RMweb Premium Pannier Tank Posted January 9, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 9, 2011 Dapol Press release October 2010 stated:- “New items under development will only be announced to the press, trade and public 1 month before they are due to be in the shops.†At the Warley Exhibition December 2010 Dapol announced DP2 in ‘OO’ Gauge. Reading the latest addition of Model Rail is confirmation of DP2. In the same magazine Bachmann advise that there are numerous variations of the LMS Twins to be taken into consideration. Dapol also announce that there will be a delay in producing their version of the LMS Twins because it has come to their attention that there are more variations that they first thought. Research / October 2010 Press release? Dapol have since placed their DP2 production on hold. That’s going to make interesting reading in the model press. I placed a pre-release order for a D6300 / Class 22 just approaching 2 years ago and am still waiting, not a problem as there were some issues with losing the original drawings and presumably their back-ups. Dapol have just announced “the most accurate and realistic Class 52 ‘Western’ yet manufacturedâ€. I think that Dapol need to learn to walk before they run, there is so much at stake with the D6300 (and it’s successors) that they can’t afford not to get it 100% right, first time. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted January 9, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 9, 2011 David, the comment that Dapol made regarding announcing products only being announced a month before release related to N gauge not OO I thought. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Pannier Tank Posted January 9, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 9, 2011 David, the comment that Dapol made regarding announcing products only being announced a month before release related to N gauge not OO I thought. Kris, There is no reference in the "Press Release" to suggest that this related to N Gauge products only. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
BernardTPM Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 David, the comment that Dapol made regarding announcing products only being announced a month before release related to N gauge not OO I thought. Does this mean the new N Gauge Western and Hall will be out in February, then? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Wherry Lines Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 The Hall is due for a 1st or 2nd quarter release..... Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
grahame Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 I am delighted to a see a Hall being produced to modern standards. It is a such a GWR workhorse and I will be getting at least 1. But is a shame that the are not producing them in lined black. .....although isn't black probably one of the easiest liveries for the enthusiast modeller to undertake themselves? Why not have a go a re-painting one and show us how you get on. I'd find that more interesting than reading about which loco liveries and numbers manufacturers should select. G. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted January 9, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 9, 2011 Kris, There is no reference in the "Press Release" to suggest that this related to N Gauge products only. I got this impression because it was released with a list of new liveries of existing N gauge models, but there was no mention of OO models, however having looked back at the thread about this Dave did seem to suggest that the release dates information applied to everything, but all other information in the release was N gauge related. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Guest Max Stafford Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Good God, Grahame! Are you actually suggesting that people participate in the physical act of modelling? It's as likely what I'd do in this situation to be fair - it's the easiest repaint you'll ever get after all. I'm amazed at the excitement generated by the 1000 - four previous attempts too! Well, hopefully, this one will surpass its predecessors and provide a real replacement for Western Chav... And when you're done sorting that one out, Dave, can you crack on with the DE NBLs, please? The real railway in the north needs 'em! Dave. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium Kris Posted January 9, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 9, 2011 I am delighted to a see a Hall being produced to modern standards. It is a such a GWR workhorse and I will be getting at least 1. But is a shame that the are not producing them in lined black. There were only a handful of green early crest Halls introduced after the WR gained greater autonomy in the mid 50s but before the late crest was introduced. The vast majority of the class were lined black for the early 50s (era 4). Hopefully Dapol will include a lined black version in future runs or perhaps an enterprising retailer will consider commissioning one. Of the ex-GWR locos, only the Castles wore green with the early crest for most of the early BR days. Given that Dave has said that the names and number relate to modified Halls for a future release I guess there is hope that the standard ones do come in lined black in the first batches. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Steve K Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 I'm as happy as anyone to see a "Western" produced - in any scale. Surely one of the most handsome diesel locomotives ever made, and so I can understand everyone's excitement. However: Yes Dapol....... PLEASE get the front window profile correct... The JLTRT front is better than Heljan but still not correct. If you're right about the JLTRT model, then you'll surely be disappointed, if Dapol are using JLTRT's CAD files. At the Aylesbury Exhibition last year I saw a 'cab only' front end of an 'OO' model class 52 done by a chap in his own time and expense. It was beautifull and stunning, 100000% correct I know you're excited, but anything over 100% correct would bend the laws of physics somewhat... just because X-Factor contestants like to talk nonsense about giving "1000 per cent", it doesn't mean we all have to join in! Could I also ask...... consider producing locos with the shortest names (if possible) so that if we choose to rename a loco we don't have to destroy the paintwork by masking out a model of say WESTERN AMBASSADOR to make a WESTERN HERO. Now that's a sensible idea - why have I heard no-one suggest that before? Anyway, what do I know? I quite like the Heljan model. Heck, I even liked my old Hornby Western Courier! Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Rugd1022 Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Good God, Grahame! Are you actually suggesting that people participate in the physical act of modelling? It's as likely what I'd do in this situation to be fair - it's the easiest repaint you'll ever get after all. I'm amazed at the excitement generated by the 1000 - four previous attempts too! Well, hopefully, this one will surpass its predecessors and provide a real replacement for Western Chav... And when you're done sorting that one out, Dave, can you crack on with the DE NBLs, please? The real railway in the north needs 'em! Dave. It does happen now and then Dave, even I can 'get a move on' when the inspiration strikes! Repainting the Hall into black would be easy yes, but I dare say not everyone has the patience or skill to line one out... is mixed traffic lining available in 2mm I wonder? It would certainly be attractive and some of them lasted in this livery till about 1959 / 60 at least. As for the Thousand, I'm keeping my fingers and toes crossed that this incarnation will be the one to lay all the others to rest, we can but hope. Dapol's announcement has taken many of us by surprise and I wonder how far advanced the project is. I know I'm probably jumping the gun a bit here but I'm already knee deep in Western books, sussing out and reminding myself of all the detail and livery variations. It's interesting that Dapol have chosen D1029 with it's 'double N' in the name, IIRC the original plate had just the one N until the second one was added to the backing plates, it was either 1967 or 1969 but I'd need to check. If they get this one right from the start, the number and livery combinations they can release could go on for several years, D1000 alone could be released in four different styles, the possibilities for limited editions of this loco and several others are there for the taking. Bring it on! Nidge Edit : Oops!! I'vce just noticed that I've got the D1029 release back to front, they've announced it as per the original spelling and not the later 'corrected' one. I must have had one too many Weetabix this morning Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Revolution Mike Posted January 9, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 9, 2011 I feel like a party pooper by saying that I am some what underwhelmed by the N gauge announcements. For fans of the GWR/WR - great news on the Western and Hall, but for the rest of us it is really re-announcements of existing plans eg 26 and 56. Like another poster I am disappointed that there is still no news on the Pendolino, though I am pleased that Dapol seem to have seen sense by reverting to book sets for the HSTs (presumably including the buffet and TGS). Better news on the wagon front - with the announcement of MJAs and HIAs. The MLA would be nice as well as would the KTA/KQA pocket wagons. Cheers, Mike Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
TangmereTornado Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Well, I'm feeling quite thankful that I didn't plump for, or recieve myself, the Heljan Western for Christmas this year! Maybe ol' Santa Claus had a hint of what was to come and stayed away My dad's a huge Western buff, and has the JLTRT kit of it, and to his eye (and mine) it looks stunning, and just about captures the top window/roof profile just about right. The Heljan model is just too...severe a curve, if that's the right phrase for it. Personally the Heljan one doesnt bother me too much, but it does bug my dad a bit more. We'll both be salivating over this one for a while Have to agree with you Steve K. The Western is one of the most handsome pieces of engineering ever created. It's the case I use when people try to defend the abomination that is the Powerhaul 70...'who cares what it looks like as long as it does the job'...well the Western did its job, and looked handsome in the bargain Anyway, I'm aware I'm veering a little off topic... That's my 2 pence anyway. Definately looking forward to this one. Cheers, Adam Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Premium steam-driven boy Posted January 9, 2011 RMweb Premium Share Posted January 9, 2011 Hi, Now that's a sensible idea - why have I heard no-one suggest that before? D1005 “Western Venturer†BR Blue with full yellow warning panel D1029 “Western Legionaire†BR Maroon with small yellow warning panel D1038 “Western Sovereign†BR Green with small yellow warning panels D1056 “Western Sultan†BR Maroon with full yellow warning panel ...accessory bag... ...etched name and number plates... Of course, if the etched plates were in the accessory bag then there shouldn't be a problem, apart from the usual query: "how do I fix them". ...Like another poster I am disappointed that there is still no news on the Pendolino... With the additional news on the press release: "we are working behind the scenes on even more to be announced later in the year when they are ready for release, and our production facilities in china has been boosted by the addition of a third fully experienced factory to enable us to produce more items and produce them on time" one hopes promised items not covered here will be included during 2011, and this is not a definitive 2011 catalogue B) Regards, Gerry. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
cromptonnut Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 All this talk about renaming and renumbering - why not go back to the practice of providing unnamed/unnumbered examples too so people can make it the loco they want rather than all the hassle of masking etc. I remember an old Hornby 25 that I did that to - and let's face it, if you're good enough of a modeller to want to personalise a loco, you can probably cope with sticking on a couple of numbers and a nameplate on a loco. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted January 9, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 9, 2011 As for the Thousand, I'm keeping my fingers and toes crossed that this incarnation will be the one to lay all the others to rest, we can but hope. Dapol's announcement has taken many of us by surprise and I wonder how far advanced the project is. I know I'm probably jumping the gun a bit here but I'm already knee deep in Western books, sussing out and reminding myself of all the detail and livery variations. It's interesting that Dapol have chosen D1029 with it's 'double N' in the name, IIRC the original plate had just the one N until the second one was added to the backing plates, it was either 1967 or 1969 but I'd need to check. If they get this one right from the start, the number and livery combinations they can release could go on for several years, D1000 alone could be released in four different styles, the possibilities for limited editions of this loco and several others are there for the taking. Bring it on! Nidge I agree that it will be really something if they can get it absolutely right although capturing 'the look' might be slightly different as models of 1000s have tended to be a bit 'beauty in the eye of the beholder' over the years. But if a model captures all of the the subtleties correctly it will truly be something of an achievement which will deserve commercial success as it has always been a popular loco with enthusiasts and was something of a sensation when it first appeared (even 'though it meant the end of the 'Kings'). But I do wonder what is going on with pricing? Kernow have the D63XX at £127.66 and the D10XX, a larger loco, at £110.95 and while I appreciate that the Type 2 has a lot of additional relief detail and hence more tooling work I do find the difference a little odd unless they are expecting (rightly I suppose) the 1000 to sell in much larger numbers - incidentally there is no delivery date forecast for the 1000. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Padishar Creel Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 I am glad that Dapol are progressing with the Maginificent 7, but there are many conflicting announcements and it is sometimes difficult to sort out what's really coming and what's not. I would say let them get on with it, and as I am learning with increasing age, patience is a virtue [hurts like crazy sometimes! :-)] and once the items reach the shops then we can praise or criticise. But the more that Mr Jones announces then later cancels the less the announcements can be taken seriously? I just hope that if the Pendolino is ever released to the market, it is released in such a way that a full length version can be run from the start. I have my doubts that it will ever come, but hope is the last thing to die. Regards, JGP Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Sailor Charon Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 .....although isn't black probably one of the easiest liveries for the enthusiast modeller to undertake themselves? Why not have a go a re-painting one and show us how you get on. I'd find that more interesting than reading about which loco liveries and numbers manufacturers should select. G. Unlined black. Yes. Lined black, on the other hand... with its red and white lines, Not quite so easy. Would you try and paint them, or would you use transfers? (Not that transfers are the easy option...) And yes, I do speak from experience. Then again, I've got some lined green to paint in my future, so... Oh, one question, what's happening with the 2884 (or 38xx as some people insist on calling it)? Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Coach bogie Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Or the 8 wheel tender 2586 that ran with several halls in it's life ??????? Mike Wiltshire thanks Dapol Dave for the clarification that is an expensive year for me I am looking forward to both versions. Iam pleased you are starting with the original Hall which is my personal favourite. I am also pleased to hear aboiut another tender which of course could be the 3,500 gallon (small tender) or the big hawksworth job. Lots of n gauge name plates around for those asking the question see the modelmaster catalogue on ngauge society website. Also in my haste earlier to point out the mistake I failed to congratulate you on a model which is clearly as good if not better than the brit. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Phil Bullock Posted January 9, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 9, 2011 In addition to the 3 currently on the main line, Hinderton and Hagley also operated on the main line in the 70s and 80s. Cheers David Add 6998 Burton Agnes Hall - worked off Didcot in preservation - now theres a train to run those new 00 choc & cream Hornby Hawkesworths in, I think I am correct in saying that definitely the SVR GWR set and also probably the GWS set that were out on the main line in the early 70s would have had them in. Think I am also correct in saying that 6998 also worked off Oxford in Jan 66 after Western steam officially finished on Dec31st 1965 Kind regards Phil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Pennine MC Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 Dapol have just announced “the most accurate and realistic Class 52 ‘Western’ yet manufacturedâ€. I think that Dapol need to learn to walk before they run, there is so much at stake with the D6300 (and it’s successors) that they can’t afford not to get it 100% right, first time. This probably isnt going to be the most popular post in this frothfest, but I have to agree. I'd also point out this post , tucked away in the Heljan DP2 thread, which conveniently quotes two others that I generally agree with How can anybody say it's 'the most accurate and realistic' model yet, at this stage? Weren't similar claims made for the Stove R - particularly the notion of the brakeshoe position being suitable for EM/P4, which is clearly not the case? Not only that (and not that price is an issue, if they're good models), but they are not going to be cheap locos by the standards of other diesels. The signs have been pointing to Dapol doing the NBL 21/29 for a long time but TBH being someone with a longstanding interest in the ScR, I'd hoped Heljan would be more likely. The Dapol ones will probably be similarly priced to the 22 and if they're good, then OK. Similarly with the Western, though I have very little use for such models I love the real ones to bits. But if they're not OK, it'll be the familiar cycle of '1. is it that bad; 2. can I put it right; 3. do I want to pay that price for a model that entails so much work and 4. do I actually want one that much'. I've held off saying this for a long time, but it concerns me a little how so many are pinning their hopes on Dapol to fill the gaps that others can't. To borrow a phrase from a friend, Dapol are raising a lot of expectations at the minute - I would actually like to be able to come back in a few months or a year and see that they're fulfilling them. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
NGuageAmateur Posted January 9, 2011 Share Posted January 9, 2011 I feel like a party pooper by saying that I am some what underwhelmed by the N gauge announcements. Same here - just waiting for them to deliver some of their previous promises now - mainly the Pacer but also the Northern liveried 156 - nothing very new and exciting for me in today's announcements as they seem too focused on Western England That being said I may well be tempted by an EWS class 56 assuming they are better than the poor Farish efforts of yesteryear. Richard. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold The Stationmaster Posted January 9, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 9, 2011 This probably isnt going to be the most popular post in this frothfest, but I have to agree. I'd also point out this post , tucked away in the Heljan DP2 thread, which conveniently quotes two others that I generally agree with How can anybody say it's the most accurate and realistic' model yet, at this stage? Weren't similar claims made for the Stove R - particularly the notion of the brakeshoe position being suitable for EM/P4, which is clearly not the case? Not only that (and not that price is an issue, if they're good models), but they are not going to be cheap locos by the standards of other diesels. The signs have been pointing to Dapol doing the NBL 21/29 for a long time but TBH being someone with a longstanding interest in the ScR, I'd hoped Heljan would be more likely. The Dapol ones will probably be similarly priced to the 22 and if they're good, then OK. Similarly with the Western, though I have very little use for such models I love the real ones to bits, But if they're not OK, it'll be the familiar cycle of '1. is it that bad; 2. can I put it right; 3. do I want to pay that price for a model that entails so much work and 4. do I actually want one that much'. I've held off saying this for a long time, but it concerns me a little how so many are pinning their hopes on Dapol to fill the gaps that others can't. To borrow a phrase from a friend, Dapol are raising a lot of expectations at the minute - I would actually like to be able to come back in a few months or a year and see that they're fulfilling them. I don't argue with a word you say there but I think a couple of other points are relevant. Firstly Kernow are saying on their website regarding the Well Tank 'We have been quite a demanding customer' and that I think is critical with any commissioned model ('Model Rail seems to be ploughing a similar furrow with extensive running trials of the Sentinel) - in other words we will, hopefully, get what a 'critical customer' has sought for us - at their financial risk. In the case of the D63XX we have had Dapol Dave asking extensive questions on here so it might possibly be fairly said that the inclusion of detail in the model is as good as the information RMWeb members could come up with - although the execution of that detail is clearly down to Dapol, as will be the running qualities of the loco. So in certain areas I am prepared - notwithstanding any lack of 'form' - to extend the benefit of the doubt until I've got the goods in my hands and under power to see what has really turned out. As far as the Stove R is concerned here we have the other side of the coin. I don't know if it's fair to 'blame' Hornby Magazine/Mike Wild for the way things have turned out but clearly some disastrous decisions were made - and at some point in the process accepted by a far from critical 'customer'. Fortunately at least the livery situation could be tackled in time (not, it seems, to everyone's satisfaction) so we have avoided some of the nonsense which was at first shipped out of China. But the chassis is an abortion of the first order, which in some ways is not as good as Hornby Dublo managed a generation ago, while what is in many respects a nice body suffers from a number of silly minor errors that betray a lack of research or care in either specification or development or both. All of which combines to undermine brand image although I place the failure to live up to promise firmly at the door of 'Hornby Magazine' and its control, or lack of control, of development. It would be interesting to learn how and why it happened but based on the stupid errors with the livery of the maroon Fruit D I remain to be swayed from my view that Dapol use a 'Friday factory' to produce some of the rolling stock wearing their brand. Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold Downendian Posted January 9, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 9, 2011 <br /><i>I don't argue with a word you say there but I think a couple of other points are relevant.  Firstly Kernow are saying on their website regarding the Well Tank  'We have been quite a demanding customer' and that I think is critical with any commissioned model ('Model Rail seems to be ploughing a similar furrow with extensive running trials of the Sentinel) - in other words we will, hopefully, get what a 'critical customer' has sought for us - at their financial risk.  In the case of the D63XX we have had Dapol Dave asking extensive questions on here so it might possibly be fairly said that the inclusion of detail in the model is as good as the information RMWeb members could come up with - although the execution of that detail is clearly down to Dapol, as will be the running qualities of the loco.  So in certain areas I am prepared - notwithstanding any lack of 'form'  - to extend the benefit of the doubt until I've got the goods in my hands and under power to see what has really turned out.</i><br /><i><br /></i><br /><i>As far as the Stove R is concerned here we have the other side of the coin.  I don't know if it's fair to 'blame' Hornby Magazine/Mike Wild for the way things have turned out but clearly some disastrous decisions were made - and</i><i> at some point in the process</i><i> accepted by a far from critical 'customer'.  Fortunately at least the livery situation could be tackled in time (not, it seems, to everyone's satisfaction) so we have avoided some of the nonsense which was at first shipped out of China.  But the chassis is an abortion of the first order, which in some ways is not as good as Hornby Dublo managed a generation ago, while what is in many respects a nice body suffers from a number of silly minor errors that betray a lack of research or care in either specification or development or both.  All of which combines to undermine brand image although I place the failure to live up to promise firmly at the door of 'Hornby Magazine' and its control, or lack of control, of development.  It would be interesting to learn how and why it happened but based on the stupid errors with the livery of the maroon Fruit D I remain to be swayed from my view that Dapol use a 'Friday factory' to produce some of the rolling stock wearing their brand.</i><br /><br /><br /><br /> I'm thoroughly in agreement with Mike and Ian. The D63XX model is critical to our acceptance of any forthcoming Western. The Western is my favourite diesel class of all time and despite its errors I have several of the Heljan models, but would certainly replace them with a better alternative. The evolution of the Heljan model was much discussed on previous reincarnations of RMweb, and the peaked cap error in the preproduction model was duly pointed out by Pete P and others, no corrective action was taken. To be fair to Dapol they have listened to our concerns during the development the D63XX, I amongst others pointed out that the first (subsequently lost) CADs were a hybrid of the pilot and production scheme NBLs. Corrected versions were duly applied, and we are assuming that the livery errors on the "Warley" 22 will be rectified. It's very important that the forthcoming Dapol diesels are right! Dapol have used the JLTRT CADs of which I think are pretty accurate. The question is what will scaling down bring for the buffer beam valances and the brake rodding. I'm sure many of us would be happy to provide constructive criticism when preproduction models appear. There is a huge amount of literature and photos of the Westerns in service so simple errors such as livery and fittings such as headboard clips/vents need not creep in! I certainly want Dapol succeed, and the duplication we are seeing will (hopefully) further drive up the quality of our models. Neil Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
RMweb Gold D9020 Nimbus Posted January 9, 2011 RMweb Gold Share Posted January 9, 2011 Does this give the Western the record for the most models of any locomotive in 'OO'? I count five: Trix, Hornby, Lima, Heljan and now Dapol; I don't think any other class exceeds 4 (the class 47 might have had Trix made it; they *did* announce it, but as far as I'm aware it was never made). Link to post Share on other sites More sharing options...
Recommended Posts
Archived
This topic is now archived and is closed to further replies.