Class 37, by Accurascale

[ERIC ALLTORQUE]

11 minutes ago, Krieghoff said:

Calm down chaps, it was just a question.....thats all 👍😁

I doubt the sound of any of the class differ much,unless you have animal ears,did some get bigger valves or a big bore exhaust as part of the rebuilds?

[Krieghoff]

12 minutes ago, ERIC ALLTORQUE said:

I doubt the sound of any of the class differ much,unless you have animal ears,did some get bigger valves or a big bore exhaust as part of the rebuilds?

In all fairness Eric, i posed the question as the recent video footage posted just sounded slightly different to others of the same sub class (to me anyway). Who knows, ears are ears 😂😂😂😂

[St. Simon]

1 hour ago, ERIC ALLTORQUE said:

I doubt the sound of any of the class differ much,unless you have animal ears,did some get bigger valves or a big bore exhaust as part of the rebuilds?

 

Hi,

 

Of course, 97301 should have two sets of cab start up sounds, one for conventional AWS Start Up and one for the ETCS Start Up, would be even better if you had a function to switch between the two!

 

Simon

[Shoey]

Not sure if these two have been mentioned over the many pages but a twin pack of these would be nice. Whether it be an exclusive set or not I’d definitely make room for these!

[159220]

On 07/04/2023 at 17:25, McC said:

As per the specifications none of the 37’s announced so far have working fans. Our focus has been on delivering the delayed models and producing more to meet demand before embarking on the retooling required (for the motor mounts ) and changes in prices that may be needed. These 37’s are identically highly specified as run 1, with dual speakers, extensive lighting, built in stay alive etc. 

 

I am aware of the specifications of the run one locomotives, hence my question was following my understanding from published information on RMWeb by Accurascale. It was clear you have been using the delay to ensure a working fan module can be offered, well until your statement above confuses things! 

 

Honestly, I am disappointed that run two shall not include this feature. Yet this is balanced against how I am relieved that I have made the right decision to only buy two locomotives from run one as it appears I could not retro fit a working fan accessory, after all.   

 

Your statement above on needing to tooling for the physical provision of working fans and speculating on price... is confusing when considering, if you review what has been said (by yourself) in this thread:

 

a) the functionality is been embedded in the electronics, 

 

 

b) models have been designed for module fitting,

 

 

c) you have made physical space for the fan module,

 

 

d) You hope to offer a fan module at cost to the run one customer, 

 

 

e) the class 31 is the same price as the class 37, already offering a working fan (even on DCC versions), 

 

 

and f) you have published a statement in July 2022 saying that it is likely future runs of earlier launches will include the technology. 

 

 

Thus, for the sake of clarity here. Are you or are you not going to offer (as previously suggested):

 

1. working fan in run two and beyond, class 37s?

2. a fan module accessory that the customer can fit to the run one locomotives (considering previously Accurascale have said this has been designed in)? 

 

 

 

 

[JamFjord]

10 hours ago, CoBoLoco said:

But can you afjord both? :P

 

Not even close 🤦‍♂️

[Accurascale Fran]

1 hour ago, 159220 said:

 

I am aware of the specifications of the run one locomotives, hence my question was following my understanding from published information on RMWeb by Accurascale. It was clear you have been using the delay to ensure a working fan module can be offered, well until your statement above confuses things! 

 

Honestly, I am disappointed that run two shall not include this feature. Yet this is balanced against how I am relieved that I have made the right decision to only buy two locomotives from run one as it appears I could not retro fit a working fan accessory, after all.   

 

Your statement above on needing to tooling for the physical provision of working fans and speculating on price... is confusing when considering, if you review what has been said (by yourself) in this thread:

 

a) the functionality is been embedded in the electronics, 

 

 

b) models have been designed for module fitting,

 

 

c) you have made physical space for the fan module,

 

 

d) You hope to offer a fan module at cost to the run one customer, 

 

 

e) the class 31 is the same price as the class 37, already offering a working fan (even on DCC versions), 

 

 

and f) you have published a statement in July 2022 saying that it is likely future runs of earlier launches will include the technology. 

 

 

Thus, for the sake of clarity here. Are you or are you not going to offer (as previously suggested):

 

1. working fan in run two and beyond, class 37s?

2. a fan module accessory that the customer can fit to the run one locomotives (considering previously Accurascale have said this has been designed in)? 

 

 

 

 

Hi Seb,

 

To clarify, the tooling cost would be to create the mech housing and the changes to the fan which would be required. The mech itself would also have to be considered. This is additional tooling and capex cost of course which would have to be passed onto the customer. The 31 has the fan as we built it in from the outset (same with the 50) so is being amortised over the life of the model. 
 

As clarified by the specifications of run 2, and the statement in response to you, run 2 does not have a working fan mech. We will look into it in future runs again, but we have not decided yet about committing as we wanted to keep the existing price point. If we decide to include it in run 3 or beyond, will we include it as part of the announcement and make everyone fully aware that it’s included. If that is confirmed, we will look to include it as a retrofit accessory if demand and cost works.

 

I hope this answers your query and I’m sorry that it has led to disappointment for you. 

 

Cheers!

 

Fran

 

 

[KDG]

3 hours ago, Krieghoff said:

In all fairness Eric, i posed the question as the recent video footage posted just sounded slightly different to others of the same sub class (to me anyway). Who knows, ears are ears 😂😂😂😂

Walls have ears. At least, that's what they used to say about their sausages. 

[No Decorum]

12 hours ago, 159220 said:

 

I am aware of the specifications of the run one locomotives, hence my question was following my understanding from published information on RMWeb by Accurascale. It was clear you have been using the delay to ensure a working fan module can be offered, well until your statement above confuses things! 

 

Honestly, I am disappointed that run two shall not include this feature. Yet this is balanced against how I am relieved that I have made the right decision to only buy two locomotives from run one as it appears I could not retro fit a working fan accessory, after all.   

 

Your statement above on needing to tooling for the physical provision of working fans and speculating on price... is confusing when considering, if you review what has been said (by yourself) in this thread:

 

a) the functionality is been embedded in the electronics, 

 

 

b) models have been designed for module fitting,

 

 

c) you have made physical space for the fan module,

 

 

d) You hope to offer a fan module at cost to the run one customer, 

 

 

e) the class 31 is the same price as the class 37, already offering a working fan (even on DCC versions), 

 

 

and f) you have published a statement in July 2022 saying that it is likely future runs of earlier launches will include the technology. 

 

 

Thus, for the sake of clarity here. Are you or are you not going to offer (as previously suggested):

 

1. working fan in run two and beyond, class 37s?

2. a fan module accessory that the customer can fit to the run one locomotives (considering previously Accurascale have said this has been designed in)? 

 

 

 

 

😲 Does Fran get early release for good behaviour?

[55020]

12 hours ago, Accurascale Fran said:

As clarified by the specifications of run 2, and the statement in response to you, run 2 does not have a working fan mech. We will look into it in future runs again, but we have not decided yet about committing as we wanted to keep the existing price point. If we decide to include it in run 3 or beyond, will we include it as part of the announcement and make everyone fully aware that it’s included.

 

The working fans are a bit too much of a gimmick for me.  I'd rather stick to a fantastic looking and sounding model at a price point I am happy to pay.

 

 

Steve

[The Stationmaster]

15 hours ago, ERIC ALLTORQUE said:

I doubt the sound of any of the class differ much,unless you have animal ears,did some get bigger valves or a big bore exhaust as part of the rebuilds?

They definitely sounda bit different if there is a problem on the fuel racks, especially when opened up after idling (the colour of teh smoke also varies due to the presencece of unburnt fuel.  

 

But generally provided everything is working as it should the sound won;t vary from the loco but the siurroundings will alter the way it sounds.  A good example of the latter is where I used to live which was  mile from the railway along a slightly curved valley with housing all the way along it.  The sound of a 37 varied according to both the direction it was travelling and which running line it was on and in some cases we couldn't hear one at all.  We couldn't hear HSTs either and they were accelerating on full power but were onthe Down Main Line.   Rather odd but you could always tell if a 37 was on the Up Relief and when it ran out onto embankment.

[tomparryharry]

I would say it's blessed difficult to perceive the aural differences between different types & batches of locomotives. Adding to that, rain, wind direction, load, driving style all play a part towards the overall picture. 

 

"That's a green class 37, with small yellow panels".

"How can you tell?"

 

"Can't you hear it?"

[E100]

Going somewhat against the grain. I would like a working fan module and am happy to pay for it. Maybe a drop in no solder one with the tabs on the PCB similar to the larger speaker would be a decent shout.

 

Granted this would require a retool and I don’t blame them for not doing it quite yet. All the 37s are going to sell comfortably even with the blue box competition. They can retool the chassis and PCB as a lower priority than brand new locos/stock.

[Albie the plumber]

Must admit I do like the working fan on my Bachy '37 .

The only thing that lets it down is the poor sound reproduction 

That is now  on the to do list .

Looking forward to comparing the two when the A/S version arrives .

 

[RHF9019]

17 hours ago, ERIC ALLTORQUE said:

I doubt the sound of any of the class differ much,unless you have animal ears,did some get bigger valves or a big bore exhaust as part of the rebuilds?

There is a difference between refurbs an non-refurbs. The refurbs have alternators and are fitted with starter motors where as the non-refurbs simply motor the engine over using the generator to start. The refurbs also have electronic traction control so load up slightly differently to the non-refurbs. The non-refurbs are more likely to suffer an overload if not handled correctly. 

[ERIC ALLTORQUE]

1 hour ago, Albie the plumber said:

Must admit I do like the working fan on my Bachy

Does the added draught not overheat your pipe and increase the cost of fueling it.

[Mike Buckner]

On the question of variability of sounds:

I've often thought it is or would be a useful feature on sound decoders to offer several different sound profiles for the same loco.
Nice if you could easily switch between pre-loaded profiles - e.g. send a value to a CV  (1, 2, 3... for Sound Profile 1, Sound Profile 2, Sound Profile 3...)
To some extent, HM7000 may offer this possibility - at a cost of a little complication in having to re-load a profile - and subject to the availability of different sound profiles for the same class of loco.
Perhaps such facilities may improve as things develop.

This would enable one to model the effect of environmental/geographic features altering how the sound travels - as described by Mike the Stationmaster.

One could distinguish working hard or lightly loaded.

Once could enable or disable the repeated full-throttle on/off blasts often heard when a Class 37 lifts a heavy train from a standing start
- whether due to wheel-slip, amps overload, or whatever (I don't know the technical details).

One could model differences between versions of the loco, such as RHF9019 mentions.
For Valenta Lamenters, an HST could be modelled one day as a Valenta, another day as MTU (or even VP185).

One could select slight differences between models simply for added play value (e.g. the hunt frequency at idle), as desired by Krieghoff.

One could have a profile for simulated double headers (from one sound-equipped loco)

And switch between profiles with and without start-up sequences - the latter for those who only like to to watch trains going by, and those with dirty track.

Finally, particularly with some diesels, there can be marked differences between:
- the sound in the cab
- the sound perceived by passengers in a coach within the train
- the sound perceived by trainspotters at a platform or near the railway as a loco passes by or accelerates away

This is particularly noticeable for a Class 68 accelerating under thrash - standing at an adjacent platform, you are physically aware of a series of rapid explosions issuing from the exhaust - in a following vehicle this is much less pronounced.

[Roy Langridge]

Some of those differences are already catered for in today’s offerings. Different loads, start-ups etc. The limit will be the available memory in the sound chips. 
 

Roy

[big jim]

17 hours ago, St. Simon said:

 

Hi,

 

Of course, 97301 should have two sets of cab start up sounds, one for conventional AWS Start Up and one for the ETCS Start Up, would be even better if you had a function to switch between the two!

 

Simon

wouldn’t bother with the ETCS start up, hardly ever worked in that loco (hitachi set up) 

 

1 hour ago, RHF9019 said:

The non-refurbs are more likely to suffer an overload if not handled correctly. 

whereas the only 37 i ever managed to overload (so far) was a refurb, 37608 giving it the beans away from a crew stop at kidsgrove, had to get up to line speed as fast as I could as it was a calibration run on the SGT, a right pain as it would only restart from the engine room button once I’d reset it! 

[Albie the plumber]

Well I like variety in my fleet of '37's which is why I buy at least one example of every decent sound project , and for Growlers,  we are spoilt for choice ! 

For whatever reason , they do often sound different from each other 

Turbo whine being one example 

[Krieghoff]

Fran/ Steve et al

 

i would gladly pay more for a 37 with an operational fan. Im sure that a lot would. There would be the detractors but at the end of the day its an added bit of finesse and ever nearer the prototypical loco......so why not have one👍. you are to be congratulated on the prices of your products chaps and even a small increase wouldn't be too much compared with some other manufacturers prices. 

[GordonC]

Working fans are neither here nor there, they're only visible from a very limited viewing angle and I cant see what all the fuss is about. Is the rotation speed going to be measured and complained about next?

[nightstar.train]

1 hour ago, Krieghoff said:

Fran/ Steve et al

 

i would gladly pay more for a 37 with an operational fan. Im sure that a lot would. There would be the detractors but at the end of the day its an added bit of finesse and ever nearer the prototypical loco......so why not have one👍. you are to be congratulated on the prices of your products chaps and even a small increase wouldn't be too much compared with some other manufacturers prices. 

Whereas I’m of the contrary opinion. Whilst a working fan is nice, if it pushes the 37 up towards the price that the Bachmann one is I’d be less likely to purchase. For me £170/£260 (DCC ready/sound) is a very good price point for the quality we’re expected to get and I have 3 on order, all sound fitted. But for me there’s a big physiological barrier at £200/£300. When locos start touching or breaking that barrier i find it a lot harder to justify their purchase. That’s why I’m still umming and ahhing over getting 50007. Maybe a better option would be to have the plug on the circuit board ready and offer the fan as an extra? 

[toby_tl10]

22 minutes ago, GordonC said:

Working fans are neither here nor there, they're only visible from a very limited viewing angle and I cant see what all the fuss is about. Is the rotation speed going to be measured and complained about next?

"Separately powered working radiator fan with different speed settings"

Quoted from Accurascale Class 50 spec, maybe people will measure it, I don't know.

 

6 minutes ago, nightstar.train said:

Whereas I’m of the contrary opinion. Whilst a working fan is nice, if it pushes the 37 up towards the price that the Bachmann one is I’d be less likely to purchase. For me £170/£260 (DCC ready/sound) is a very good price point for the quality we’re expected to get and I have 3 on order, all sound fitted. But for me there’s a big physiological barrier at £200/£300. When locos start touching or breaking that barrier i find it a lot harder to justify their purchase. That’s why I’m still umming and ahhing over getting 50007. Maybe a better option would be to have the plug on the circuit board ready and offer the fan as an extra? 

I believe that people might be going after the fact that the Class 31 is offered with working fan at £169.99/269.99, so the extra price that a working fan costs might be lower than some of us imagine. If it takes £X to add a working fan to a Class 37, then it would take a similar amount off a Class 31 if the working fan weren't there. Certainly makes me wonder what a Class 31 without working fan would have been priced at.

[45125]

10 hours ago, The Stationmaster said:

They definitely sounda bit different if there is a problem on the fuel racks, especially when opened up after idling (the colour of teh smoke also varies due to the presencece of unburnt fuel.  

 

But generally provided everything is working as it should the sound won;t vary from the loco but the siurroundings will alter the way it sounds.  A good example of the latter is where I used to live which was  mile from the railway along a slightly curved valley with housing all the way along it.  The sound of a 37 varied according to both the direction it was travelling and which running line it was on and in some cases we couldn't hear one at all.  We couldn't hear HSTs either and they were accelerating on full power but were onthe Down Main Line.   Rather odd but you could always tell if a 37 was on the Up Relief and when it ran out onto embankment.

There are several variable with the sound an EE type 3 will make. Fuel rack settings, governor settings, load reg set up, which works set the thing up, refurbed with ETH, refurbed non ETH and how tired the power unit is.

.

 

Al Taylor