Hornby announce TT:120

[Steamport Southport]

2 minutes ago, Hobby said:

I see the negative vibes from some are already here, sadly! Well I hope Hornby prove you naysayers wrong!! Look at the other threads on the 1:120 section, @The Stationmaster and you will see from the size comparison thread that there IS a noticeable difference in size between British N and 1:120.

 

I've no SG stuff and I'm one of those who have modelled in 1:120 scale, albeit not UK outline, and I'm more than happy with the announcement, when phase 2 models are released I'll have nearly everything I need for a model based on what i saw as a spotter in the late 60s around Preston. Black 5, 9F and Brit, all I need is an 8F to make it perfect!

 

Thanks, Hornby!

 

Negative vibes, not really. Probably just not much enthusiasm as most of us are already modellers and probably already have massive investment in other scales. 

 

What are the plus points that are going to make us buy these rather than 00 or N which we normally buy/build?

 

Like on Dragons Den we are sitting here with a big wad of notes. They need to convince us to part with it. Most of us aren't waiting for a train set from mum and dad for Christmas. We have to buy them ourselves!

 

 

 

Jason

[HonestTom]

I could see the Kof II being very popular with scratch and kit builders.

[PaulRhB]

1 hour ago, luke_stevens said:

 

It's in the brochure wagons part "The shape of things to come"

 

but strangely not joined up at release which is the odd bit!

[Hobby]

Not aimed at you, Jason, but look at some of the other replies!

 

As for high risk, perhaps, perhaps not, time will tell. Unlike some I recon there is a market for the scale in the UK, but as I've said, I've actually modelled in 1:120, unlike many who pass comments without having done so, and I can attest to the "ideal scale" phrase that is being used. No-one is asking for people to shift scale. Though to be fair many of us have over the years, me included, so it's not exactly unknown. How many N scale modellers started life modelling in 00, for instance!! ;)

[Grovenor]

Some wierd and wonderful prices there, as mentioned above the 66 so cheap the 08 costs more.

But in the track, £2.49 for a straight track section, but only £0.99 if an uncoupler is added. Then £6.49 with a feed wire connection, presumably with a suppression capacitor like the 00 version, but no less than £21.99 for a digital feed wire connection, so £15.50 to take the capacitor out for you. 😄

[stovepipe]

30 minutes ago, wombatofludham said:

Alongside the "steam is more charismatic than diesel" comment after announcing serious new investment in D+E models back in January, somebody either needs to instruct him to stick to the script, or put him on secondment to the Ukrainian army as chief bridge burner.

 

The only thing making a SK presentation slightly bearable to watch is calculating the FPPM - the 'faux-pas per minute'. Although after he managed to alienate me three or four times in quick succession, the rest of his blether was rapidly skipped.

[HonestTom]

4 minutes ago, Grovenor said:

Some wierd and wonderful prices there, as mentioned above the 66 so cheap the 08 costs more.

But in the track, £2.49 for a straight track section, but only £0.99 if an uncoupler is added. Then £6.49 with a feed wire connection, presumably with a suppression capacitor like the 00 version, but no less than £21.99 for a digital feed wire connection, so £15.50 to take the capacitor out for you. 😄

The one I'm curious about is the sets. There's a £20 price difference, but the contents seem to be basically the same - a Pacific, three coaches, controller, oval of track with siding. Unless I'm missing something?

[phil-b259]

2 hours ago, Trains4U said:

The issue comes when the target “Family” get their set, then traipse over to their local model shop to get a new wagon or piece of track and find there is nothing there for them and no support for the products they’ve purchased.

 

In this day and age 'the family' are most likely to google for stuff on their smartphone / tablet - and get directed to the Hornby website.

 

What people on here need to recognize is that plenty of products from tech to home furnishings and beyond that are ONLY available to purchase online - yet the businesses promoting them have gone from strength to strength.

 

Anyone who thinks not having the new range stocked in model shops is going to stop the range selling is quite frankly deluded.

[Steamport Southport]

2 minutes ago, HonestTom said:

The one I'm curious about is the sets. There's a £20 price difference, but the contents seem to be basically the same - a Pacific, three coaches, controller, oval of track with siding. Unless I'm missing something?

 

The Pullmans are more expensive with lights.

 

https://uk.Hornby.com/products/pullman-1st-class-kitchen-octavia-lights-era-3-tt4003

 

 

Jason

[jjb1970]

Crikey, I never saw this coming 😯 A bold and courageous move by Hornby, they're taking a huge gamble. If TT takes off in Britain they are staking a huge claim to the scale and going in feet first with a pretty good range. I have always thought TT the perfect scale as a compromise between presence and compactness. I am often critical of Hornby, but I think this is a very gutsy move which I would love to really pay off for them. I am struggling to remember anything quite as 'big bang' as this in British railway modelling, the scale of the announcement is remarkable.

[Legend]

12 minutes ago, HonestTom said:

The one I'm curious about is the sets. There's a £20 price difference, but the contents seem to be basically the same - a Pacific, three coaches, controller, oval of track with siding. Unless I'm missing something?

Pullmans with lights?

[Cherry Tree Junction]

2 hours ago, TomE said:

My overarching question is, why.... Why waste time, effort, and more importantly in Hornby's case, money, on a scale that has almost zero industry support (even with other recent announcements it's still practically nothing relatively speaking) Why not invest in a scale that already has a user base, i.e. N Gauge, where people will be able to buy models and run them on existing layouts with existing stock. 
 

Hornby have clearly decided TT is going to be the alter on which they sacrifice themselves. It all seems pretty bonkers to me.

 

Tom. 

 

It's not that odd a decision when you realise that this is the first time they can sell British outline models directly into overseas market without being out of scale - TT is widely used and supported overseas and now people can mix and match British and continental models on the same layout without any scale problems. 

 

TT:120 fits neatly between HO and European N scales. I really do think this will be successful for Hornby, as well as all the other manufacturers, on the basis that the market is already huge, and for the as yet very niche domestic market, a further selling point is that this opens up the same opportunities for us too - get a Hornby TT trainset and bolster it with that European rolling stock or loco you've always fancied but didn't want it to look silly next your 00 gauge stuff. 

 

As for online only, why not, literally everything else is available online from groceries to cars, people buy far more expensive and considered purchases than some toy trains all the time based on online only and a few well placed Instagram adverts, check some youtube reviews and click "Buy It Now". 

[Il Grifone]

2 hours ago, Coldgunner said:

Wonder how compatible it will be with the old Triang stuff.

 

Not at all; it's a different scale (2.5 mm/ft against 3mm).

Perhaps I didn't look  hard enough, but I could  find no reference to gauge (12mm?) or wheel/track standards. I did see that they still don't understand how Walschaerts valve gear works.

 

[RyanN91]

It's very exciting and we are only in phase one.! By phase four there will be more steam diesel and electric locomotives, passanger and freight rolling stock EMUS, DMUS train sets added. Class 37s are arriving .So perhaps the HST Train sets were leaked along with the Pullman train set. Perhaps there could be a hint of what's to come further down the line (no pun intended) Intercity 225, Hitachi Class 800s, Eurostar Class 373, Class 370 APT-P, of the Hornby TT:120 range. A single and double level crossing will probably arrive soon I should imagine!

Edited October 10, 2022 by RyanN91
Typo and level crossings

[Cherry Tree Junction]

Probably a deliberate move not to re-use or affiliate the old Triang TT name to avoid confusion as this really isn't the same scale and there's no compatibility back and forth. 

[jonnyuk]

i've not looked on the AS product section but last week they did a screen shot of a new product (was it a class 31 EP), in the background was a box with TT, 1:120. Now i'm not wanting to start rumours but did AS get wind about this or have AS got some TT stuff up their sleeves and Hornby have brought forward their product launch?

 

either way i agree with others, this is really exciting, far more of a buzz than just a new loco. Big gamble and i really hope to pays off for Hornby. in the next 2 months i'm setting up an office, this would be perfect (i had N some time ago but i could not get on with how fiddly it is, drove me crazy).

[JohnR]

5 minutes ago, Cherry Tree Junction said:

Probably a deliberate move not to re-use or affiliate the old Triang TT name to avoid confusion as this really isn't the same scale and there's no compatibility back and forth. 

 

I'd like to imagine if Hornby had decided to do TT in the 50s, to compete with Triang, they'd have gone for 1:120, just to be slightly incompatible with Triang!

[HonestTom]

8 minutes ago, phil-b259 said:

 

In this day and age 'the family' are most likely to google for stuff on their smartphone / tablet - and get directed to the Hornby website.

 

What people on here need to recognize is that plenty of products from tech to home furnishings and beyond that are ONLY available to purchase online - yet the businesses promoting them have gone from strength to strength.

 

Anyone who thinks not having the new range stocked in model shops is going to stop the range selling is quite frankly deluded.

I wonder in some ways if that's the real experiment - use a new range to make a total break with the traditional way of doing business.

[Caledonian Gateway]

4 minutes ago, jonnyuk said:

i've not looked on the AS product section but last week they did a screen shot of a new product (was it a class 31 EP), in the background was a box with TT, 1:120. Now i'm not wanting to start rumours but did AS get wind about this or have AS got some TT stuff up their sleeves and Hornby have brought forward their product launch?

 

either way i agree with others, this is really exciting, far more of a buzz than just a new loco. Big gamble and i really hope to pays off for Hornby. in the next 2 months i'm setting up an office, this would be perfect (i had N some time ago but i could not get on with how fiddly it is, drove me crazy).

The picture you mention says "TT A3" which of course Hornby wouldn't want to be beaten to the market on. So you could be right if Accurascale are developing their own TT A3, Hornby may have decided to bring forward the announcement..

[David Stannard]

2 hours ago, PaulRhB said:

So what realistic stock is there for the 66’s to pull as I don’t think the Colas and GBRF are compatible with more than two tank liveries. 
Plus what is there that would pull 7 plk private owner wagons? 
Not exactly joined up thinking on the first release for scale modelling 😉

Who knows it could be a case of back to the future with the glory days of Hornby. Back when you had an express passenger loco and a shunter to represent each of the Big Four with virtually nothing in between, I wonder if they have TT Jinty chassis to slap under all and sundry.

Edited October 10, 2022 by David Stannard

[Allegheny1600]

10 minutes ago, jonnyuk said:

i've not looked on the AS product section but last week they did a screen shot of a new product (was it a class 31 EP), in the background was a box with TT, 1:120. Now i'm not wanting to start rumours but did AS get wind about this or have AS got some TT stuff up their sleeves and Hornby have brought forward their product launch?

 

either way i agree with others, this is really exciting, far more of a buzz than just a new loco. Big gamble and i really hope to pays off for Hornby. in the next 2 months i'm setting up an office, this would be perfect (i had N some time ago but i could not get on with how fiddly it is, drove me crazy).

I’m fairly sure during the course of the “Peco introduce British TT” thread, that one of the main guys from Accurascale scotched that rumour then!

However, if that was just a delaying tactic and they are joining in the 1:120 scale race, please do, the more, the merrier.

I’m thrilled whatever.

[JohnR]

4 minutes ago, jonnyuk said:

i've not looked on the AS product section but last week they did a screen shot of a new product (was it a class 31 EP), in the background was a box with TT, 1:120. Now i'm not wanting to start rumours but did AS get wind about this or have AS got some TT stuff up their sleeves and Hornby have brought forward their product launch?

 

either way i agree with others, this is really exciting, far more of a buzz than just a new loco. Big gamble and i really hope to pays off for Hornby. in the next 2 months i'm setting up an office, this would be perfect (i had N some time ago but i could not get on with how fiddly it is, drove me crazy).

 

Given that some, if not most of this is going to be arriving this winter, possibly in time for Christmas, then I doubt Hornby brought it forward due to AS 

[jonnyuk]

7 minutes ago, rxj27 said:

The picture you mention says "TT A3" which of course Hornby wouldn't want to be beaten to the market on. So you could be right if Accurascale are developing their own TT A3, Hornby may have decided to bring forward the announcement..

given who now works for AS, surely he must of known about this. this is not something you dream up and get to market in 12 months, this is long planned.........

[Synch]

Well this was rather unexpected, also rather interesting.

My first thought being "Oh good, maybe this will stop Hornby's needless obsession with duplicating everything they see as their turf"!

Big express locos to the fore as usual, I'm not surprised as this is what they've always gone for, starting out with the basics for a new scale of course it will be built around a trainset mentality, I really don't see this as a bad thing. Gresley pacifics, Duchess, atypical diesels, sounds about right for Hornby really.  At any rate this would seem to provide a good backbone for other manufacturers that already have or would want to dip a toe in the water, I can see this scale doing very well for itself.

 

For people just starting out, for those who just have a simple trainset or not a lot of OO or N items to begin with I can see this being very tempting, for myself I never took to N as I always found it to be more spindly then larger scales, but I'm not tempted to even consider jumping ship, my models are mainly pre-grouping and if it's taken RTR OO this long to get around to building up a suitable base I can only imagine the length of time it will be before we see commonplace pre 1923 prototypes in TT!

 

Good luck to Hornby, Peco, Heljan etc with this scale.

[jonnyuk]

next question is, with a clean slate in terms of era/location, what would you go for? i've always regretted not going with the transition years from steam to diesel in OO but i don't see allot in phase 1>4 to cover that