Oxfordrail - Adams Radial

[rembrow]

As a matter of interest does anyone know if the diecasts and the railway models are coming from the same factory?  I fully understand that some Chinese factories do work in a variety of materials but powered railway models are quite a way from relatively simple diecast road vehicles although they do incorporate some cast metal component of course.

 

The following statement was made by the Oxford Diecast MD, Lyndon Davies, on the Oxford Rail website during the build up to production of the Radial. They were already producing model rail models for other brands, so expanded that facility within the same factory.

quote - 'We will produce the products at Oxford Diecast China Factory. We have carried out an expansion of our factory in the last 6 months to accommodate the introduction of the Oxford Rail range. Our clean rooms have already been updated in preparation'. I assume the reference to 'clean rooms' relates to the areas designated for model rail item production, indicating the both diecast and model rail products are being produced in the same factory, but in separate areas.

Edited November 23, 2015 by rembrow

[Guest spet0114]

The following statement was made by the Oxford Diecast MD, Lyndon Davies, on the Oxford Rail website during the build up to production of the Radial. They were already producing model rail models for other brands, so expanded that facility within the same factory.

quote - 'We will produce the products at Oxford Diecast China Factory. We have carried out an expansion of our factory in the last 6 months to accommodate the introduction of the Oxford Rail range. Our clean rooms have already been updated in preparation'. I assume the reference to 'clean rooms' relates to the areas designated for model rail item production, indicating the both diecast and model rail products are being produced in the same factory, but in separate areas.

 

'Clean Room' usually refers to an environmentally controlled area with low levels of airborne particulates. My guess would be that the clean room areas would be used for processes such as final assembly, tampo printing (if that's still what they do) etc, whereas other 'dirtier' processes such as die-casting or painting would take place in non-clean areas.  As most of these processes would be common to road and rail vehicles, I doubt they'd segregate by 'brand', rather by process.

 

But that's just my guess....

[The Stationmaster]

The following statement was made by the Oxford Diecast MD, Lyndon Davies, on the Oxford Rail website during the build up to production of the Radial. They were already producing model rail models for other brands, so expanded that facility within the same factory.

quote - 'We will produce the products at Oxford Diecast China Factory. We have carried out an expansion of our factory in the last 6 months to accommodate the introduction of the Oxford Rail range. Our clean rooms have already been updated in preparation'. I assume the reference to 'clean rooms' relates to the areas designated for model rail item production, indicating the both diecast and model rail products are being produced in the same factory, but in separate areas.

Thanks although I'm well aware of that statement and Oxford diecast do indeed have factory space in a building in Kowloon, Hong Kong (47 Hoi Yuen Road) although reference to Muz's earlier post might interest you.

[Ozexpatriate]

'Our clean rooms have already been updated in preparation'.

 

I assume the reference to 'clean rooms' relates to the areas designated for model rail item production, indicating the both diecast and model rail products are being produced in the same factory, but in separate areas.

'Clean Room' usually refers to an environmentally controlled area with low levels of airborne particulates. My guess would be that the clean room areas would be used for processes such as final assembly, tampo printing (if that's still what they do) etc, whereas other 'dirtier' processes such as die-casting or painting would take place in non-clean areas.  As most of these processes would be common to road and rail vehicles, I doubt they'd segregate by 'brand', rather by process.

Certainly in electronics manufacturing 'clean room' is about particulates. However, the term can also apply to handling intellectual property where it can also be named (somewhat ironically and non-PC in this case) a "Chinese Wall".  In this case the distinction is usually more procedural than it is physical.

 

Here, Rembrow's definition of "clean room" seems more apt to me.  We've seen photographs of smaller model railway suppliers in operation - they are not clean rooms in the particulate sense by any stretch of the imagination - even for tampo printing, though some factories (like the old Sanda Kan factory) did appear to have separate, cleaner, facilities for tampo printing. (I vaguely remember a video of some Hornby stock being printed there. There was a more recent video of tampo printing that certainly wasn't in a clean room - that location would give the bunny suited crowd apoplexy.)

 

It's entirely possible that the factory making Oxford Rail's model railway items is also making items for other suppliers.  How many factories are Hornby using now? (At least six?) Companies like DJModels and RapidoTrains also use smaller contract manufacturers, not to mention the host of other worldwide model railroad companies who manufacture in China. The odds that these factories make products for multiple suppliers is very high and in that case the ability to 'wall off' the production environment between different, possibly competing products is essential. Again this could be operational, rather than with physically separated facilities.

Edited November 23, 2015 by Ozexpatriate

[The Stationmaster]

Certainly in electronics manufacturing 'clean room' is about particulates. However, the term can also apply to handling intellectual property where it can also be named (somewhat ironically and non-PC in this case) a "Chinese Wall".  In this case the distinction is usually more procedural than it is physical.

 

Here, Rembrow's definition of "clean room" seems more apt to me.  We've seen photographs of smaller model railway suppliers in operation - they are not clean rooms in the particulate sense by any stretch of the imagination - even for tampo printing, though some factories (like the old Sanda Kan factory) did appear to have separate, cleaner, facilities for tampo printing. (I vaguely remember a video of some Hornby stock being printed there. There was a more recent video of tampo printing that certainly wasn't in a clean room - that location would give the bunny suited crowd apoplexy.)

 

It's entirely possible that the factory making Oxford Rail's model railway items is also making items for other suppliers.  How many factories are Hornby using now? (At least six?) Companies like DJModels and RapidoTrains also use smaller contract manufacturers, not to mention the host of other worldwide model railroad companies who manufacture in China. The odds that these factories make products for multiple suppliers is very high and in that case the ability to 'wall off' the production environment between different, possibly competing products is essential. Again this could be operational, rather than with physically separated facilities.

There is one factory in China which has definitely produced items for two British concerns, plus another well known in some circles in Britain, and has possibly produced or sub-contracted work for another British 'brand name'.  It also appears to be the case that where factories are in relatively close proximity the owners talk to each other and can have a very good idea about what is being worked on for other 'names.

 

As for 'walling off' between 'brand names' I suspect that is not very likely - A's item will be followed down the production line by something for B and then something for J.  Although there might conceivably be more separation at the design stage?  But as far as the factories are concerned they are just doing a job of work for another client - that is what they are in business to do.

[PhilJ W]

Oxford has the one factory producing its own products under its own control. This is one of the reasons why their products are generally cheaper than their competitors. It has been stated that they have produced model railway items for other manufacturers under contract. This has been quoted as one of the reasons for the decision to go into model railways.

[jjb1970]

The model looks pretty decent to me. I'll wait until Hornby release theirs before deciding which one to buy. The Hornby one may end up being the better model but the Oxford one is noticeably cheaper. Whether the Hornby is worth the extra is a personal decision, I tend to think it will be based on what I've seen so far however I also think the Oxford model is a nice model that were it not for the Hornby option would be well received.

I suspect Oxford have miscalculated in terms of expectation management but it is nevertheless good to see them bring this model to the market. I can't help but feel that their biggest problem is not any issues with this model but is rather the renaissance of Hornby and the fact that Bachmann seem to be getting over their factory gremlins. A year ago many had written Hornby off as a busted flush and Bachmann were being slated for their price increases and production issues. Now Hornby are right back in the game with an exciting release program and recovering quality whilst the market is adjusting to Bachmann's revised pricing and they're getting models to the market. These factors must impact on the market space that Oxford were eye balling.

[RJS1977]

'Clean Room' usually refers to an environmentally controlled area with low levels of airborne particulates. My guess would be that the clean room areas would be used for processes such as final assembly, tampo printing (if that's still what they do) etc, whereas other 'dirtier' processes such as die-casting or painting would take place in non-clean areas.  As most of these processes would be common to road and rail vehicles, I doubt they'd segregate by 'brand', rather by process.

 

But that's just my guess....

 

In full-size car plants painting takes place inside a "clean area" to prevent impurities getting into the paint.

 

Some of the problems BL had with paint in the 1970s were allegedly because some of the factory workers decided the nice new "clean" areas were the best places to eat their lunches! They didn't stay clean for long!

[Peter Bedding]

Well, that's done it. According to an email from Liverpool I may expect delivery of quantity one 76AR001 within 2 days. Completely the wrong livery for me, of course, but I expect I'll survive. Best of all, my shunting plank is now up and running, and although far from ideal for running-in purposes, testing in both analogue and digital modes can now proceed. A few brass coaches will make a suitable load.

 

Watch this space.

[Graham_Muz]

Oxford has the one factory producing its own products under its own control. This is one of the reasons why their products are generally cheaper than their competitors. It has been stated that they have produced model railway items for other manufacturers under contract. This has been quoted as one of the reasons for the decision to go into model railways.

 

Phil I refer you to the post I made earlier in the thread "Don't believe all you read, the term "own factory" has been subject to 'interpretation'...."

[Fenman]

Phil I refer you to the post I made earlier in the thread "Don't believe all you read, the term "own factory" has been subject to 'interpretation'...."

I have re-read this sentence a number of times and I don't actually know what it means. I understand each of the words, of course, but it's the way they're put together.

 

Are you saying that Oxford don't own their own factory? Or that they do? Or that they part-own a factory? Or that they have a contract with someone else? Or something completely different?

 

I don't suppose it matters terribly, but people keep being corrected by reference to this statement, and it's confusing me!

 

Paul

[Graham_Muz]

It's a case of the difference between it being implied that they own a factory and that they have a factory that they use....

[Robin Brasher]

On the Gaugemaster website there is some information about the prototype and a picture of it in LSWR livery on the Bluebell Railway by Mike Esau. He is a well known photographer who has taken some pictures that we have used at Swanage. Gaugemaster are offering it for £99 so they are expecting a high demand.

 

I look forward to reading the first review of it when it comes out.

[PhilJ W]

The factory used by Oxford is exclusive to them in that Oxford control what is produced there. Other manufacturers have to wait for manufacturing slots as they have no control over the output. The factory used by Oxford is run by Chinese staff who are mainly directly employed by Oxford including the works manager. Whether the actual premises are owned or leased is neither here or there its the degree of control that makes the difference, not only in respect of lead up times but in costs, its no coincidence that Oxford are a lot cheaper than their competitors.

[amdaley]

Is it a factory controlled by & used exclusively for Oxford products or other products controlled by Oxford ?

 

According to the information here it certainly seems to be their factory.

http://www.oxfordrail.com/General.htm

Whether they own, lease or borrow it doesn't matter.

Edited November 24, 2015 by amdaley

[ExPatBrit]

In full-size car plants painting takes place inside a "clean area" to prevent impurities getting into the paint. 

That's exactly right, airborne particulates, dust and crud are the bane of paint spraying, so the atmosphere inside is filtered and pressurised to reduce the particulates as much as possible, hence "clean room". The spray booths themselves will have strippable coatings which get peeled off and recoated when overspray has built-up and really good ones, what's called a "wet back" with a circulating water "back" or water curtain to catch the paint particulates, which then get filtered from the water. Operators should wear lint free "white suits", so they aren't introducing more airborne particulates and crud from their "civvies". Any pressurised compressed air for the spray guns and blow cleaning is or should be de-ionized to prevent static charge in non metallic parts, for example plastic loco bodies.

All this, because, counter intuitively, paint will highlight, not cover, any defects, dust and crud in and under the paint.

 

It's possible, but not vital that Tampo print could be done in a clean room, the surface areas and hence problems are usually much smaller. I'm also pretty sure this definition of a clean room, (as opposed to an electronics, space, aeronautics, inspection, assembly or medical clean room, although the principles and needs are the same), would mean the same thing to Oxford Rail, Hornby and subs, Kader, Leyland, Ferrari and etc. a Chinese Wall is something else entirely.

 

Most, (good), auto-body shops have the same thing, for the same reasons, in a seperate area from the rest of the shop.

[roundhouse]

back on the subject of the Adams radial, has nay one got their hands on one from the retailers yet?

 

Looking forward as to how well it runs and looks in the flesh.

[chris45lsw]

The only problem with 30583 if your modelling is time sensitive, is that Oxford's model only represents it in its last couple of BR years (April 1959 to July 1961).  For all of its (short) SR life and most of its BR existence it had a Drummond boiler.

 

Chris Knowles-Thomas

[Martin_R]

Had an e-mail from Kernow today to say both 30583 and 30584 are in the post - will be interesting to compare the detail differences between them.

[Adams442T]

Had an e-mail from Kernow today to say both 30583 and 30584 are in the post - will be interesting to compare the detail differences between them.

 

If you look at my post 1202 and Chris Knowles-Thomas's post 1225 that should give you all the info you need.

 

That's not to say that some pix of the pair wouldn't be welcomed!

[cromptonnut]

Do we know if anyone plans to bring out one in a livery suitable for WW2 era?

[Graham_Muz]

Their factory in China certainly has only Oxford branding:

 

 

http://www.oxfordrail.com/images/P1020123.jpg

 

Oxford Rail will also have a stand at Warley:

 

"Visit us at the Warley Model Railway Show, Birmingham NEC, [/size]28th & 29th November, [/size]Stand A12."[/size]

Yes I was waiting for that 'posed' photograph to be cited again, my views are based on information from someone whom has visited this and a number of the relevant factories in the area.

[alfsboy]

I think the Chinese are anything you want them to be as long as money is involved.A factory is a transient beast  and signs made in hours.The end product is all that matters .

[Dr Gerbil-Fritters]

My brother in law's 'factory' upped sticks and disappeared overnight, workers, machines, tools, products, plans, IP, everything.

 

To no-ones surprise, the Local Government were uninterested in investigating.

 

His next great business plan involved Angola.... I'll say one thing for him, he's an opportunistic git optimistic human being....

[MGR Hooper!]