RMweb Premium BluenGreyAnorak Posted February 19 RMweb Premium Share Posted February 19 In the modern context I'm sure they'd be governed by the Pressure Equipment (Safety) Regulations. I don't know if there was anything that specific during the working lives of these loco's though. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steamport Southport Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 And before people start looking in the wrong place, Bowaters was in Ellesmere Port, not Ellesmere which is quite a distance away and a very different type of place! Jason Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rapidoTom Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 5 hours ago, Michael Hodgson said: As fireless engines don't have boilers, they won't need boiler certificates. Is there some equivalent requirement for the safety of the pressure vessel to be inspected/tested periodically ? Do they have a safety valve to prevent over-pressurisation on refilling? As there's no fire, were they usually single-manned? I don't have regulatory requirements on hand, but according to one drawing initial charge pressure was 200psi, and the reservoir would be proof tested to 350psi before sending the loco to the customer. Cylinders and pipework would be tested to a slightly less stringent 240psi. Several early locos had no safety valve at all (!) but by the time of the "Caledonia" type they had one on top of the dome. For those without safety valves, the pressure may have been regulated externally, on whatever boiler the location's steam supply was using. They would often be single-manned, which was part of the cost-saving appeal - although given the industrial sites they worked on there would almost always be workers about to lend a hand if needed. 4 hours ago, Steamport Southport said: And before people start looking in the wrong place, Bowaters was in Ellesmere Port, not Ellesmere which is quite a distance away and a very different type of place! Unless you want the Bowaters site in Northfleet, Kent... research was a little tricky sometimes when a photo is just labelled "Bowaters" and you can't tell which is which! 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Mol_PMB Posted February 19 Share Posted February 19 The reservoir on a fireless loco is a much simpler vessel than a boiler, with less to go wrong, but it’s still a pressure vessel that needs to be inspected, tested and maintained according to the pressure equipment standards. I believe the working pressure of the locos varied somewhat according to the source of steam available at each site, and there was also some variation in cylinder size which may have been related. Only one loco had a water tank and injector, and I wonder if this was associated with a particularly high charge pressure which gave the opportunity to extend the run time by adding cold water to the boiler? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Asterix2012 Posted February 26 RMweb Gold Share Posted February 26 On 19/02/2024 at 19:34, Mol_PMB said: The reservoir on a fireless loco is a much simpler vessel than a boiler, with less to go wrong, but it’s still a pressure vessel that needs to be inspected, tested and maintained according to the pressure equipment standards. I believe the working pressure of the locos varied somewhat according to the source of steam available at each site, and there was also some variation in cylinder size which may have been related. Only one loco had a water tank and injector, and I wonder if this was associated with a particularly high charge pressure which gave the opportunity to extend the run time by adding cold water to the boiler? Not necessarily the pressure, may have been charged with superheated (dry) steam which would be at higher temperature than saturated (wet) steam. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold stovepipe Posted March 19 RMweb Gold Share Posted March 19 Andrew Barclay 2126 CEGB Gloucester 20 March 1965 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rapidoandy Posted April 1 Share Posted April 1 A new (fun) livery for our fireless… 6 5 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted April 1 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 1 (edited) 47 minutes ago, rapidoandy said: A new (fun) livery for our fireless… Well funny you should say that as a few more of the vans and that would be very welcome! I’ve had to buy normal gunpowder vans to bulk up the fleet! Go on a set with two vans, please 😁 Edited April 1 by PaulRhB 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rapidoandy Posted April 1 Share Posted April 1 (edited) One of our retailers has taken an exclusive commission of opens in a suitable livery… https://thewagonyard.co.uk/product/guy-fawkes-rch-1907-spec-10t-open-wagon/ Edited April 1 by rapidoandy 7 3 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hodgson Posted April 1 Share Posted April 1 It's not the first of April today is it? 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JSpencer Posted April 1 Share Posted April 1 15 minutes ago, Michael Hodgson said: It's not the first of April today is it? Ah you missed the joke on Facebook this morning! At first they said they were doing a 31! 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Michael Hodgson Posted April 1 Share Posted April 1 41 minutes ago, JSpencer said: Ah you missed the joke on Facebook this morning! At first they said they were doing a 31! I don't have access to facebook. 2 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Moderators AY Mod Posted April 1 Moderators Share Posted April 1 3 hours ago, Michael Hodgson said: I don't have access to facebook. Unless there's some kind of court order or you live behind the bamboo curtain you and everyone has access to its public pages. Whether you have a login is a different matter. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted April 1 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 1 1 hour ago, rapidoandy said: One of our retailers has taken an exclusive commission of opens in a suitable livery… https://thewagonyard.co.uk/product/guy-fawkes-rch-1907-spec-10t-open-wagon/ Wonderful, just ordered some and the loco! Magnificent 😁 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted April 1 Share Posted April 1 1 hour ago, rapidoandy said: One of our retailers has taken an exclusive commission of opens in a suitable livery… https://thewagonyard.co.uk/product/guy-fawkes-rch-1907-spec-10t-open-wagon/ Bang on, chaps! They'll be rocketing off the shelves.😇 5 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted April 1 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 1 Link to the loco and wagon combo, there’s also a sound option https://thewagonyard.co.uk/product/guy-fawkes-dcc-ready-combo-deal/ 2 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
5050 Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 For me (and a few others) the obvious question is - 'how easy will it be to convert to EM/P4?' I really fancy one but if it will be a pain or impossible to do then, sadly, no sale will be forthcoming. 1 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
34theletterbetweenB&D Posted April 2 Share Posted April 2 On 19/02/2024 at 19:34, Mol_PMB said: The reservoir on a fireless loco is a much simpler vessel than a boiler, with less to go wrong, but it’s still a pressure vessel that needs to be inspected, tested and maintained according to the pressure equipment standards. I believe the working pressure of the locos varied somewhat according to the source of steam available at each site, and there was also some variation in cylinder size which may have been related. These two organisations were probably at the forefront in establishing standards and appropriate inspection schemes: https://collection.sciencemuseumgroup.org.uk/people/ap11684/manchester-steam-users-association https://collection.sciencemuseumgroup.org.uk/people/ap14641/british-engine-insurance-ltd On 19/02/2024 at 19:34, Mol_PMB said: Only one loco had a water tank and injector, and I wonder if this was associated with a particularly high charge pressure which gave the opportunity to extend the run time by adding cold water to the boiler? Run time extension is the logical reason, but I suspect the method was to add cold water to the supply as drawn from the pressure vessel, to bring the pressure down to the range for which the valve gear and cylinder size was optimised. On 26/02/2024 at 00:56, Asterix2012 said: Not necessarily the pressure, may have been charged with superheated (dry) steam which would be at higher temperature than saturated (wet) steam. All fireless locos were charged with high pressure hot water. A charge of dry steam would yield no useful range. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
JShow Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 The Fawkes livery is super-sharp, but a bridge too far for me. It did prompt me to finally pre-order the maroon liveried version which, as Mol_PMB has reminded us, is as fictional as the Fawkes version. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
PenrithBeacon Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 On 02/04/2024 at 12:17, 5050 said: For me (and a few others) the obvious question is - 'how easy will it be to convert to EM/P4?' I really fancy one but if it will be a pain or impossible to do then, sadly, no sale will be forthcoming. Rapido don't have a good track record for this unfortunately Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
rapidoandy Posted April 3 Share Posted April 3 Huh! Always interesting to hear views. The Scalefour Society have congratulated us on (where we can) making things friendly for them - so much so they are coming to our show. Yes not everything is because it’s not cost effective (especially with things like steam locos). Our motto (in relation to EM and P4) is - Where we can we do - and most people are happy with that and accept it. I cant recall with the fireless - I’m off today but will ask one of the designers later this week. Take care, Andy Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted April 3 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 3 Couldn’t resist the guy fawkes one so preordered from rails the gun powder van behind it in the pic is that going to be available too, can only see the special commission open wagon on the wagon works website Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted April 3 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 3 2 hours ago, big jim said: Couldn’t resist the guy fawkes one so preordered from rails the gun powder van behind it in the pic is that going to be available too Unless they do another run they won’t be, I asked at Ally Pally but they had no plans. They were in the not quite mink thread. 1 Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold big jim Posted April 3 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 3 (edited) 2 hours ago, PaulRhB said: Unless they do another run they won’t be, I asked at Ally Pally but they had no plans. They were in the not quite mink thread. was it a general release? EDIT: I see it was and long sold out everywhere! Edited April 3 by big jim Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold PaulRhB Posted April 3 RMweb Gold Share Posted April 3 19 minutes ago, big jim said: was it a general release? I honestly don’t know Jim, I saw it in the mink thread and ordered it direct back last March. They arrived just in time for Nov 5th. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
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