless one specifically searches for his channel.

 

What makes a Hornby 9F almost GBP100.00 more expensive than say a Dapol Manor or Accurascale Manor or Deltic?

 I agree but can’t just say that because of your moderated status . 
 

i think specs of locos are all different . This one has substantial die cast metal so conceivably could be more expensive  than others , but then again the J15 and B12 that were substantially die cast weren’t .

 

I find Sams trains reviews useful . Yes he has his hang ups on sprung buffers , very slow running and torque . However it does enable me to see the model in close up detail and see it run on something akin to my own track ( no it’s not on a carpet , but there are second radius curves on it) . We don’t all have finescale track laid on billiard tables , so in that respect I think he is actually more representative of the general market , even for this high spec locomotive 
 

Like everything else , he attracts criticism because he is successful, but he has brought out some issues . Is his loco a rogue one - maybe? However it does exhibit tendencies to slow down on tight curves like ones I have . And like most of his reviews there is a point of comparison with the older 9F which runs perfectly well round these curves. He also compares it with the Bachmann version .  So he has highlighted an issue . Also because of his review we know the motor is similar to the one on the B12 and N15 if not the same . It is not the very good “big black motor” as Barrie Davis calls it that powers Princesses and Duchesses . 
 

I had been toying with buying one . It would have been a dead cert had it not been for the price , so this review is useful . Think I’ll hold off for a while and see how these motors last .