Accurascale's First Steam Locomotive; GWR Collett 78xx Manor Class!

[Phil Bullock]

7 minutes ago, Accurascale Fran said:

 

Hi Phil,

 

As per our blog we are amending the coupler so it can be stowed in this fashion. As you said, it's such a characteristic of the prototypes we have to do it. 

 

Cheers!

 

Fran 

 

Cheers Fran so much going on impossible to keep up! But should have known you would have it under control. 
 

A very merry Christmas to all at Accurascale towers…

 

Phil

[Captain Kernow]

What a superb looking loco!

 

As I've said before, just think what Accurascale could do with the 57XX (and 8750) pannier tank!

 

[ERIC ALLTORQUE]

So much talk with comparison to other inferior manufactures,you do realise its days from christmas and being on the naughty list at this late stage would be pointless.There team of elves doing the construction of these and other items in the range will have it perfect by its time for release,its a ruse they are made in China and the Carlsberg factorys are in Scandanavia,the signs are there,it all adds up......

[Guest]

18 hours ago, Accurascale Fran said:

Hi @confused,

We'd take a good quality can motor over coreless any day, and our Manor will have the former, with flywheel.

Cheers! Fran 

Sams' trains won't like a 3 pole, Ha ha . 

 

I have been following from your first announcement and the boys at the local club are sceptical about a high quality 3 pole even with flywheel having enough torque for the weight and also possible cogging.  My Electro mechanical engineer best mate of 40 yrs (not a modeler) says that "in my opinion the best 3p would not be as good as an average 5p or poor 7p based on my experience but of course tech has move rapidly on since I was trained 49 yrs ago".

 

Note I am just very curious, and not being critical in any way and like to expand my knowledge.  I like the sound of low start-up voltage, my 3 coreless locos (Baccy 94xx esp.) are my best runners starting at about 15 my GM as opposed to 25-30 for 5p skews with or without flywheel and even these sometimes cog when stopping.  Trying my best not to sound negative.

 

best regards Terry

Edited December 21, 2021 by Guest

[Harlequin]

36 minutes ago, Accurascale Fran said:

 

Hi @57xx 

 

Just on the tender logo, this is the reference point we used for the colour; http://www.gwr.org.uk/liveriesbutton.html so it is gilt rather than gold. This is a sold reference point we feel and what we used for the artwork. We have had suggestions to use gold, but that appears to be incorrect. What do we think? 

 

Cheers!

 

Fran 

 

On page 13 of Great Western Way (2009 edition) there's a colour photo of the GWR roundel that appears to be quite coppery in tone.

I don't know the source of the photo or how much we can trust it - just throwing into the mix.

 

I'm pretty sure there's another source that I can't find right now (possibly buried somewhere else in GWW) that says that when GWR painting instructions specified "Gold" what they actually meant was Yellow. Of course this may have been in a completely different context so it needs careful research.

 

Edited December 21, 2021 by Harlequin

[Accurascale Fran]

8 minutes ago, confused said:

Sams' trains won't like a 3 pole, Ha ha . 

 

I have been following from your first announcement and the boys at the local club are sceptical about a high quality 3 pole even with flywheel having enough torque for the weight and also possible cogging.  My Electro mechanical engineer best mate of 40 yrs (not a modeler) says that "in my opinion the best 3p would not be as good as an average 5p or poor 7p based on my experience but of course tech has move rapidly on since I was trained 49 yrs ago".

 

Note I am just very curious, and not being critical in any way and like to expand my knowledge.  I like the sound of low start-up voltage, my 3 coreless locos (Baccy 94xx esp.) are my best runners starting at about 15 my GM as opposed to 25-30 for 5p skews with or without flywheel and even these sometimes cog when stopping.  Trying my best not to sound negative.

 

best regards Terry

 

Hi Terry,

 

With the greatest of respect, is it fair to base an opinion on something from almost 50 years ago?

 

We have tested a number of motors for the Manor (including 5 pole and coreless) and we found that the high quality 3 pole was best. Perhaps when we publish videos of it running in the new year, or when they arrive and are on the shelves, you can make your mind up then?

 

Cheers!

 

Fran 

[57xx]

55 minutes ago, Accurascale Fran said:

 

Hi @57xx 

 

Just on the tender logo, this is the reference point we used for the colour; http://www.gwr.org.uk/liveriesbutton.html so it is gilt rather than gold. This is a sold reference point we feel and what we used for the artwork. We have had suggestions to use gold, but that appears to be incorrect. What do we think? 

 

Cheers!

 

Fran 

 

Hi Fran, the Reference point is very sound, it just looks brighter in the pic. If that's just the way the pic has come out and what you see in the flesh matches the gwr.org site (e.g. a more subdued golden/gilt yellow), then all is good. I'd agree gold is not correct for a locomotive either.

Edited December 21, 2021 by 57xx

[The Stationmaster]

22 minutes ago, Harlequin said:

 

On page 13 of Great Western Way (2009 edition) there's a colour photo of the GWR roundel that appears to be quite coppery in tone.

I don't know the source of the photo or how much we can trust it - just throwing into the mix.

 

I'm pretty sure there's another source that I can't find right now (possibly buried somewhere else in GWW) that says that when GWR painting instructions specified "Gold" what they actually meant was Yellow. Of course this may have been in a completely different context so it needs careful research.

 

I think it is always a good idea to try to find photos if that is possible and there are several published contemporaneous colour photos of the roundel on locos plus of course b&W photos.  The interesting thing about all of them, particularly when compared with the picture you referred to, is that the loco roundel looks very pale in colour and on colour photos it looks to be clearly yellow rather than 'coppery' or 'golden' so gilt would appear to be the correct tone.

 

Interestingly comparing the A/S sample colour with really clean ex-works real Swindon output in a v colour phoyo it looks exactly right.

 

I accept that colour stock can change over the yerars and that set up for printing will laso have an effect but one photo in particular has be very correct hues for other features - such as some brickwork in the background and a red RA disc that I go with yellow/a yellowy gilt on locos.  

Edited December 21, 2021 by The Stationmaster

[Miss Prism]

23 minutes ago, Accurascale Fran said:

Just on the tender logo, this is the reference point we used for the colour; http://www.gwr.org.uk/liveriesbutton.html so it is gilt rather than gold. This is a sold reference point we feel and what we used for the artwork. We have had suggestions to use gold, but that appears to be incorrect. What do we think? 

 

'gilt' is a rather undefined colour, and problematic in small-scale translation. It varies between a bright gold and a dull gold.

 

 

In large-scale application, it can appear as a very light colour, with a significant yellow content:

 

 

Or a dull colour:

 

 

Or a bit brighter:

 

 

In black and white historical photos, the tone of the gilt is very similar to the tone of polished brass, and this brings us to the paradox/contradiction in:

 

 

My personal view is that the Accurascale roundel colour is too yellow.

 

 

[Guest]

19 minutes ago, Accurascale Fran said:

...........We have tested a number of motors for the Manor (including 5 pole and coreless) and we found that the high quality 3 pole was best. Perhaps when we publish videos of it running in the new year, or when they arrive and are on the shelves, you can make your mind up then?

Cheers! Fran 

Thanks that's good enough for me, I assumed it would be well thought out.  Mind has been made up for a while now, and will not be entertaining Dapol's (any locos), or Hornby's anymore mainly due to poor mechanisms and QC and H's appalling customer service with faults.

 

terry

[7007GreatWestern]

The team restoring 4930 Hagley Hall on the Severn Valley Railway are now very much in the 'home straight' on that loco's lengthy restoration. They've decided to return their loco to traffic in the 1930s GWR livery and the tender was painted just last month:- https://www.facebook.com/groups/176898859005308/permalink/5113105308717947/

 

Of interest is the method they have used to replicate the 'roundel' - it was 'hand gilded', meaning that actual gold leaf, rather than paint was used.

 

Of course this is not proof of historical accuracy, but the SVR paint shop generally has a very high reputation for quality and historical fidelity.....

 

 

[Accurascale Fran]

Thanks everyone, appreciate the feedback on the shirt button. We will have a look at it too.

 

Cheers!

 

Fran 

[Blandford1969]

24 minutes ago, 7007GreatWestern said:

Of course this is not proof of historical accuracy, but the SVR paint shop generally has a very high reputation for quality and historical fidelity.....

 

Not quite sure what you mean by generally, unless you are referring to Nula Seer and something from 84 ? The volunteers who do this take accuracy very seriously. 

[Ian Hargrave]

As I remember them ,firstly in BR black on a holiday journey to Cornwall ,piloting from Newton Abbot to Plymouth in 1953 over the South Devon banks,thus I choose 7824 early crest and later in BR green on both the Cambrian main line and occasionally freight work on The Vale of Neath line ,so 7812 with late crest. A pair. As all of us are,looking forward to these.

 

[Mallard60022]

1 hour ago, Captain Kernow said:

What a superb looking loco!

 

As I've said before, just think what Accurascale could do with the 57XX (and 8750) pannier tank!

 

Just think what they could do with a Urie S15!!!!!!!!! Or a U1.

Gone already.

P

[Accurascale Fran]

9 minutes ago, Mallard60022 said:

Just think what they could do with a Urie S15!!!!!!!!! Or a U1.

Gone already.

P

 

I promise you that we are working on other regions when it comes to steam, but more on that in the future!

 

Cheers!

 

Fran 

[ERIC ALLTORQUE]

40 minutes ago, Accurascale Fran said:

 

I promise you that we are working on other regions when it comes to steam, but more on that in the future!

 

Cheers!

 

Fran 

As long as one is designated more than 4 and less than 6 the roof will stay on.

[7007GreatWestern]

1 hour ago, Blandford1969 said:

Not quite sure what you mean by generally, unless you are referring to Nula Seer and something from 84 ? The volunteers who do this take accuracy very seriously. 

Well spotted Blandford - that was exactly what I was thinking of!

 

For those not 'in' on this particular joke, this was one of the Severn Valley Paintshop's  offerings from around 1984 - an April 1st spoof. When the photographs appeared in Steam Railway Magazine there was practically rioting in the streets! The photos were credited to one Nula Seer. No individual of that name was ever found responsible, though former SVR Chief Mechanical Engineer Alun Rees had very strong LMS leanings....... 

[Captain Kernow]

2 hours ago, Mallard60022 said:

Just think what they could do with a Urie S15!!!!!!!!! Or a U1.

Gone already.

P

Don't go, Mr Duck, do come back! 

 

And when you do, let me just remind you that there were a total of 863 57XX and 8750 panniers, with such exotic variations as 'to top feed or not to top feed' or 'to rivet the tanks or not to rivet the tanks', to say nothing of the opportunities offered by different liveries (GWR green, various, BR unlined black, BR lined black (just a few), London Transport, NCB, GN&SR etc.!

 

Just saying!

 

In the meantime, I am going to have to re-visit my conviction that I don't need a Manor on my loco roster. Too big for 'Bethesda Sidings' and not Somerset & Dorsetish enough for 'Bleakhouse Road', but then again, there is always 'Rule 1'.

 

 

 

[Covkid]

14 hours ago, Covkid said:

Oh dear.  In a moment of weakness I have responded to Accurascale junk emails and ordered an "Erlestoke Manor".  How long do I have to save for it, my first Accurascale loco  ?   

 

8 hours ago, Islesy said:

And there was us thinking of them as informative updates on our stunning projects!

Glad you succumbed mind….

 

Haha Paul, yes, very informative and yes, your projects are stunning. As a transition era modeller I was very pleasantly surprised by the Siphon G - a good fit for many modellers and collectors given the longevity of the vehicles. 

 

I think you guys are adopting the "Whack a mole" approach with whole different eras to entice us, You really need to sustain the hopper theme and those lovely iron ore hoppers scaled correctly will be very nice  

[woodenhead]

2 hours ago, Accurascale Fran said:

 

I promise you that we are working on other regions when it comes to steam, but more on that in the future!

 

Cheers!

 

Fran 

Just a note, the world does not need another Flying Scotsman or Mallard.

[No Decorum]

3 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

Just a note, the world does not need another Flying Scotsman or Mallard.

Exactly. K4. Gresley K1 & K2 if you really want to indulge me.

[Guest]

15 minutes ago, woodenhead said:

Just a note, the world does not need another Flying Scotsman or Mallard.

SR/BR SRgn., and decent WC/BOB spamcans, Hby's. are dire now.

[geoffers]

".....In the meantime, I am going to have to re-visit my conviction that I don't need a Manor on my loco roster. Too big for 'Bethesda Sidings' and not Somerset & Dorsetish enough for 'Bleakhouse Road', but then again, there is always 'Rule 1'......"

 

As have I. Will join the 8750 Pannier Tank and the "Baby Castle" 0-6-0. but I must confess I do have a WR theme every now and then, with a Mogul, a "Grange", a 94XX, and a 56XX.

[Blandford1969]

2 hours ago, 7007GreatWestern said:

Well spotted Blandford - that was exactly what I was thinking of!

 

For those not 'in' on this particular joke, this was one of the Severn Valley Paintshop's  offerings from around 1984 - an April 1st spoof. When the photographs appeared in Steam Railway Magazine there was practically rioting in the streets! The photos were credited to one Nula Seer. No individual of that name was ever found responsible, though former SVR Chief Mechanical Engineer Alun Rees had very strong LMS leanings....... 

 

Only half the engine was ever painted, it was brought out early one morning, photographed and then straight into the paint shop again where it was immediately flatted back and painted out. It was always a joke and boy did people bite, though 'rioting in the streets' is a bit strong. It would have been worthy of Beechingposting or the Bash Mash if either existed that far back, which they did not. 

 

The saddest time and when the painting was not as good (in my opinion) is when the volunteers were pushed out and the painting outsourced. Fortunately they are now welcome again. The paintshop is locked and no one is allowed in to see Hagley till she is finished now that the boiler is in the fames.